AC Refrigerant Leak

[papabeach]

AC stopped coolingl so I took it to the shop for a recharge and they added the fluorescent tracer. AC stopped cooling again and I could see this area where I think it is leaking but not sure. I know nothing about AC. It is summer in Florida and I don't really want to learn how to do this unless it is safe, easy and quick. I am comfortable doing all sorts of other work but never done AC stuff. Looking for advice from the brain trust. I took it to Firestone as it is close to my house and would take it back out of convenience unless there is a recommendation for a specific shop. Thanks in advance.

 

[MStudt]

Looks like you need to replace the Schrader valve on that port. These are very easy to replace, should cost you less than $20, and take less than 20 minutes to replace.

Mike

 

[alumarine]

That's where they would have added the R134a and dye so it might just be residue from that.

Or, it might be leaking from there.

They should have been able to find the leak.

To do it right they need to evacuate the system, pressure check it with nitrogen to find leaks, fix the leaks, pull a vacuum it and then charge it.

If anything needs to be replaced then you should get a new dryer as well.

 

[alumarine]

Looks like you need to replace the Schrader valve on that port. These are very easy to replace, should cost you less than $20, and take less than 20 minutes to replace.

Mike

Won't he lose all the refrigerant?

 

[MStudt]

Won't he lose all the refrigerant?

Well, if his AC quit working after being charged he's already lost enough to not allow the compressor to kick on. In order to do any repair correctly somone will need to drain the system, and start over once the leak is fixed.

Mike

 

[papabeach]

Well, if his AC quit working after being charged he's already lost enough to not allow the compressor to kick on. In order to do any repair correctly somone will need to drain the system, and start over once the leak is fixed.

Mike

Thanks for the info. What I am hearing is that I have to take it to the shop to have the system drained regardless. Is that right?

 

[LittleCaesar]

Thanks for the info. What I am hearing is that I have to take it to the shop to have the system drained regardless. Is that right?

Correct. It is probably just the o ring that is leaking. Humidity wrecks havoc on them (I live in the S.C. Lowcountry at the moment). Replace them around the low pressure port as well as the drier and expansion valve, grab a little PAG 46 for the oil, and then charge it.

 

[HiluxSurf SSR-G]

what are the instances where it is required to replace the dryer? Also, is there a timetable (no. of years) or mileage when to replace the dryer? will it improve cooling efficiency if a bigger dryer is used?

That's where they would have added the R134a and dye so it might just be residue from that.

Or, it might be leaking from there.

They should have been able to find the leak.

To do it right they need to evacuate the system, pressure check it with nitrogen to find leaks, fix the leaks, pull a vacuum it and then charge it.

If anything needs to be replaced then you should get a new dryer as well.

 

[TheDurk]

what are the instances where it is required to replace the dryer? Also, is there a timetable (no. of years) or mileage when to replace the dryer? will it improve cooling efficiency if a bigger dryer is used?

You replace the dryer basically anytime you open the system which means there is a possibility for humidity to enter. You would not replace the dryer on its own. There is no need as long as the system remains sealed. The dryer is adequate for its job as sized. A bigger one would not make the system any MORE dry.

Remember, no dye system will pinpoint a leak in the evaporator, which can't be seen. I invested in a refrigerant detector, and it beats the crap out of working with dye. Even a cheapo will get the job done. The one I have (TIF) has more than doubled in price, but here is a cheapie. Evaporators are a common fail at the age of our trucks. I just had to do mine which was the first time my system has been open since new. Since I was in there, I did the expansion valve and all O-rings out to the firewall connection, plus the dryer, of course. So I have half a new system.



Amazon.com: Elitech HLD-200 Refrigerant Leak Detector Portable Gas Leak Detector Halogen Leak Detector Car HVAC Freon Leak Detector: Automotive

 

[Drew76]

The drier/accumulator will have oil trapped in it so you'll need to add the same amount of new oil, copied from another thread:

Use the following guidelines for replacing compressor oil when changing A/C components:

Compressor.........1.4 oz
Condenser..........1.0 oz
Evaporator.........1.5 oz
Accumulator........1.0 oz
Hoses..............1.0 oz

I just did a similar repair replacing all the components mentioned above last week on my Silverado when the high pressure switch literally blew apart at the seam while my truck was idling and I was standing near it, lost the entire charge in 1 shot.

