Alingment Issues

[euser]

I just recently (yesterday) put a Toytech Boss 3" lift on the 4Runner. I took it into firestone to get an alignment today. They wrote that the camber/caster are maxed out. The steering wheel also has to be turned a bit to the right now for the vehicle to go straight. I'm not knowledgeable about alignment and steering so I have some questions.

Should the camber and caster be maxed out with an ~3" lift or did they just do a bad job? Is the steering wheel off center because of something they did during the adjustment. Do I need to replace any stock parts because of the lift?

Here she is with the lift:

 

[pauldub]

Was the steering wheel off center before you took it in? Did they give you a printout of the allignment data?

 

[euser]

Was the steering wheel off center before you took it in? Did they give you a printout of the allignment data?

The steering wheel did drive straight with it centered before I had the adjustment done. They didn't give me a sheet with all the stats on the alignment. They just wrote in the notes on receipt paper work that the camber and caster are at max adjustment.

 

[pauldub]

I think you need to go back and talk to them. The steering wheel should be centered when they are done, it's just a matter of adjusting it. As far as caster and camber being at the max, that's not very definitive. You don't know if they ran out of adjustment or if max was enough. They should have provided you with a print out of the before and after measurements for toe, caster and camber. Maybe they saved the data?? In the end you want the vehicle to drive straight on a crowned road and not have excessive tire wear because the toe and camber aren't set right.

 

[MarkamisPrime]

Definitely go back and get a print out.
I seriously doubt your camber is maxed
Your caster yes for sure is
But it has nothing to do with toe and your steering wheel being straight.
Toe directly effects if your steering wheel is straight camber and caster do not.
They most likely noticed caster was maxed so they stopped there and did nothing else.
When you go back and get a print out post it on here and I will tell you exactly what adjustments need to happen for it to be perfect, if any.

 

[euroke23]

Also if it tracked straight pre "alignment" and it doesnt now the f'd up they need to fix it

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[Yoter]

Go to a different Firestone or go back get your money back and go to different mechanic.
Firestone is a franchise and some of the locations suck balls, others suck less balls, with Firestone alignments, if you get the lifetime you can have them mess up your truck for free for as long as you own it! Occasionally by nothing more than mere chance they might get it somewhere close to being aligned or at least not worse than it was when you brought it in.

 

[Mgyver1]

I just recently (yesterday) put a Toytech Boss 3" lift on the 4Runner. I took it into firestone to get an alignment today. They wrote that the camber/caster are maxed out. The steering wheel also has to be turned a bit to the right now for the vehicle to go straight. I'm not knowledgeable about alignment and steering so I have some questions.

Should the camber and caster be maxed out with an ~3" lift or did they just do a bad job? Is the steering wheel off center because of something they did during the adjustment. Do I need to replace any stock parts because of the lift?

Here she is with the lift:

Take it to Hafen's Ok Tire on Lake Mead & Basic in Henderson. There's one guy that does their alignments and he's been doing them forever. He's old school and I think it's all by hand measurement instead of computer so you won't be getting a print out. You'd think it wouldn't be as good but every alignment I've had from them was SPOT ON. I've had my lifted 3rd gen in twice. The first was after the lift, and the second was after Skip's Spring Shop did such a horrible job aligning it after I replaced the ITRs & OTRs. He fixed their terrible alignment and it's been perfect since. Their hard to get in to because I think they only do their alignments one day a week but it's a good price (around $65 I think). I also brought a lowered Tahoe in and he did fantastic on that too.

 

[IBallEngineer]

Yup, your ride is a total loss, just give it to me! I don't have a silver one...yet.

Ok, so these alignment threads always upset me. Why you ask? Well because wheel alignment is very basic easy thing to do, yet so many make it out to be a big mystery. Not to mention the dinosaurs who think their bubble gauge is more accurate than an imaging aligner. Bet they still have rotary phones in their house and use polaroid cameras too. A few notes for you.
#1 All Firestone stores pretty much suck.
#2 Even Firestone can do an alignment if they try.
#3 Not giving you an alignment report and telling you what they did is huge red flag, it screams I don't know what I'm doing so I'll hide my ignorance. That said, you could still ask for the report and then make a decision on what to do.
#4 Crooked steering wheels don't wear tires, but they sure are annoying. By far the most common complaint about alignment techs is they don't center the wheel. This is a skill, not a high tech skill, but a skill none the less.
#5 If you paid for the alignment, they should either center the wheel and give you a report, or give you back your money.
#6 Alignment is spelled with the g before the n.
#7 If you give me a zip code, I'll get a recommendation for a quality alignment shop in the area.
#8 A 3" lift could make Caster correction problematic.
#9 A 3" lift should be within the range of Camber correction on our rigs.
#10 All Firestone stores pretty much suck.
opcorn:

