Best tire for Sand / Desert?

[Bumbo]

The desert season is slowly coming up and its also time to start considering my next tire purchase...

Base line info:
16" Rim
2" Lift

My original plan was to replace my current tire with a BFG AT (KO2) in a 265/75-16 (31.6")

It seems like a really safe "do-it-all" choice, but I am considering getting a 2nd set of rims which opens me up to more options, like going with an Mud Terrain dedicated for off-road use.

I started looking at the BFG KM2, possibly in a larger size like a 255/85-16 (33.3")

1st question is what actually does best in the sand? This year we will be doing some trails which are very sand heavy.

2nd Whats the biggest tire I should consider buying that isn't going to give me trouble.

If I go with a 2nd set of rims I would like to decide on the tire first (Brand, AT/MT), just in case I need to go from a 16" to a 17" rim.

3rd. Aside from my desert trips with a lot of sand, I will be doing a lot of trail driving, hardpack with some light to medium rock crawling... What tire would you recommend?

A part of me is hoping the KO2 is an amazing sand tire, giving me an excuse to save a few bucks and not have to move to an MT and a 2nd set of rims...

Any insight is greatly appreciated.

 

[970mtnrunner]

Sand is one condition where you are going to want a wider tire for extra flotation. I used to be a desert rat and spent a lot of time in the dunes. I would go for a 285 width minimum, or even 295 or 305 if they will fit on your ride.
I had 285/75/16 on an 05 Tacoma and went to Dumont Dunes and ripped around all over the place. Following year, I had switched to 255/85/16 and had a lot more issues getting and keeping moving in the sand.
The biggest key to sand with any type of tire is drop your tire pressure way down. I could go up dunes in 2wd at 14 psi, and not get anywhere and 30 psi in 4wd.
General Grabbers seem to be pretty popular with the desert set-ups now.

 

[Bumbo]

I figure I post this here for reference... I put this together for myself since its getting a bit confusing... hopefully it helps others too... the data collected from the BFG website only as my main focus in tires in the KO2 and KM2, but I am still open to other options...

BFG AT KO2
255/75/17 32.1"
255/70/17 31.1"
255/70/16 30.1"

265/75/16 31.6"
265/70/17 31.6"

275/70/16 31.2
275/70/17 32.2"

285/75/16 32.8"



BFG MT KM2
255/75/17 32.1"
255/85/16 33.3"
255/80/17 33.1
255/70/16 30.1"

265/75/16 31.6"
265/70/17 31.6"

285/75/16 32.8"

 

[Bumbo]

Sand is one condition where you are going to want a wider tire for extra flotation. I used to be a desert rat and spent a lot of time in the dunes. I would go for a 285 width minimum, or even 295 or 305 if they will fit on your ride.
I had 285/75/16 on an 05 Tacoma and went to Dumont Dunes and ripped around all over the place. Following year, I had switched to 255/85/16 and had a lot more issues getting and keeping moving in the sand.
The biggest key to sand with any type of tire is drop your tire pressure way down. I could go up dunes in 2wd at 14 psi, and not get anywhere and 30 psi in 4wd.
General Grabbers seem to be pretty popular with the desert set-ups now.

I had a feeling flotation would come up... i should have known the answer already because I dune on ATVs and flotation is the name of the game.

Since sand isn't the only thing I do, I didn't know if going that wide would be a smart move... The 255 seems best for trail and rock, but I think 265 would be a good compromise "do it all"

285 / 295 I feel I would have rubbing issues... and poor performance for everything else, road, trail, rocks...

If i had cash for a 3rd set of rims to dedicate to desert sand driving I would go wide, but I dont think its the answer as its only 10-20% of my off-road / on-road usage assuming I stick with only 1 set of rims/tires.

 

[Bumbo]

Another good question... at what point does the tire diameter become an issue with gearing?

What should I consider my max size to be if I dont want to change the stock gearing on my 2004 SR5 V6 4x4?

Can I get away with a 32"-33" tire? I really dont want to feel like I am lugging the motor... and I dont have cash to re-gear right now, because I know ill want lockers if I have to go down that road...

 

[970mtnrunner]

I think your first choice of 265/75 is your best all around bet.

