Brake Bleeding Issue!!!

[mystereons41]

Hi all, really hoping you guys can help because now my car doesn’t have proper brakes and the truck needs a new axle seal, so kind of in a bad situation. I just replaced the whole brake booster assembly and I am having the worst time figuring out how to bleed the brakes. I’m
following the instructions in the attached. I did Step 2, which is bleed the brake booster, and it turned off after 10 seconds like it was supposed to. Now I’ve moved onto Step 3, which is bleeding the brake lines. The instructions say to put the ignition in the “on” position. Is it normal when you depress the brake pedal (just before the bleeder screw is opened), for the brake booster pump to run?? Right now even with all bleeder screws closed, I can’t press the brakes without the pump coming on. The pump is pretty loud. I bought it used on eBay, and wondering if the pump is bad or just has air in it? How often does it normally run in the normal operation of the car? Because I don’t remember hearing anything that loud normally. Secondly, while I’m holding the pedal down and the other person opens the bleed screw, periodically the ABS/TRAC/VSC comes on while the pump is running and there’s a long beep and it sounds like some other mechanical thing is coming on. Anyone know what that is?? I’m not sure what I’m doing wrong or if the things that are happening are normal. Please help!!!

 

[originalg00kster]

Hey so I was having issues bleeding my brakes as well. Come to find out I just needed to have the car on! Also that abs/vsc beeping is just happening when you open the brake bleeder valve. It did the same thing for me but went away when I closed the valve.

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[mystereons41]

Ok so after doing some reading, it seems like the front brakes are supposed to be bled the traditional way by pumping the brake pedal, and the rear you just hold down the brake pedal, open the valve, and let the booster pump do the work for you. The rear brakes seem to be bleeding normally. The pump comes on and a lot of fluid comes out. The issue is with the front. The booster pump comes on when bleeding the front, which I thought wasn’t supposed to happen. Is that normal? Also, very little fluid is coming out either side of the front. When the front bleeder valves are opened, the pedal slowly falls to the floor. Is that normal? Am I supposed to follow the pedal to the floor? That’s what I’ve been doing but worried it could damage the master cylinder?

 

[originalg00kster]

Ok so after doing some reading, it seems like the front brakes are supposed to be bled the traditional way by pumping the brake pedal, and the rear you just hold down the brake pedal, open the valve, and let the booster pump do the work for you. The rear brakes seem to be bleeding normally. The pump comes on and a lot of fluid comes out. The issue is with the front. The booster pump comes on when bleeding the front, which I thought wasn’t supposed to happen. Is that normal? Also, very little fluid is coming out either side of the front. When the front bleeder valves are opened, the pedal slowly falls to the floor. Is that normal? Am I supposed to follow the pedal to the floor? That’s what I’ve been doing but worried it could damage the master cylinder?

It was opposite for me. The fronts were pushing fluid out but the rears weren't until I turned the car on. When I had the car on, I was able to bleed all 4 with no issues. I just did the normal brake bleeding procedure on all 4.


I believe the brake pedal depressing to the floor is normal when you open the brake bleeder valves. That's what happened when I did it as well.

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[mystereons41]

It was opposite for me. The fronts were pushing fluid out but the rears weren't until I turned the car on. When I had the car on, I was able to bleed all 4 with no issues. I just did the normal brake bleeding procedure on all 4.


I believe the brake pedal depressing to the floor is normal when you open the brake bleeder valves. That's what happened when I did it as well.

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Did you hear your brake booster pump come on? I hear a loud motor sound when I press the brakes. Anyone know what the deal is? Is the booster pump bad or maybe just has air in it?

 

[mystereons41]

We’re having more luck bleeding the front brakes using one of those hand vacuum pumps. We also cracked the bleed valve open more than we were originally. There’s a ton of tiny bubbles. When the liquid comes through the tube, should it fill the tube completely, or is it normal for it to only be half full? We’ve already gone though about a half gallon of brake fluid doing the front brakes. Still a good amount of small bubbles and it never completely fills the tube. On the bright side, the pump only runs for about 1-2 seconds with the ignition on and only turns on every other time the brake pedal is pressed. It also seems quieter. So I guess we’ll just keep doing what we’re doing and hope it improves further! If anyone knows about whether the tube should be filled completely, let me know.

 

[montijo505]

We’re having more luck bleeding the front brakes using one of those hand vacuum pumps. We also cracked the bleed valve open more than we were originally. There’s a ton of tiny bubbles. When the liquid comes through the tube, should it fill the tube completely, or is it normal for it to only be half full? We’ve already gone though about a half gallon of brake fluid doing the front brakes. Still a good amount of small bubbles and it never completely fills the tube. On the bright side, the pump only runs for about 1-2 seconds with the ignition on and only turns on every other time the brake pedal is pressed. It also seems quieter. So I guess we’ll just keep doing what we’re doing and hope it improves further! If anyone knows about whether the tube should be filled completely, let me know.

When I did mine I remember being disappointed with the amount that came out when I got to the fronts compared to the rears. The rears really gush and the fronts are like not even half the volume from what I recall.

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[mystereons41]

When I did mine I remember being disappointed with the amount that came out when I got to the fronts compared to the rears. The rears really gush and the fronts are like not even half the volume from what I recall.

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Ok thanks! That makes me feel like we’re on the right track. The fluid definitely came out the back much faster for us also. I guess it’s because the booster pump is assisting it.

