Change the whole rear axle or just the diff, 05 4Runner?

[Ginneta]

I bought a used 05 4Runner, SR5 V6 4X4 less than a year ago and now need to replace the rear diff. I scored a relatively cheap rear axle with only 15,000 miles on it from a relative. However, its in OH and I'm in SC. My dad is bringing it down for me and wants to just bring the rear differential itself. My boyfriend says it'll be easier to change the whole rear axle, he's not too mechanically inclined. My dad, who can rebuild anything, says the rear diff. alone will be easier to replace. My dad is 66 and a Mopar fan, not too up to date on the newer vehicles and doesnt know much about Toyota's. Can anyone please tell me which would be easier to change out? Whole rear axle? Rear diff. alone? Thanks in advance for any advice given.

 

[03_4x4Runner]

How many miles are on your current axle? I see your dads point. It is much easier to bring the differential pumpkin than the whole rear axle. It is not that hard to change just the differential. Take out the driveshaft, axle shafts and remove the center section and reinstall the new just like your dad is used to on mopar 8 3/4 axles. If that new axle only has 15k miles it may pay to change the whole axle because you will be getting newer axle bearings as well. It will take a lot more room to bring the whole axle and a little more time to install. Either way will work.

 

[superman3043]

OK, I'll take a stab at this, and those that are more knowledgeable can correct me if I'm wrong. With the inherent (brilliant) design of the Toyota axles, your most sensible approach would be to just swap out 3rd members. This is basically your diff housing and are design to be swapped out fairly painlessly. It would require pulling your axle shafts and disconnecting the drive-shaft, removing the old 3rd and bolting in the new. It also makes sense on the transportation of the part, and scale of the job side of things.

Hope that makes sense. Just thought I'd get your thread rolling. If somebody that knows better would like to confirm or correct me, please do.

Also, welcome to the forum! I just moved from Summerville almost a year ago.

Good luck, LMK if you have any additional questions.

Edit: 03_4x4Runner beat me to the punch

 

[CXS]

Listen to your dad, he knows what he's talking about!

 

[BlackWorksInc]

Logistically, all you need is the 3rd member. It swaps right in and is much smaller and easier to transport. That being said, the new axle only has 15k on it and if you have a lot of miles on your current axle, a "newer" axle with newer bearings is always a plus if you can transport the unit easily.

I'd say if you can get the axle here cheaply/easily, just swap the whole axle (assuming you have closer to 100k on the truck in terms of mileage) otherwise the 3rd member will get the job done.

Small note though, if your previous differential failed and shed metal shavings and bits into the housing, make sure you clean it out very well before putting the new unit in. It will only take a few bits of metal to wear out the bearings and gears.

 

[aha2988]

Changing the whole axle would require disconnecting all four control arms, the pan hard bar, and disconnect your sway bar. Before all that you'll have to disconnect all the ABS sensor wires, brake lines, and shocks.

then transfer everything from the old axle thats not on the new axle (like sway bar, brake lines anything of that nature..



on the other hand to just change the diff out supermans spot on. Unbolt the 4 bolts on each side of the axle holding the hubs on, disconnect your abs wheel speed sensors, slide the axle shafts out a few inchs.

then unbolt the drive shaft u-joint coupling. (set the u-joint a side for now) unbolt all the bolts around the 3rd member (the big thing in the center of the axle) and just pull out the third member you may have to slide out your axles shafts just a bit more if it doesnt just come right out.
(this removes all the differentials carrier componants with it ring & pinion, carrier, bearings its all one package)

put the new 3rd member back in the way the old one came out bolt it up. slide your axles back in, bolt the hubs back up reconnect your ABS wheel sensors, reconnect your drive shaft re installing your U-joint, then your good to go.

 

[Sungod]

Your boyfriend is probably confusing removing the 3rd member with rebuilding it. Rebuilding it would be a pain in the ass, but as stated installing would not be that big of a deal. Removing it also allows you the chance to verify the gear ratio which is a critical step in the process of transplanting parts especially if yours is 4wd.

 

[nevada]

Logistically, all you need is the 3rd member. It swaps right in and is much smaller and easier to transport. That being said, the new axle only has 15k on it and if you have a lot of miles on your current axle, a "newer" axle with newer bearings is always a plus if you can transport the unit easily.

I'd say if you can get the axle here cheaply/easily, just swap the whole axle (assuming you have closer to 100k on the truck in terms of mileage) otherwise the 3rd member will get the job done.

Small note though, if your previous differential failed and shed metal shavings and bits into the housing, make sure you clean it out very well before putting the new unit in. It will only take a few bits of metal to wear out the bearings and gears.

this is very important.

i would also say get the entire rear axle.

and really, theres not a lot of difference in work between swapping the 3rd, or the whole thing. but you would be getting a new rear with much lower miles, and not risk the chance of leaving some shavings in the housing, and wiping out the new 3rd aswell.