 

[NODNARB01]

If camber eyeballs ok, then it's fine. If the steering returns to center on its own, and it doesn't pull left or right, caster is generally fine. Crooked steering wheel is easy, adjust the tierods equally so they steer the wheels in the direction that the steering wheel is cocked. (Assuming your toe is good at this point) this will cause the tires to turn back straight when you roll forward, and thus, return you steering wheel to center.


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[euser]

Yup, your ride is a total loss, just give it to me! I don't have a silver one...yet.

Ok, so these alignment threads always upset me. Why you ask? Well because wheel alignment is very basic easy thing to do, yet so many make it out to be a big mystery. Not to mention the dinosaurs who think their bubble gauge is more accurate than an imaging aligner. Bet they still have rotary phones in their house and use polaroid cameras too. A few notes for you.
#1 All Firestone stores pretty much suck.
#2 Even Firestone can do an alignment if they try.
#3 Not giving you an alignment report and telling you what they did is huge red flag, it screams I don't know what I'm doing so I'll hide my ignorance. That said, you could still ask for the report and then make a decision on what to do.
#4 Crooked steering wheels don't wear tires, but they sure are annoying. By far the most common complaint about alignment techs is they don't center the wheel. This is a skill, not a high tech skill, but a skill none the less.
#5 If you paid for the alignment, they should either center the wheel and give you a report, or give you back your money.
#6 Alignment is spelled with the g before the n.
#7 If you give me a zip code, I'll get a recommendation for a quality alignment shop in the area.
#8 A 3" lift could make Caster correction problematic.
#9 A 3" lift should be within the range of Camber correction on our rigs.
#10 All Firestone stores pretty much suck.
opcorn:

Yeah I've been hating Firestone more and more lately. I usually only use it because I live on base and it is on base. It makes it easy to drop off the vehicle on a workday. I'll probably just bring it to the Southern Tire Mart tomorrow here in Las Vegas if they can get me in, and I'll tell them Firestone ****ed it away again. I've always been pleased with their service. I'm not even going to bother going back to Firestone at this point. It was only like $70ish for the alignment I believe. I'm just pissed off that I have to hold my steering wheel sideways.

 

[euser]

I brought it into Southern Tire Mart, and they basically said that Firestone screwed up bad. They got it all squared away. They said it has a little radial pull that only new tires will fix. I was thinking of getting Toyo R/Ts.

 

[pauldub]

Cross camber is out of spec. It seems that 0.7 degrees would give you a little too much pull to the left on most roads, especially if you drive in the left lane a lot.

 

[JayRolla]

Cross camber is out of spec. It seems that 0.7 degrees would give you a little too much pull to the left on most roads, especially if you drive in the left lane a lot.

.7* cross caster wont cause much of anything.

 

[JayRolla]

I brought it into Southern Tire Mart, and they basically said that Firestone screwed up bad. They got it all squared away. They said it has a little radial pull that only new tires will fix. I was thinking of getting Toyo R/Ts.

Next time when you get aligned with the new tires ask them to max the caster. You are in the negative and even with a 3" lift they can get you within spec. Usually around 1.2-1.5*.

 

[Yoter]

I brought it into Southern Tire Mart, and they basically said that Firestone screwed up bad. They got it all squared away. They said it has a little radial pull that only new tires will fix. I was thinking of getting Toyo R/Ts.

Get your money back from Firestone.
Even though they are a franchise they still have to answer to their corporate overlord and are afraid of customers being too angry, if you go there and tell them you want a full refund they should hand it right over without much of a fight.

 

[IBallEngineer]

I brought it into Southern Tire Mart, and they basically said that Firestone screwed up bad. They got it all squared away. They said it has a little radial pull that only new tires will fix. I was thinking of getting Toyo R/Ts.

Yeah I'm not digging the whole negative caster readings. I know you may not get up to 3.0 positive, but negative? No thanks.