Alignment Specs - 2007 w/ bilstein 5100s ome885 & stock UCA

[Marfy]

Hi all,

Just wanted to post up my alignment specs for reference/comment. I am a little concerned about the camber. I may ask them to try to adjust it. Not sure if it will mess with the good caster numbers though.

Truck is a 2007 with Bilstein 5100s all around. I paired those with OME885s up front. The upper UCAs are stock. The lowers are brand new. When installing the lift I did some investigation and discovered the cam bolts were seized. I ended up replacing the complete lower control arms and all cam bolts/nuts/plates etc. I think that helped get the decent caster figures with the stock uppers.

Anyway, just for reference.

 

[morphious]

If it were me I would rather have better camber and let the caster suffer a bit. Right now your tires are like this \ / and you want them a tad bit like this / \ for better handling. Caster won't really affect tire wear like camber and toe will.

 

[Marfy]

Thank you sir. I will check back in with the alignment shop.

 

[jrm]

I think im in the same boat

Right now your tires are like this \ / and you want them a tad bit like this / \ for better handling.

I have 883s on 5100s up front. If the tires are like this \ / would that also suggest that the coils are un or under sprung b/c there's not enough weight to compress/preload the coils?

 

[morphious]

I have 883s on 5100s up front. If the tires are like this \ / would that also suggest that the coils are un or under sprung b/c there's not enough weight to compress/preload the coils?

No not really. Tires being \ /, | |, or / \ when the vehicle is at rest is an alignment thing. The amount of up and down travel of your suspension arms is what is affected by the amount of "under sprung" or pre-load that the coils have. When I had my 5100's @ max with FJ coils, I had very little down travel because of the amount of pre-load that was placed on the coils but with after market UCA's my alignment was spot on with tires like / \. Yes it is true, the more weight added to the vehicle the more the vehicle will fight the pre-load of the coils, thus why people add stiffer coils the more weight they add to the front or back of their vehicles. I hope this makes sense.

 

[RonJR]

Camber does change slightly with suspension travel, because the UCA is shorter than the LCA. The geometry is such that the change between stock height and a 2" lift is almost zero. At full extension camber will decrease about .5 degrees, and at full compression it will decrease somewhat more than 1 degree. (Decrease in camber means the tops of the wheels get closer together).

 

[jrm]

Thanks

The amount of up and down travel of your suspension arms is what is affected by the amount of "under sprung" or pre-load that the coils have. When I had my 5100's @ max with FJ coils, I had very little down travel because of the amount of pre-load that was placed on the coils but with after market UCA's my alignment was spot on with tires like / \. Yes it is true, the more weight added to the vehicle the more the vehicle will fight the pre-load of the coils, thus why people add stiffer coils the more weight they add to the front or back of their vehicles. I hope this makes sense.

I cant figure out why my truck rides like crap after installing this combo. Steering is light and twichy and suspension feel is floaty.

 

[NinjaOne]

I cant figure out why my truck rides like crap after installing this combo. Steering is light and twichy and suspension feel is floaty.

Likely due to insufficient caster. You may need aftermarket UCA's that allow great caster adjustment. Ideally you should have a min of 2° caster, less and it will begin to feel floaty

Also make sure your other suspension parts are in good condition. Worn bushings/balljoints could potentially cause this issue as well, but low caster is more likely.

 

[morphious]

I cant figure out why my truck rides like crap after installing this combo. Steering is light and twichy and suspension feel is floaty.

I agree with [MENTION=119029]NinjaOne[/MENTION] you probably need more caster. What setting are your 5100's at? How much lift did you get from installing this setup? The 883's are suppose to give you about 1" of lift at stock or 0 5100 setting. Camber and Caster is a balance, you can not adjust one without affecting the other, so depending on your height, you may need new UCA's that will add the Caster you lost by lifting in order to get proper Caster and Camber numbers. Here was my alignment when I had 5100's @ max with FJ coils and new eBay uniball arms.