If you're already using a LT rated tire then you should hardly notice much difference in going up to 32's in terms of acceleration and mpg. If you have P rated tires it will be a little more noticeable, and I will guess that you lose 2mpg.
285/75 or 255/85 will most likely not fit with just a 2" lift without a lot of rubbing issues, and those will definitely have a noticeable impact on acceleration and mpg. I lost 2.5 mpg going from stock size to 285/75's on my Tacoma, and another 1 mpg on top of that with 255/85's, but they looked and performed amazing. Even with that, I never felt like it needed to be regeared, you will get used to it quickly. Its the weight of the bigger tire and heavier aftermarket wheels that kill the gas mileage. Each tire/wheel was 28lbs heavier than stock.
I have a V8 limited 4x4 now and can tell a difference between the 265/70/17 P rated winter tires and the 255/75/17 LT C rated mud terrains in the summer, and about to pull the trigger on some 255/80's.

 

[gm350reratliff]

Floatation is key in the sand. So a 285 would probably do a little better than a 255 but both will do ok if you drop the pressure enough. Aired down, both my 255 ST Maxx and my 265 KO2's do good in the sand.

33" would be the tallest tire I would want to run without re-gearing. I can feel a difference going from 265's to my 255's but it's not too extreme. That's also going from a Load Range C to a Load Range E tire which is also heavier. It's not too bad though. I can still comfortably cruise on the freeway and tow without issue. 33" is also the absolute maximum that will fit in the stock spare tire location, and even that was/is kind of a chore to get it to sit right up under there. It's also the biggest tire that will still stuff in the rear wheel wells with just a very slight rub.

Personally, I like the tall, skinny look but it's not for everybody. The tall, skinny profile also works well for what I use it for.

 

[dagen]

I hit up the desert a decent amount and while we don't do tons of dune riding there is fair share of soft sand. I am running 265/75R17 Cooper AT3's. I usually air down to about 20psi and we haven't had any issues getting stuck or anything. We ran this setup at Pismo dunes also without any issues.

I imagine that you'll get even more traction aired down even farther.

 

[Bumbo]

Rims have been purchased...

I found a set of (5) 17" rims in really good condition and ended up jumping on that...

These are the FJ 17x7.5" wheels so I am basically narrowing it down to a couple options now...

First pick is now...
255/75-17 (BFG AT or MT) (32.1")

or a more conservative:
265/70-17 (31.6") which I see is a very common size around here on this forum, but might be a little better in the sand.

I am still looking at the KO2 in the 275/70-17 size (32.2"), but I really dont know if thats the best choice for me.

Most wheeling and Expedition builds favor the 255, and it seems like the only thing the 275 would excel in is sand. That said, it does look nice, but anesthetics is very much a secondary thing for me... I also dont buy speakers because of they way they look...

One last thing was I was under the impression these rims were 4.5" in backspacing, but after measuring it looks like 4.875".

My stock rims are about 5.18" so its only about 0.31" wider track on each side... I was actually hoping for more. Not sure if I should sell the rims, I do like them, but I dont really want to get spacers either.

Anyone have pictures of these rims on a 4th Gen?

 

[S p a r k y]

Cooper st maxx and AT3 come in 275/70 as well

 

[NinjaOne]

I found a set of (5) 17" rims in really good condition and ended up jumping on that...

These are the FJ 17x7.5" wheels so I am basically narrowing it down to a couple options now...

First pick is now...
255/75-17 (BFG AT or MT) (32.1")

or a more conservative:
265/70-17 (31.6") which I see is a very common size around here on this forum, but might be a little better in the sand.

I am still looking at the KO2 in the 275/70-17 size (32.2"), but I really dont know if thats the best choice for me.

Most wheeling and Expedition builds favor the 255, and it seems like the only thing the 275 would excel in is sand. That said, it does look nice, but anesthetics is very much a secondary thing for me... I also dont buy speakers because of they way they look...

One last thing was I was under the impression these rims were 4.5" in backspacing, but after measuring it looks like 4.875".

My stock rims are about 5.18" so its only about 0.31" wider track on each side... I was actually hoping for more. Not sure if I should sell the rims, I do like them, but I dont really want to get spacers either.

