audio replacement saga, Part 03, speakers in headliner, or other unusual locations?

[nusrat]

I'm splitting this into different threads about basically different topics which are all related to replacing my sound system. It's a 2008 Urban Runner, and I've decided to get a single-DIN Kenwood KDC-X702, and probably replace the stock speakers.
Part 03, speakers in headliner, or other unusual locations?
I couldn't find a post about anyone even considering this.
Is there anyone who has tried installing a speaker in (flush-mount) the headliner, at or forward of the driver's head?
Or does anyone know from experience that there is (or is not) a suitable cavity (without interfering with any airbag), even for shallow components?

Or does anyone have any knowledge regarding installing stereo speakers in a dash which never had them -- say, somewhere near the windshield? Without interfering with the passenger airbag?

I'm asking for two reasons:
(1) I almost never have rear passengers, and I'd like to omit the rear-door speakers, and instead mount head-level surround-sound speakers somewhere not too far behind the front seats, roughly the same distance from the driver's ears as the front speakers.
(2) I'm not happy with the stock front locations, which force you to have the woofer and tweeter at different distances from your ears, and with the woofer being partially obstructed in its low stock location.

-- Thanks

P.S. -- This model has a sunroof.

 

[nusrat]

...you can also have someone fiberglass the a pillar to take a dedicated mid range and do 3 way system instead of the 2 way.

I started out intending to use only speakers which Crutchfield lists as geometrically being 'drop-in' replacements for stock, no surface-mounting or cutting into speakers or car. I also eventually decided to restrict the search to bundled components, thinking that they would sonically blend better.

And initially I thought it made more sense to ignore circular woofers for the front and only consider ovals, partly because I thought it would more closely match any acoustical engineering which had been done by Toyota. And when I ignorantly asked a Crutchfield advisor if there's any general reason for me to prefer ovals, he pointed out that an oval would provide more surface area for generating and propelling sound. ("duhhh... why didn't I think of that?").
But since then, before I found DJ's, the only ovals I had heard in stores sounded even worse than the adjacent circular speakers.

This got me "thinking outside the box". Since there's a 3.5-inch opening holding the stock tweeter, I thought maybe I could find a small mid-range to go in that opening, and surface-mount a tweeter elsewhere. But when I pictured now having sound coming from three different distances (and three different vertical levels), I thought of the idea for which I started this sub-thread:
Why not have all the drivers in essentially the same plane, at essentially the same distance, by placing them in the headliner or dashboard?

Anyhow, please tell me more about "fiberglassing" the pillar.
-- Do you mean, creating a bulge in the pillar, to create a cavity for housing a speaker?
-- Is that really necessary, if it's for a speaker which comes with it's own housing?

 

[riceandpho]

I started out intending to use only speakers which Crutchfield lists as geometrically being 'drop-in' replacements for stock, no surface-mounting or cutting into speakers or car. I also eventually decided to restrict the search to bundled components, thinking that they would sonically blend better.

And initially I thought it made more sense to ignore circular woofers for the front and only consider ovals, partly because I thought it would more closely match any acoustical engineering which had been done by Toyota. And when I ignorantly asked a Crutchfield advisor if there's any general reason for me to prefer ovals, he pointed out that an oval would provide more surface area for generating and propelling sound. ("duhhh... why didn't I think of that?").
But since then, before I found DJ's, the only ovals I had heard in stores sounded even worse than the adjacent circular speakers.

This got me "thinking outside the box". Since there's a 3.5-inch opening holding the stock tweeter, I thought maybe I could find a small mid-range to go in that opening, and surface-mount a tweeter elsewhere. But when I pictured now having sound coming from three different distances (and three different vertical levels), I thought of the idea for which I started this sub-thread:
Why not have all the drivers in essentially the same plane, at essentially the same distance, by placing them in the headliner or dashboard?

Anyhow, please tell me more about "fiberglassing" the pillar.
-- Do you mean, creating a bulge in the pillar, to create a cavity for housing a speaker?
-- Is that really necessary, if it's for a speaker which comes with it's own housing?

bulge in the pillar to make a place for the speaker to install and point towards the driver listening area.
[MENTION=117778]lowcel[/MENTION] has a good ass build. that should give you some ideas.
i would do pillars if i had more money. but im good at the moment with my setup.

 

[wc11]

IMHO, return not worth the effort.
Speaker placement problems can be solved with time alignment.
That's what I did.

 

[lowcel]

I’ve had pretty good results with my a-pillars. I’m also running 9’s in my doors. My sound stage is pretty freaking amazing.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[nusrat]

IMHO, return not worth the effort.

Were you referring to my "weird locations" thought, or to fiberglassing the pillars?

 

[nusrat]

I’ve had pretty good results with my a-pillars.

I followed [MENTION=5149]riceandpho[/MENTION]'s tip to your April audio-build thread before I saw that you had posted here -- please see the question I posted for you there.

But now I have another question: rather than me matching-up google pics to the names of all the speakers you listed, can you tell me which are the ones you have on the pillars and in the back corners?

I’m also running 9’s in my doors.

Was the stock door speaker originally 9-inch, or did you enlarge the opening, or is the new speaker partially obstructed?

My sound stage is pretty freaking amazing.

Was there a lot of experimentation done with aiming the pillar speakers?
And are both sides aimed symmetrically, or are they both aimed at the driver?

Also, how much of the music you play is strictly unamplified acoustic, such as orchestras or small acoustic ensembles?

Thanks.

 

[riceandpho]

i think his are aimed to the middle, then you use the time alignment to make the sound where you want. this is where dsp comes to play, even a decent radio will have some time alignment, but not the same. i think your radio has something similar but for serious guys like him and me and others , we do have power to control our tweeter too, this makes active system sound so much better when done right. every speaker channel is measured. you can make the 9 inch fit if you do a little cutting and have the right speaker adapter, also trim the inner door panel a little. ive seen a install where they fit 2 5-1/4 mids on the toyota 6x9 cutout.

 

[wc11]

I’ve had pretty good results with my a-pillars. I’m also running 9’s in my doors. My sound stage is pretty freaking amazing.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

That's a 5th Gen Runner. Bigger A pillar
While the locations are higher, your still higher and will always be off axis

 

[wc11]

Were you referring to my "weird locations" thought, or to fiberglassing the pillars?

Fiberglass