 

[jrm]

my 5100s are set

on the lowest perch and i ended up with about 2" of lift with the 883s. Im rolling on 255/75/17 hankook atms mounted on 15' 5th gen sr5 wheels. Ok looking at my alignment spec sheet and even though my caster range is 2.5 to 4.0, before and after caster is 1.5 -1.1 left and 1.2 - 1.1 right.

If remember right they said this is the best they can do b/c of the lift/tire combo. Is this a valid explanation? I need to go back and have them check this b/c its not even in spec.

 

[morphious]

on the lowest perch and i ended up with about 2" of lift with the 883s. Im rolling on 255/75/17 hankook atms mounted on 15' 5th gen sr5 wheels. You dont think the wheel tire combo is contributing ? I could go back and have them check the alignment. The more i read about the compatibility of the 5100s and OME coils the more it makes me wonder if this suspension combo is not at fault but could be contributing to the problem. I had some new progressive tacoma trd coils ready to go.

I don't think it has anything to do with the wheel / tire combo, I would have it realigned first. Below is my alignment numbers when I first did 5100's @ max w/ FJ coils for 4" front lift with STOCK UCA's. It drove great except for a bit light due to the low caster, but that has since been corrected with new UCA's. With only 2" of lift, I feel you should be able to get close to 2 if not more of caster with stock arms, but I don't know your current alignment numbers.

 

[jrm]

alignment specs..

Ok looking at my alignment spec sheet and even though my caster range is 2.5 to 4.0, before and after caster is 1.5 -1.1 left and 1.2 - 1.1 right.

 

[morphious]

Ok looking at my alignment spec sheet and even though my caster range is 2.5 to 4.0, before and after caster is 1.5 -1.1 left and 1.2 - 1.1 right.

No wonder you are complaining of poor ride quality, your caster is way low. 2.5/2.6-4.0/4.1 is stock alignment specs. On my sheet it says modified because at the time stock specs were unreachable and even with a modified spec they couldn't make it within the range with stock UCA's.

 

[jrm]

Cambers spot on

but the Caster is .9 - 1.2 .Spec is 2.5-4.0. It does ride better than it did though. Wht i dont get is how my 2" 883 lift has thrown the alignment so bad. Unless i got more than 2"s from the 883/5100 combo. Time for UCAs or less lift

 

[morphious]

but the Caster is .9 - 1.2 .Spec is 2.5-4.0. It does ride better than it did though. Wht i dont get is how my 2" 883 lift has thrown the alignment so bad. Unless i got more than 2"s from the 883/5100 combo. Time for UCAs or less lift

Can you attach a pic of your alignment sheet?

 

[jrm]

Sure..

See attached

 

[morphious]

See attached

Looks like they did nothing but a toe and go, neither caster nor camber numbers changed. Adjust the toe to drive straight and forget about the rest. I would take it somewhere else! Did you measure how much lift you got?

 

[neoguri]

Hey OP, did you check back with the alignment shop regarding the your tires are like this \ / yet?

 

[jrm]

Like i said before..

Looks like they did nothing but a toe and go, neither caster nor camber numbers changed. Adjust the toe to drive straight and forget about the rest. I would take it somewhere else! Did you measure how much lift you got?

It drives better than it did. This is the 2nd place ive taken it. I measured 2.25"s (18.75 to ~21~). Ive had the lift on for about a month so this may be its settled measurement.

I figure i can lower it by installing tacoma TRD coils up font and replacing the 895e for 5th gen 4runner coils in back. Or get some UCAs or both...

 

[morphious]

It drives better than it did. This is the 2nd place ive taken it. I measured 2.25"s (18.75 to ~21~). Ive had the lift on for about a month so this may be its settled measurement.

I figure i can lower it by installing tacoma TRD coils up font and replacing the 895e for 5th gen 4runner coils in back. Or get some UCAs or both...

New UCA's will definitely help your caster.