Alignment Measurements

[LEO98]

Just installed the Daystar 2.5/1.5 and had the dealership perform the alignment ($80).

Service tech advised my individual wheel "caster" measurements were slightly off, but in the end equalled out within specification. Tech said it shouldn't affect the performance and/or tire wear and tear. But, if I wanted to correct that problem I would need to replace both LCAs.

Anyone else have this issue? Is it a real issue? Any advice?

Any other after-market LCAs to recommend?

 

[cali_axela]

Were they able to align your rear end too? I recently got new tires installed and figured I'd let them do an alignment too, but they said they were only able to align the front end -- they measured the rear and it's fairly badly out of alignment, but they didn't know how to adjust it... was hoping someone knew.

I've not had good luck with dealer alignments before, I want to find someone who knows how to do a proper alignment on this truck and will take their time and get it exact.

 

[martini]

The reason only the front is aligned is that we have solid rear axles so there's nothing that can be adjusted.

 

[Acidmeld]

After i installed my daystar 2.5/1.5 my it took me more than an hour of canstant adjustment to get it close to spec. (As a tech at a dealer i could spend as much time as i needed to get it right.) My camber ended at a perfect zero and the caster was at 2.4, just inside the tolerance. Thats as close as it gets with that lift. As long as the caster numbers are even you wont have a pull. The only way to get closer is to replace the upper control arm with an adjustable one.

+1 martini, there is no adjustment for the rear axle.

 

[K.C.]

Were they able to align your rear end too? I recently got new tires installed and figured I'd let them do an alignment too, but they said they were only able to align the front end -- they measured the rear and it's fairly badly out of alignment, but they didn't know how to adjust it... was hoping someone knew.

I've not had good luck with dealer alignments before, I want to find someone who knows how to do a proper alignment on this truck and will take their time and get it exact.

There's no Alignment Adjustments in the rear, because we have a solid axle.

 

[NCSCOTT]

+2 for Martini.

My 08 has practicialy the same alignment numbers as you. Like others said, as long as the Caster Numbers are close to each other, you should not have an issue with pull or wear. I've had my DS 2.5/1.5 for 1.5 years now with no issues or increased tire wear.

 

[cali_axela]

They are correct that as long as caster is nearly equal side to side, it won't cause wear problems or anything. However, it does affect steering feel -- I change the caster fairly often on my track car to take advantage of this effect differently depending on the need. I personally like running near the top of the factory range whenever possible though, not the bottom.

Having lower than recommend caster is one thing which can lead to that "floaty" feel in the steering, with less strength in its return-to-center tendencies. Higher caster (in most suspension setups) typically also means more dynamic camber when turning, which on the front obviously is good to have.

 

[JpAdct]

Hi all. I've been looking for answers to my problems, and I came across this thread. I hope to find somebody that can answer my questions. I just installed a Daystar 2.5/1.5 lift this weekend and I added a set of Spidertrax I got from a fellow T4R member. I took it in for alignment and they told me you can't adjust caster on this vehicle. I am pretty well out of specs in caster, but my toe and camber are within range. My camber is a little on the positive end of the spec range which is pushing the tops of my tires out some, but still in spec. My front caster speck range is 2.5 - 4.0 degrees. I'm at 1.2 on left and 1.5 on the right. How does this register with what others are seeing? It drives good, but if it should be in range and it's not, I want to know why and have it corrected. I haven't had it on the interstate or had much highway time yet, but it seems to handle pretty good. Since it drives well, do I leave well enough alone? Or do I take it back and tell them they are full of crap and that the caster CAN be adjusted. I shouldn't have any weird wear on my tires since toe and camber are in spec, but like I mentioned, my caster is out by quite a bit. Thoughts?

 

[gaterose]

They are full of it, I've had my caster adjusted twice, once when I lifted ~1.8" and again when I bumped it up to 2.5".

The first time it was aligned by Big 10 Tires, the second time by Firestone.

