another battery / starter issue

[riffman12]

I've been searching for people with similar issues, but not seeing what I'm experiencing.

Every now and then I'll go to start my 2000 V6, and the engine will crank a little bit (like half a rotation) and stop - just like the battery is dead. Sometimes it does this 2 or 3 times, then the next key turn it will spin the full 4+ times and the engine will start fine.

I've read about failing starter contacts, but it sounds like that usually results in a click, rather than a partial engine crank.

Is my battery just slowly dying? It just seems so weird that it is only sometimes that it happens.

It also seems to do it more when the car has been sitting for a few hours, or over night.

Anyone experienced this?

 

[Toyotayoda]

Do a home battery test by turning on the headlights while cranking, if they go out completely, or dim significantly(half or more) you need a battery. If the headlights remain fairly strong chances are the starter is the culprit. Of course you did say that it does start so just drive to a parts store and have them test the battery. If it is the starter get one from Napa or get a Denso reman, all others are garbage IMO, and there is a cold weather option for the 5vz basically doesn't matter if you have it or not it will fit.

 

[mtbtim]

I would take [MENTION=148927]Toyotayoda[/MENTION] advice and get your battery and charging system checked at a local auto parts store that will do it for free for you. If the battery and charging system look good, I'd check your battery post connections and ground connections. For the battery posts, remove the cables and clean up the posts on the battery and clean the inside diameter of the cables. If you don't have a battery post and cable cleaner, you can pick one up when you're at the auto parts store. Make sure the ground connections are tight and not corroded. I'm not exactly sure where all the ground locations are but if you follow the cables, you'll figure it out. I'd also check the connection at the starter and make sure that's tight and not corroded.

If you decide the starter might be the culprit, do not buy an aftermarket or remanufactured starter. Just fix your higher quality OEM Denso starter by replacing the contacts and plunger in the solenoid.

Here's a video that could help you out:

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/WV1t5-wcoOI" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

 

[Kanoe]

This actually does sound like starter contacts. Makes you think the battery is dead but then how can it start fine on the 4th try right?

By all means check the easy and obvious first but my corolla starter behaved similarly when needing new contacts.

 

[riffman12]

Thanks guys. I just tried starting the car with the headlights on and I'd say they dimmed to about 50%

Going to get the battery tested to rule that out. I'll also clean all the contacts at the same time

Hoping i don't need to deal with starter contacts!

 

[hang10]

Starter contact replacements are a easy , on the vehicle , job. Just get OE contacts and a plunger from Toyota.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[mtbtim]

Starter contact replacements are a easy , on the vehicle , job. Just get OE contacts and a plunger from Toyota.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

By saying "On the Vehicle", are you suggesting the technique of not removing the starter from the engine bay and working on the solenoid while it's still in the engine bay? If so, I'd have to disagree. If you know how to pull the starter out, it's much easier to replace the contacts and plunger in the solenoid on a work bench instead of the cramped engine bay.

 

[hang10]

By saying "On the Vehicle", are you suggesting the technique of not removing the starter from the engine bay and working on the solenoid while it's still in the engine bay? If so, I'd have to disagree. If you know how to pull the starter out, it's much easier to replace the contacts and plunger in the solenoid on a work bench instead of the cramped engine bay.

I guess we will agree to disagree...... i did it in less then 25 minutes and only 2 beers LOL :beer:

 

[mtbtim]

I guess we will agree to disagree...... i did it in less then 25 minutes and only 2 beers LOL :beer:

25 minutes is pretty good. I imagine your back is probably healthier than mine. I'd rather take a little extra time so I can work on it more comfortably on a work bench than inside the engine bay. Plus, I was filming the repair by myself and it would have been a major hassle to get the camera angle right with the GoPro on my head. But hey, to each his own.

 

[Bigmd]

If its any help I had this issue yesterday. My red top optima died. I put my old Toyota battery back in , it's been sitting for two years. The truck started but not right away. Once I shut it down it would try to crank. I let it sit and it cranked right over only to do the same thing after I shut the truck off. I took a chance and got a new battery. It's all good now.

 

[riffman12]

unfortunately the battery did not help. So I guess the next step is the starter contacts

The strange thing is that the engine does try to crank (i'd say it gets anywhere between one half and 2 rotations) and then it stops. It's not like it just clicks.

after a few goes at this, it cranks perfectly fine and starts.

I've read some things about the starter relay. Any chance it's just that? Or does this still sound like a starter contact issue

Thanks again guys

 

[Kanoe]

Just change the contacts. Parts are cheap. It's a bit of work but then you'll be good to go for another 200,000 miles. Eventually we all have to do this.

 

[IBallEngineer]

Well I disagree with ALL of you!

Auto repair shops exist for a reason. They buy the tools necessary to properly diagnose a problem and solve it in the minimum time. Just because half the time the starter contacts are the problem, it doesn't mean that is the solution ALL the time. If the symptom is the dreaded click click, the odds go up. But that is not the case with the OP's vehicle. He has clearly stated at least twice that the engine turns a few times, then stops. And on successive attempts it will turn and start fine. This isn't a starter contact symptom.

A simple starter draw test and load test could solve this in 10 minutes. If I was prone to guessing, my money would be on the starter, not the contacts. Of course poor connections could also be the problem. So I won't guess.