 

[papabeach]

Quick update. Shop felt that the fluorescent tracer I photographed above was overspray from when it was added last time. They sprayed soapy water on both valves (L/H) and didn't see any leaks...not sure if this is a definitive way to test and/or if a valve can intermittently fail. Regardless, they charged the system back up to keep circulating the dye and said when the system stops cooling a gain to bring it back...next place to look is the evaporator behind the glove box. I would be curious to take a quick look before I take it back to see if I can locate the problem. Do I have to take any of the cooling unit apart to see the evaporator and where the lines come in? Or can I simply remove the glove box and everything is right there. Thanks!

 

[papabeach]

You replace the dryer basically anytime you open the system which means there is a possibility for humidity to enter. You would not replace the dryer on its own. There is no need as long as the system remains sealed. The dryer is adequate for its job as sized. A bigger one would not make the system any MORE dry.

Remember, no dye system will pinpoint a leak in the evaporator, which can't be seen. I invested in a refrigerant detector, and it beats the crap out of working with dye. Even a cheapo will get the job done. The one I have (TIF) has more than doubled in price, but here is a cheapie. Evaporators are a common fail at the age of our trucks. I just had to do mine which was the first time my system has been open since new. Since I was in there, I did the expansion valve and all O-rings out to the firewall connection, plus the dryer, of course. So I have half a new system.



Amazon.com: Elitech HLD-200 Refrigerant Leak Detector Portable Gas Leak Detector Halogen Leak Detector Car HVAC Freon Leak Detector: Automotive

I am guessing this is where I will end up. Thanks for the link to the detector...just ordered it. Will see what happens. If it is the evaporator I might ask you for a parts list and where you sourced them and any other advice you can offer.

 

[LittleCaesar]

I am guessing this is where I will end up. Thanks for the link to the detector...just ordered it. Will see what happens. If it is the evaporator I might ask you for a parts list and where you sourced them and any other advice you can offer.

You want Denso part# 476-0019 for your evaporator. When you remove the evaporator you will need new O rings for the overspray area, so you will be killing two birds with one stone.

If it is indeed the evaporator the leak detector will pick up the refrigerant coming out of the vents, or at least out of the drain tube when the system is on, but definitely right after it is turned off.

Yep, remove the glovebox and move some wires around to get to it. I will let [MENTION=10169]TheDurk[/MENTION] go into more specifics about removal and installation. But thank you lucky stars the whole dash doesn’t need to come out. Just finished helping a friend with such last weekend on a Chevy Duramax. Beer wasn’t enough of a payment...:rockthrow:

But maybe it will hold this time....:shrug:

 

[96RedRunner]

Driers do fail with age. 300k mi mine did, took complete system with it.
New to me 01 got needed condensor and drier at 200k, next in 100k.
$25 for drier beats $1400 for system.

 

[HiLife]

Driers do fail with age. 300k mi mine did, took complete system with it.
New to me 01 got needed condensor and drier at 200k, next in 100k.
$25 for drier beats $1400 for system.

I remember reading something like this. Was it you? I've read that the bag holding the decongestant fail letting the pellets circulate throughout the whole system thus ruining it.
If that was your post...I bought a new drier and plan to replace to avail what you have gone through.

 

[96RedRunner]

I remember reading something like this. Was it you? I've read that the bag holding the decongestant fail letting the pellets circulate throughout the whole system thus ruining it.
If that was your post...I bought a new drier and plan to replace to avail what you have gone through.

Have mentioned it in other posts, not the bag part. It's a hard press formed block of desiccant, the zillion pieces screw the pooch.

 

[TheDurk]

Driers do fail with age. 300k mi mine did, took complete system with it.
New to me 01 got needed condensor and drier at 200k, next in 100k.
$25 for drier beats $1400 for system.

