Ball joints: What would you do if this was your front end

03v8raleigh

03v8raleigh

New member
I've read a bunch of threads about ball joints but most are pretty old and not many are about 4th gens.

I took my 03 into a local 4x4 shop to have the front end parts inspected since when it was at the dealer they noted that the LBJ boots were ripped, but they didn't bother checking the play in the joints. The 4x4 shop noted that there was play in the upper and lower ball joints on both sides, and driver side inner tie rod was worn. They doubted it could be aligned well as is. (Actually just had it aligned at the dealer, where they get the camber to .4 degrees and caster to 2 degrees. Not ideal, and there is a lot of wear on the outside edges of the front tires.) They quoted me $1000 to replace it all with Moog parts. This includes an alignment. This seems really expensive considering the joints cost $25 each. The rest is labor.

My car has 150k on it, with a 3/2 ReadyLift spacer lift on Bilsteins and stock springs, which I think were added around 100k miles by previous owner. So I'm sure that has causes excess stress on these joints and caused them to wear. The truck drives tight other than low caster causing twitchy steering on highway. ( I was thinking of adding aftermarket UCA's in the future when I have money to throw away to fix that.) There is no squeeling, grinding, or clunking at all.

I was scared into checking my LBJs after seeing horror stories of wheels ripping off of 3rd gens. But from what I understand, that isn't possible on the 4th gens..? The LBJ is oriented the opposite way so that it won't rip off if it fails?

If this was your truck, would you:
- Drive it as is because it won't fail catastrophicly
- replace everything for peace of mind, spending $1000
- buy the parts on Amazon and install it yourself
- install OEM new full control arms like Toyota recommends, because you don't trust aftermarket ball joints
- go ahead and put on aftermarket UCAs while it's apart anyways, for another $650

I want this car to get me another 50,000 miles safety. It probably won't be wheeled hard very often but it will see off-road use, and I'd prefer to not worry about things breaking when I do wheel it. Thanks for your input, hopefully my question is clear
 
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They completely reversed the design of the ball joint on the 4th gen. They compress under load instead of putting apart.

My ball joints were splitting but as tight as they were on day 1 with 160k miles.
 
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I'd use OEM parts, I would not use Moog in any case after hearing too many bad experiences but I have no personal experience to support this.

The only non-OEM parts on my truck is the OME suspension and at 207,000 miles I have no worries about parts failing even though I wheel regularly.
 
CXS said:
I'd use OEM parts, I would not use Moog in any case after hearing too many bad experiences but I have no personal experience to support this.

The only non-OEM parts on my truck is the OME suspension and at 207,000 miles I have no worries about parts failing even though I wheel regularly.
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I would generally want OEM as well. The problem is that you cannot get oem ball joints, you can only get the entire control arm , which cost $350 EACH from Toyota.
 
If I were you right now, I would replace with entire new arms. If your balljoints are worn, your bushings are either worn or getting close. I would do the labor myself and would prob. still be under the $1k quote.

New arms would get you new balljoints and new bushings, they are fairly easy to replace.


I've used MOOG in the past and haven't had any issues, but still would prefer OEM
 
NinjaOne said:
If I were you right now, I would replace with entire new arms. If your balljoints are worn, your bushings are either worn or getting close. I would do the labor myself and would prob. still be under the $1k quote.

New arms would get you new balljoints and new bushings, they are fairly easy to replace.


I've used MOOG in the past and haven't had any issues, but still would prefer OEM
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I was thinking the same things about the bushings. If I replace both lower control arms, that's something I could probably just bolt in myself right? Easier than pressing ball joints in?
 
03v8raleigh said:
I was thinking the same things about the bushings. If I replace both lower control arms, that's something I could probably just bolt in myself right? Easier than pressing ball joints in?
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Heck of a lot easier. Upper can be done in twenty minutes each, lower takes a little longer


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I would hope they realize that a lot of Toyota ball joints are spring loaded so when they are unloaded they will feel "loose" if you are not aware of that...
 
Answer depends on what you do with the truck. Is it just a pavement daily driver? Or do you wheel? How far from help are you likely to be when you break down?

I prevantatively spent $1500 this year replacing front end parts because I wheel occasionally and didn't want to deal with the possibility of trail-side repair in the middle of nowhere. Nothing was broken or showing excessive wear, but I was at 135k miles with half of that lifted. So I replaced with OEM CVs, LR UCAs (they gave me free replacements because they updated the upper ball joint design) and Moog LBJs.

I wheel 4-5 times a year, with 2 of those trips being 1000+ mile overlanding trips in the far reaches of Maine where I don't want to be broken down in the middle of winter.
 
https://raleigh.craigslist.org/pts/5886786546.htm

I only use moog parts and I have had zero issues with them at 178000. What I would do is contact the guy in this craigslist post and offer him $100 for his UCAs and then I would put new moog lbjs and tierods in and have the allignment checked. You parts are likely fine. But are 13 years old and will be ready for replacement. The lbjs are difficult but not impossible. I just did mine. Oh and id tell that 4x4 shop to go jump in alake.


edit: I have done ucas and lbjs. At 178k my lca bushings are not giving me any trouble. My rig does not go offroad and I think a Lot of failures happen from this severe use. Lca bushings are aweful to replace.

However if you do decide to replace your lcas. Please let me know. I bought a set of lca bushings a while ago and if I I ahad a dead set of arms to slowly work with I would love to give this a shot.
 
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I need to replace my ucas too to have my camber in spec. I found adjustable control arms on amazon that add +/- 2 degrees camber and 0-+4 degrees caster that should get everything back to spec. I desperately need this and it'll solve your issues as well. Going to pull the plug soon and it has great reviews and it's designed for people like you and I. Idk if I'll do the labor myself, if I even have the right tools for it but if you know a good local mechanic that can do it I would try that vs taking it into a high end garage. Some people will do this right out of their driveway.

Anyways, here's the link if you'd like: Specialty Products Company 25480 Upper Control Arm for Toyota 4Runner and FJ - Pair https://www.amazon.com/dp/B001DBTTSO/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_api_z1WnybHC9WCX8


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I installed those SPC adjustable UCA's last summer. Went in easily, about 1 hour per side doing it by myself. The hardest part was working the long (must be darn near a foot long) bolt through the bushings by myself, but with a little ingenuity I got it done.

It's still early to assess the long-term reliability, but they certainly solved my caster issues and the vehicle drives and tracks great now. The UBJ's do have a grease fitting which is supposed to help with the service life of the ball joint.
 
Stuffman said:
did not know that. Thanks!
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There's a "feel" you have to learn playing with them so you notice the difference between just normal spring loaded play and excessive. It threw me off the first couple times when I had a more experienced mechanic point it out to me.
 
RonJR said:
I installed those SPC adjustable UCA's last summer. Went in easily, about 1 hour per side doing it by myself. The hardest part was working the long (must be darn near a foot long) bolt through the bushings by myself, but with a little ingenuity I got it done.

It's still early to assess the long-term reliability, but they certainly solved my caster issues and the vehicle drives and tracks great now. The UBJ's do have a grease fitting which is supposed to help with the service life of the ball joint.
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Good to know. I'll be buying those probably tomorrow if the price changes at all due to BF, but I do need them soon as I am experiencing a horrible toe with my wheels throwing all my specs off. So I am hoping with these new assemblies it'll allow me to have everything aligned correctly and properly.

And you've done this yourself? I've never taken a project on like this, and I am worried about getting stuck and not having a vehicle to work with. How hard is this process and what special tools do you need? For a first timer


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