Air Suspension Problem

[BigK75]

Hey Folks:

I took my 2005 4Runner V8 Limited to the stealership due to a problem with the shocks not functioning. They came back today and said the problem is that the right rear spring is collapsed and not attached to the frame. In typical dealership style they want to replace the air pump, compressor and sensors. Total price $3000 after taxes. I don't know much about these suspensions so I am getting another opinion but wanted to ask the forum. Does this sound right? Why does all this stuff have to get replaced just to fix the suspension? I can hear the air suspension pumping the air but the truck does not go up or down.

Is there any aftermarket parts for this or possibly junk yard parts. I cannot afford $3000 to fix especially since they also said the exhaust manifold are warped and the rear pipes are split. They recommend the truck not be driven. Why would split pipes and warped EM lead to a recommendation not to drive.

Any insight on these two items would be super super helpful.

Claude

 

[Red]

Hey Folks:

I took my 2005 4Runner V8 Limited to the stealership due to a problem with the shocks not functioning. They came back today and said the problem is that the right rear spring is collapsed and not attached to the frame. In typical dealership style they want to replace the air pump, compressor and sensors. Total price $3000 after taxes. I don't know much about these suspensions so I am getting another opinion but wanted to ask the forum. Does this sound right? Why does all this stuff have to get replaced just to fix the suspension? I can hear the air suspension pumping the air but the truck does not go up or down.

Is there any aftermarket parts for this or possibly junk yard parts. I cannot afford $3000 to fix especially since they also said the exhaust manifold are warped and the rear pipes are split. They recommend the truck not be driven. Why would split pipes and warped EM lead to a recommendation not to drive.

Any insight on these two items would be super super helpful.

Claude

If you have air suspension, there is no spring in the back, just your shock and an air bag. Did they mean the airbag collapsed? it is an expensive system to maintain which is why I am pulling mine out when it fails and putting in springs.

Cheap fix is pull the air bags out and put in coil springs and if your xreas shocks are toast then pull that system out too and put in bilstein 5100s

being from Ontario your undercarriage is probably pretty corroded, I know a lot of people have problems with the air suspension out there because the sensors get ruined.

 

[Red]

read this thread.

http://www.toyota-4runner.org/4th-gen-t4rs/116134-rebars-build-thread-long-version.html

also this one.

http://www.toyota120.com/forum/showthread.php?t=21326

 

[BigK75]

I thought I should reply to this message just in case someone else has the same problem. I took it to small mechanic who diagnosed the problem as a broken exhaust that cause the tube to the air suspension system to melt. This explains why I could hear the air pump and hissing noise coming from the suspension. Total cost to fix the exhaust and AND tube. $650.

Actually cost to fix the air suspension 100$ plus labour.

I am going to call the dealership and someone is getting yelled at. I also want my 29.99$ diagnostic fee back. I am thinking about calling headdquarters and complaining. What would you guys do?

Claude

 

[Red]

I thought I should reply to this message just in case someone else has the same problem. I took it to small mechanic who diagnosed the problem as a broken exhaust that cause the tube to the air suspension system to melt. This explains why I could hear the air pump and hissing noise coming from the suspension. Total cost to fix the exhaust and AND tube. $650.

Actually cost to fix the air suspension 100$ plus labour.

I am going to call the dealership and someone is getting yelled at. I also want my 29.99$ diagnostic fee back. I am thinking about calling headdquarters and complaining. What would you guys do?

Claude

wow, they obviously didn't look very carefully and tried to soak you with a $3000 repair bill. you'd think they'd check the hoses to the collapsed air bag.

 

[ghostridr]

I thought I should reply to this message just in case someone else has the same problem. I took it to small mechanic who diagnosed the problem as a broken exhaust that cause the tube to the air suspension system to melt. This explains why I could hear the air pump and hissing noise coming from the suspension. Total cost to fix the exhaust and AND tube. $650.

Actually cost to fix the air suspension 100$ plus labour.

I am going to call the dealership and someone is getting yelled at. I also want my 29.99$ diagnostic fee back. I am thinking about calling headdquarters and complaining. What would you guys do?

Claude

There is a reason why they are called "Stealerships", avoid them at all cost unless you like to throw away money or need specific Toyota required repairs or maintenance done.

 

[BlackWorksInc]

I thought I should reply to this message just in case someone else has the same problem. I took it to small mechanic who diagnosed the problem as a broken exhaust that cause the tube to the air suspension system to melt. This explains why I could hear the air pump and hissing noise coming from the suspension. Total cost to fix the exhaust and AND tube. $650.

Actually cost to fix the air suspension 100$ plus labour.

I am going to call the dealership and someone is getting yelled at. I also want my 29.99$ diagnostic fee back. I am thinking about calling headdquarters and complaining. What would you guys do?

Claude

Not that I am defending the Dealership (god knows many of them are poor quality), but they might be right in their diagnostics.

I have seen a LOT of airbag failures in GM vehicles, the pumps fill with water somehow and corrode, or the pumps just fail, lines get damaged, more commonly the boots just dry up and leak. Not too many on Toyotas, but its a similar principle.

Lets say that the air line has melted and the bags collapse, the technician has no clue (assuming here, since you did not tell us how long this has been an issue or how long the problem has persisted) how long the vehicle has been completely flat. The airbags are not designed to be completely deflated and detachment from the frame, damage, and cracking/punctures can and do occur as a result. The other issue is that these are supposed to be closed systems, the pump unit filters out moisture and debris (theoretically... as I said with the GM pumps they seem to somehow generate water...) and you now have an open line in the system where condensation & debris can seep in. Your pump is also running continiously (again assuming here since you didn't say anything about disconnecting and/or disabling the system when you noticed it did not fill up properly) this is very bad for the air pump. They are not designed to cycle 100% of the time and can, will, and do burn out as a result. While your air pump may not be dead yet, it could be on its last legs if its been trying to shove air into the system continiously for hours, days, ect. The sensors are a bit of a long shot... I would say its probably more of less a "while we're at it lets do the rest" mentality that dealerships AND private shops get into, its sort of a catch 22, if they recommend the associated parts as preventative/proactive due to fear that the failure has shortened their life; customer gets angry at the inane cost. If the vehicle fails with similar complaints but due to associated components because of premature failure as an attempt to get a better quote/customer satisfaction; the customer gets angry at the shop and blames them for the failure.

Going by the information you've provided I would have explained it this way;

~Repair/replace needs to be done to the exhuast system (since it was the cause)
~Repair/replace needs to be done to the air bag line (damaged component)
~Recommend customer replace airbag, air compressor, and possibly sensors as precautionary measure due to circumstances.

The problem is that the service writers either don't care or try to "dumb down" the tech's notes and a lot is lost in translation by the time you get the bill. So you might just see "Replace EVERYTHING" rather than a tech's recommendation. I see this ALOT in my own dealership, its gotten better but the complexity of modern cars and the average intelligence of a customer are a very difficult bridge to gap sometimes.

 

[BigK75]

I disagree with you because:
1. I told the dealer the pump is functioning since I can hear it
2. The car is undriveable without the air bag being inflated. It tosses you around non-stop and feels like your going to lose complete control. I took the car in the next day after the problem appeared and let them know that.
3. The pump does not run continuously....it attempts to pump the bag twice and then stops.

Anyway I picked the car up today and everything works fine. They gave me the plastic air tube to show me where it was melted. The cost $100 for the airtube and $40 for installation. I had to replace some of the muffler as well which caused the part to melt in the first place. Total price $650.

Claude