Whoever you spoke with may have just not wanted to do it because it is more tedious. Big 10 charged me a lot extra for the caster adjustment but Firestone included it with their lifetime alignment. I noticed it pulling before Big 10 did the caster though, that's the only reason I paid the extra money.

If it tracks straight and doesn't have any problems I'd like to say leave it alone, but on the other hand if it wears tires unevenly you're not going to know it until the tires are ruined. If the place you went to includes the caster adjustment in the price you paid, I would definitely go back and tell them to do it right.

edit - Before deciding against the caster/camber adjustment make sure you drive it on the interstate a bit. I didn't notice the pulling after the first time I let firestone align it for a week, until I got up to 65-70, then I took it back and told them it was pulling; they said they needed to adjust the caster/camber

 

[JpAdct]

Thanks. Do you know what about it is more tedious? I'm wondering if they even know how to adjust the caster. Maybe if somebody could explain it to me, I'd be able to tell them "how" it is actually possible.

I bought a three year package with them, but if they can't align it properly, I need to get my money back.

They are full of it, I've had my caster adjusted twice, once when I lifted ~1.8" and again when I bumped it up to 2.5".

The first time it was aligned by Big 10 Tires, the second time by Firestone.

Whoever you spoke with may have just not wanted to do it because it is more tedious. Big 10 charged me a lot extra for the caster adjustment but Firestone included it with their lifetime alignment. I noticed it pulling before Big 10 did the caster though, that's the only reason I paid the extra money.

If it tracks straight and doesn't have any problems I'd like to say leave it alone, but on the other hand if it wears tires unevenly you're not going to know it until the tires are ruined. If the place you went to includes the caster adjustment in the price you paid, I would definitely go back and tell them to do it right.

edit - Before deciding against the caster/camber adjustment make sure you drive it on the interstate a bit. I didn't notice the pulling after the first time I let firestone align it for a week, until I got up to 65-70, then I took it back and told them it was pulling; they said they needed to adjust the caster/camber

 

[gaterose]

No I honestly don't know what the difference is or why it's more tedious.

If they don't know how to adjust caster then I don't think I'd want to explain it to them. I think I'd just try to get a refund.

 

[Acidmeld]

They didnt do an alignment, they did a toe-in. All they adjusted is the toe. It is a fairly tedious task to adjust the camber/caster since the use they same set of eccentrics on the LCAs. I would go back and get your money back, then go somewhere else with a less lazy tech. These guy clearly dont want to work or worse, dont know how to and to continue having them work on your 4runner for another 3 years would not be a good idea. Preferably go to a dealer with more experience. They will be able to get your caster in the 2.3-2.5 range, camber at -0.1, and toe at 0.03-0.05. Be sure the total camber and caster values are 0.0-0.1 to keep from having a pull or uneven wear. Anything outside of those numbers should not be accepted.

 

[Dougtoms01]

They didnt do an alignment, they did a toe-in. All they adjusted is the toe. It is a fairly tedious task to adjust the camber/caster since the use they same set of eccentrics on the LCAs. I would go back and get your money back, then go somewhere else with a less lazy tech. These guy clearly dont want to work or worse, dont know how to and to continue having them work on your 4runner for another 3 years would not be a good idea. Preferably go to a dealer with more experience. They will be able to get your caster in the 2.3-2.5 range, camber at -0.1, and toe at 0.03-0.05. Be sure the total camber and caster values are 0.0-0.1 to keep from having a pull or uneven wear. Anything outside of those numbers should not be accepted.

Acidmeld,
Can you explain the difference between caster/camber and toe in?
I always thought toe-in and camber were the same. Like if you jack your car up, the botton of the tires will pull inwards. When weight of car is let down, they are about straight or slightly angled in.
Is Caster the wheels being parrellel with each other as in being straight ahead?
Any clarity would be appreciated. Thanks, Doug

Wow, found this after Googling terms. No wonder it's not easily explained.

http://www.ozebiz.com.au/racetech/theory/align.html