 

[TheDurk]

Well I disagree with ALL of you!

Auto repair shops exist for a reason. They buy the tools necessary to properly diagnose a problem and solve it in the minimum time. Just because half the time the starter contacts are the problem, it doesn't mean that is the solution ALL the time. If the symptom is the dreaded click click, the odds go up. But that is not the case with the OP's vehicle. He has clearly stated at least twice that the engine turns a few times, then stops. And on successive attempts it will turn and start fine. This isn't a starter contact symptom.

A simple starter draw test and load test could solve this in 10 minutes. If I was prone to guessing, my money would be on the starter, not the contacts. Of course poor connections could also be the problem. So I won't guess.

I don't like to guess either, but I just had the exact same behavior on my 1966 International Tractor with AC Delco starter. Issue turned out to be one of the brush springs was broken so the starter was at half strength. Cost of fix: $4 at NAPA. Load test I did myself and this puppy has no solenoid so starter was only thing left as wiring was all in good shape.

Didn't need no stinkin' auto shop. Opened her up and problem was obvious.

You can get a surprising number of parts for a 50-year old tractor at NAPA.

 

[IBallEngineer]

I don't like to guess either, but I just had the exact same behavior on my 1966 International Tractor with AC Delco starter. Issue turned out to be one of the brush springs was broken so the alt. was at half strength. Cost of fix: $4 at NAPA. Load test I did myself and this puppy has no solenoid so starter was only thing left as wiring was all in good shape.

Didn't need no stinkin' auto shop. Opened her up and problem was obvious.

You can get a surprising number of parts for a 50-year old tractor at NAPA.

I didn't mean to imply no one on the forum can trouble shoot their own problems. I and EVERYONE knows your capability El Durko(formerly Ol' DurRusty). I was reacting to the shotgun approach the OP was getting from the audience. But you proved my point, it wasn't the contacts.

And I KNOW how many bad shops there are out there, I deal with them all the time. But 35 years ago I diagnosed those issues in 10 minutes with a Sun VAT-40(analog baby). These days the testers do their deeds in secret and then spit out a little report, haha. I'd like to say I miss the good old days, but where would I be without mp3's? Uh, what was the question again?

 

[theesotericone]

Well I disagree with ALL of you!

Auto repair shops exist for a reason. They buy the tools necessary to properly diagnose a problem and solve it in the minimum time. Just because half the time the starter contacts are the problem, it doesn't mean that is the solution ALL the time. If the symptom is the dreaded click click, the odds go up. But that is not the case with the OP's vehicle. He has clearly stated at least twice that the engine turns a few times, then stops. And on successive attempts it will turn and start fine. This isn't a starter contact symptom.

A simple starter draw test and load test could solve this in 10 minutes. If I was prone to guessing, my money would be on the starter, not the contacts. Of course poor connections could also be the problem. So I won't guess.

Getting out the multi-meter in cases like this is where to start(pun intended). Can everyone use one correctly? No. Does everyone know what steps to take to diag a starter with one? No. That is the reason why auto repair shops exist. Well that and most people would rather pay someone else to get dirty for them.

As far as that blue part of your quote, you did guess. The two choices you guessed are pretty spot on. I'd lean towards a loose wire somewhere. The OP is getting it to crank a turn or two. Then it stops. Then he is able to fire it up. Wires get hot and when they get hot they get bigger. Getting bigger bridges that loose connection just enough to allow full draw to occur on successive starts.

That's my guess. Who else wants to play. lol

 

[mtbtim]

Getting out the multi-meter in cases like this is where to start(pun intended). Can everyone use one correctly? No. Does everyone know what steps to take to diag a starter with one? No. That is the reason why auto repair shops exist. Well that and most people would rather pay someone else to get dirty for them.

As far as that blue part of your quote, you did guess. The two choices you guessed are pretty spot on. I'd lean towards a loose wire somewhere. The OP is getting it to crank a turn or two. Then it stops. Then he is able to fire it up. Wires get hot and when they get hot they get bigger. Getting bigger bridges that loose connection just enough to allow full draw to occur on successive starts.

That's my guess. Who else wants to play. lol

I also guessed bad connection a while back but since [MENTION=102597]IBallEngineer[/MENTION] said all the previous commenters were wrong, I guess my guess is bad.

Anyway, I hope when the OP figures it out he lets us know what it was.

 

[theesotericone]

I also guessed bad connection a while back but since [MENTION=102597]IBallEngineer[/MENTION] said all the previous commenters were wrong, I guess my guess is bad.

Anyway, I hope when the OP figures it out he lets us know what it was.

Yep. I read that. You also said to have the system checked out. I think iBall was just having a bad day. And I'm that dude who always likes to stir the pot. I mean what else are internet forums for?opcorn:

 

[IBallEngineer]

I also guessed bad connection a while back but since [MENTION=102597]IBallEngineer[/MENTION] said all the previous commenters were wrong, I guess my guess is bad.

Anyway, I hope when the OP figures it out he lets us know what it was.

I guess I made an error! :smashputer:

To be fair I saw the video attached and didn't read your post, I just guessed what it said. I did read your second post where you were supporting removing the starter as opposed to changing contacts in place. I still don't like to guess, but I like your guess better than other guesses, I guess.

 

[Kbuch1]

That's a lot of guesses!