Well, 300k and that was the first time the system was opened? Can you guarantee it was never opened previously and the drier was not replaced? ...because that changes the ballgame. If not, would you really recommend opening it up at 300k and replacing ONLY the receiver dryer? You should have seen my evaporator after 200k. That thing was toxic, as well as leaking. I would think that expansion valves also go bad more frequently with age than dryers.

As to the other, if you replaced the condenser, then the system was leaking, I presume. That also changes the ball game.

In general, I would leave a tight well-functioning A/C alone for as long as it lasts. I junked a 1973 Mercedes in 2004 with 300k. It went to its grave with a perfectly functioning AC. When you open a system, you will let some moisture into the system, you mess with the Shraeders, you mess with O-rings. If I'm going to open a system for just PM, I'm going to do more that just the dryer.

I stand by my suggestion that you really don't want to open a working and tightly sealed system to replace only the receiver dryer. I admit they can fail on their own, but it is not very common if no moisture gets into the system.

 

[96RedRunner]

[MENTION=10169]TheDurk[/MENTION], That alot to answer do my best.
96Red had drier chit the bed, dealer serviced no record of AC problems I purchased at 74k mi, till 300k never opened, nothing added couldn't ask for better life.
I live in the south, so did original owner condensors hold up.
The 01 spent time in Ohio, NC snowbelt condensor showing it's age. A/C cooling noticed site glass bubbles not right at first inspection, spotty maint records.
Changed condensor due to age from salt, drier along with it at 198k.
A fully functioning system at or over 200k you bet I'm doing it for drier alone just adding in the condensor.
Lotta grief and cost because of a $25.00 part.
I have the equipment no cost but parts, my labor's cheap insurance, guess I look at it different.
As for opening systems, no worries, all in how you do it.

I'll do this on any 3rd Gen I own, make em last, not so much on other rides.

 

[TheDurk]

I am guessing this is where I will end up. Thanks for the link to the detector...just ordered it. Will see what happens. If it is the evaporator I might ask you for a parts list and where you sourced them and any other advice you can offer.

Part Number Part Type Price EA Core EA Quantity Total
1999 TOYOTA 4RUNNER 3.4L V6
DENSO 4760019 (476-0019) A/C Evaporator Core $ 101.79 $ 0.00 1 $ 101.79
DENSO 4780500 (478-0500) A/C Receiver Drier / Accumulator $ 10.57 $ 0.00 1 $ 10.57
DENSO 4752005 (475-2005) A/C Expansion Valve $ 16.17 $ 0.00 1 $ 16.17
GPD 1321283 A/C System O-Rings, Seals, & Gasket Kits $ 8.45 $ 0.00 1 $ 8.45
Shipping Ground $ 18.98
Order Total $ 155.96

I happened to have it handy. Rockauto had the best deal at the time. The prices are from two years ago because I just lived with the (very) slow leak until this spring. As to how-to, the FSM is all you need.

http://www.teamtoyota4x4.org/archivio/1996%20to%202002%20Toyota%204Runner%20Repair%20and%20Wiring%20Manuals/techinfo.toyota.com/ileaf/02toyrm/02toypdf/02rmsour/2002/024runne/ac/coouni/remo.pdf

http://www.teamtoyota4x4.org/archivio/1996%20to%202002%20Toyota%204Runner%20Repair%20and%20Wiring%20Manuals/techinfo.toyota.com/ileaf/02toyrm/02toypdf/02rmsour/2002/024runne/ac/coouni/disa.pdf

Tips:

The Denso parts all came with O-rings, so the only ones I needed were for the tubing connections on the firewall. Since the expansion valve and the evaporator both had the O-rings, that left two extra. One of those fit the small tube. So the only one I needed was the large one, which I happened to have a match lying around. I never opened the special for Toyota O-ring set I ordered, but I'm glad I have it.

I got scared by the tubing clamp that requires a special tool. I had wrestled with a BMW version that was a major PIA even with their tool. No sweat here. Just stick a small screwdriver in one of the two little holes on the side and the silly thing flies open.

Good luck.

 

[HiluxSurf SSR-G]

Is the 4Runner evaporator made of two rows? I noticed that there are two pipes at the top that are side by side and both are connected to the high and low pressure lines.