Anyone have pictures of these rims on a 4th Gen?

I'm running those FJ wheels.
http://www.toyota-4runner.org/4th-g...-4runner-picture-gallery-342.html#post2452461
http://www.toyota-4runner.org/4th-g...st-offset-get-rid-spidertrax.html#post2448795
http://www.toyota-4runner.org/4th-g...st-offset-get-rid-spidertrax.html#post2448568

I'm also running Falken Wildpeak AT3W which run slightly larger than the 31.6" (31.7) E-rated run 31.9"

 

[zidaro]

Sand is a BLAST!
Ive been during in Glamis my whole life, 3wheelers back in the day, and then motos. But Ive always had streetable Toyotas with me.
Sand is its own beast, you've got 2 things you better have one of them and the one have decides everything.
Power or Flotation --- and i mean big power that can spin a big paddle tire.
Im going to assume you are driving a 4runner, since your here. You never said.
Ill also assume you've got a stock one, power wise. So a v6 or v8. The v8 would barely have enough power to spin a set of rear paddles.
So there ya have it, easy. You require flotation. And driving skill. Finesse in the sand. And low tire pressure is your best friend. I run 8psi in the dunes, no donuts allowed cuz i would peel a bead, but you can damn near climb anything if you took the right path.

Now- you have a 4runner. Fit the biggest tire you can based on your setup. Sounds like your stockish lift, so tire diameter and power issues will not come into play, 33"s would be your max if you trimmed fenders and body mounts a lot. Decide your max based on your wheels and lift, then sit down with a tire calculator and hash out the nuances.

You just bought stocker 17"s. Good thing is 17s are way more popular than 16s so choices open up big time. Your going to have to run spacers to run 275s. I ran 1" spacers on my wifes 5th gen. and 275s and it was perfect. No rubbing once the fender liners were cleaned up a little. Spacers suck, yes. But not as much as stock offset wheels. Necessary evils work together.

Heres the big one i haven't read on this thread yet.
Mud Tires suck in the sand!!! period. They act like a paddle and dig down, not at all what you want unless you have BIG power.
AT tires are WAY better at flotation. period.
AT is also going to behave better on the highway, do just fine in the rocks (some KOH guys run an AT version tread pattern), and be much better in the snow.
If your looking for sidewall protection- that is tire specific, find a set with thicker sidewalls.

Im a fan of the newer Hybrid AT tires that have come out recently. There are now a lot of them. Each has its own character, but all are better than our choices 10years ago.
GY Duratrac, BFG AT KO2, MT ATZ P3, Cooper ATP or Zeon, Falken Wildpeaks, Toyo, General- they all have them

all just my opinions- Tires are always a tough choice. Good thing they wear out so quick- if you make a bad choice it doesn't stay with you too long.

 

[T5RUNNER]

Around here, General Red Labels and Nitto Dune Grapplers seem to be the most popular choices. You definitely don't want a mud terrain, they have to much void space.

 

[Inv4drZm]

This is what 33's looked like on my truck when it was just leveled in the front:
If I did a little more trimming than the minimal amount I did, it would have no street rub at all.

My vote is for 33's.

 

[Bumbo]

Around here, General Red Labels and Nitto Dune Grapplers seem to be the most popular choices. You definitely don't want a mud terrain, they have to much void space.

Interesting... i thought the MT would make a good sand tire... that said, I see a lot of those Baja guys running the KO2 as well... perhaps thats why.

 

[Rodtheviking]

Around here, General Red Labels and Nitto Dune Grapplers seem to be the most popular choices. You definitely don't want a mud terrain, they have to much void space.

I like the General Grabber Red Labels too, awesome tire for desert use.

 

[Bumbo]

And we are done!

Thanks everyone for the help... I was able to find some deals and ended up getting everything I needed and more.

In addition to the (5) FJ rims which ended up working great, I picked up (7) used but literally in like new condition BFG KM M/T tires in 255/75-17.

I am really happy with the size, glad I went this route.

I still need to finish mounting tires to the rims, but here are some shots...

I even took the time to check clearances at full lock. This rim having a little more backspacing worked out just great.