 

[gaber6]

You may have been pulling air from around the bleeder if you unscrewed it too much. Shouldn't need 1/2 gallon but you sure got a good flush.

 

[mystereons41]

You may have been pulling air from around the bleeder if you unscrewed it too much. Shouldn't need 1/2 gallon but you sure got a good flush.

Yeah def got a good flush! Haha. I was wondering if maybe I was letting air around the bleeder screw.

We took it for another test drive and it’s getting better. But one thing I noticed when braking harder is that the brakes vibrate, almost like it would feel when the rotors are warped. Is it possible for air in the system to cause that problem?

 

[gaber6]

Not from what I would understand.

Warped rotors would be the likely culprit.

Then
Worn struts, bushings etc

 

[Bluesky 07]

I hope you get this squared away as it has to be beyond frustrating. I did my brakes a couple of weeks ago and the link posted in this excerpt from my post about it may be helpful. I have since done the full fluid flush with no issues. I highly recommend SpeedBleeders since their check valve design prevents air from being sucked in during the bleed (why isn't every bleeder made that way from the factory??).

I think the link is essentially the same instructions you posted but in case it does you any good:

==

This was my first brake work and I was anxious about the bleed, but I installed the SpeedBleeders I bought a couple of years ago and followed the instructions in this post with no problem. Next up is a full brake fluid flush, which I should have just done with the brakes but I was focused on getting the truck back on the road since I had work the next morning.
==

 

[Montego Murph]

I highly recommend SpeedBleeders since their check valve design prevents air from being sucked in during the bleed

I haven't bought a set yet, but this is a no-brainer as far as I'm concerned.
It's been suggested that bleeding the brakes often might help prevent caliper seizing which is an issue for our brakes.

 

[Bluesky 07]

I haven't bought a set yet, but this is a no-brainer as far as I'm concerned.
It's been suggested that bleeding the brakes often might help prevent caliper seizing which is an issue for our brakes.

Yes, as I understand it, flushing the fluid every couple of years should help with the calipers b/c brake fluid absorbs moisture, moisture enables rust, & rust locks up the caliper pistons. I have added a flush to my maintenance schedule as it wasn’t on my radar until my calipers gave me a rude awakening.

 

[Montego Murph]

flushing the fluid every couple of years should help...

I might suggest sooner... I did the 5th Gen upgrade just over a year ago and one piston already seized up.

 

[Bluesky 07]

I might suggest sooner... I did the 5th Gen upgrade just over a year ago and one piston already seized up.

Wow...that’s disappointing.

 

[JuniorPigeon]

Wow...that’s disappointing.

I've heard the same about 5th gen swaps, doesn't seem worth it IMO.

What was your procedure using the Speed Bleeders? I definitely get the idea just want to make sure I have it right. I'm going to order some since I have some ATE fluid on the way.

 

[Montego Murph]

I've heard the same about 5th gen swaps, doesn't seem worth it IMO.

What was your procedure using the Speed Bleeders? I definitely get the idea just want to make sure I have it right. I'm going to order some since I have some ATE fluid on the way.

Yeah, there doesn't seem to be much of a difference between 4th and 5th gen when it comes to the seizing issue. Oh well. For what it's worth, I bought Centrix calipers from Rock Auto.


Regarding speed bleeders, what size bleeder valve do we need? I wonder if they are the same size between 4th and 5th gen.

 

[Bluesky 07]

I've heard the same about 5th gen swaps, doesn't seem worth it IMO.

I've heard the same about 5th gen swaps, doesn't seem worth it IMO.

What was your procedure using the Speed Bleeders? I definitely get the idea just want to make sure I have it right. I'm going to order some since I have some ATE fluid on the way.

I almost did a writeup - wish now that I had. I followed this post, which has directions from the FSM. The biggest thing is not to let the reservoir run dry and to watch for what is often a very subtle change in the color of the fluid in the tube coming off the bleeder. If your fluid is old, it will be obvious when the new stuff starts coming out but not so much if the current fluid is only mildly discolored.

Because of the corrosive & toxic nature of brake fluid, I strongly recommend 1) some kind of cover around the reservoir & over your fender to catch any drips/spills (puppy training mats are great, or rags, a sheet, etc.), & 2) a through-the-cap bottle with the tube secured. That way, less chance of a spill if it falls over. Beyond what’s shown in the linked pic, put a zip tie “collar” around the tube above & below the hole in the cap and slide them together so the tube is held in place.

Finally, I checked with two local places that take used motor oil & both said it was fine to pour the old fluid in with oil before taking it in for recycling.

[MENTION=93683]Montego Murph[/MENTION], the ordering info is available on the SpeedBleeders site. Their customer service was excellent btw.

 

[Drcoffee]

I got tired of pumping the brakes and finally bought a Motive universal bleeder kit which just has a res cap and hose with chains to secure it. I setup an adapter to connect to my air compressor. After topping off the reservoir, installing the bleeder cap, I turnred the air compressor on and set it for 14#. The starting from the rears and working forward, opened one bleeder screw at a time. Watch the fluid flow until no bubbles remain. Oh so much easier.

You dont need the pump bottle, just the adapter kit. $27

1101 - Round Universal Adapter - Motive Products

Bleeding the master cylinder

How to Replace a Brake Master Cylinder in Your Car (Bleed Brakes) - YouTube