 

[Ginneta]

My 4Runner currently has 160,000 miles on it. It does sound as though changing just the diff alone will be easier, however there have been some great points made about changing the whole rear axle, especially given the amount of miles on my truck. I think i may go with changing the whole axle, some extra work now could save alot of work and money in the future. Thanks for ALL of the replies and advice given!

 

[03_4x4Runner]

Yes with that many miles just do the whole thing. You will have much newer wheel bearings and axxle seals. As stated make sure the gear ratio is the same as your old one.

 

[aha2988]

instead of disconnecting the entire rear axle you can just swap out:
3rd members
axle hubs (gives you new outter axle shaft bearings)
axle shafts (you would gain strength in the splines i suppose)
then just put new axle housing seals in.

when you have both hubs removed, and both axle shafts removed, and the third member removed. take a quart or so of gear oil and flush out the axle housing tubes, as well as the carrier housing. pour a bit in each tube of the axle and a bit on a towel then run the towel through the tubes just wipe down the carrier housing real good.

This will give you the "newness" from the new(used) axle, to your existing axle without disconnecting everything in the suspension. So same end result slightly less work...

the only advantage of actually changing out axle housings would be if yours currently has alot of rust build up on it.

but whichever you decide happy wrenching to you :cheers:

If you do decide to swap out entire axles just an FYI.. when reconnecting the control arms you need to load the suspension before torquing the bolts completely. To do that just connect all the control arm connection points and the pan hard bar with the bolts however leave the bolts slightly loose. Continue assembly of everything else all the suspension components all the way out to bolting the tires back on. set the truck back on its own weight on all four tires on a level floor (or at least a floor with less than 1 deg of grade). Finish by torquing the the control arms back tight.
The purpose behind this is that the control arms have rubber bushings that allow the control arms to move up and down. if you tighten them up with the axle hanging and no load, when you go to load the vehicle you'll actually be binding the control arm bushings up.

 

[Ginneta]

Yes with that many miles just do the whole thing. You will have much newer wheel bearings and axxle seals. As stated make sure the gear ratio is the same as your old one.

I had a pic of the label on the door and the VIN# from the wrecked 4Runner sent to me. I matched it up with mine and all is well. I was so happy to score it with so few miles and for only $300! Plus free shipping! LOL

 

[Ginneta]

Another question; I took "Betty" to the dealership the other day to get an oil change and the tech told me that the rear main seal and oil pan seals needed replaced. Now I understand that i have alot of miles on my truck and that they are probably not in the best condition. However, when I asked him about my oil levels he said I was only a 1/2 quart low, and it had been right at about 4500 miles since my last oil change. What are your opinions in this? I say they are ok for now given my oil was not that low. I also park in the grass (in the same spot everyday) and the grass beneath my truck is not dead or yellow from leaked oil...

 

[aha2988]

Another question; I took "Betty" to the dealership the other day to get an oil change and the tech told me that the rear main seal and oil pan seals needed replaced. Now I understand that i have alot of miles on my truck and that they are probably not in the best condition. However, when I asked him about my oil levels he said I was only a 1/2 quart low, and it had been right at about 4500 miles since my last oil change. What are your opinions in this? I say they are ok for now given my oil was not that low. I also park in the grass (in the same spot everyday) and the grass beneath my truck is not dead or yellow from leaked oil...

If you haven't detected a leak yourself, they may be just "recommending" the replacement as preventative maintenance. for the rear main seal leak you would notice grimy oil residue on the bottom side of the bell housing between the back of the engine and the front of the transmission.

if the oil pan gasket is leaking you would notice alot of grimy oil residue on the outside of the oil pan itself. These items don't necessarily leak when the vehicle is parked, they leak when the engine is running and the crank case pressure is increased enough to push through the seals.

 

[BlackWorksInc]

If you haven't detected a leak yourself, they may be just "recommending" the replacement as preventative maintenance. for the rear main seal leak you would notice grimy oil residue on the bottom side of the bell housing between the back of the engine and the front of the transmission.

if the oil pan gasket is leaking you would notice alot of grimy oil residue on the outside of the oil pan itself. These items don't necessarily leak when the vehicle is parked, they leak when the engine is running and the crank case pressure is increased enough to push through the seals.

Another thing to add is that often they spread out on the surface of the oil pan and collect dust and dirt, so you get this sort of sludgey/crusty glop that often collects most of the fluid.

 

[Ginneta]

What I mean by the grass under my truck is that it doesnt leak any down right after I pull in to park and it doesnt leak when I start my truck to let it warm up (which I do every single time even when it's 100 outside) I was under the truck 2 weeks ago to take pics of the diff for my dad and every thing was pretty clean. No rust or crud build up... I think I'll go with my instinct on this one and not worry too much about it for now. Thanks y'all!

 

[Ginneta]

Well guys I'm proud to announce that it took me (with the directions of my Dad) about 3 and a half hours to change out the rear diff!! So far so good! No more humming noises and a smooth ride!!

 

[nevada]

nicely done.
congrats.

that was the entire axle assembly, or just the center section?

 

[Ginneta]

Thanks!!

Just the third member. My dad did not bring the whole rear axle down. He does have it stored at the garage for back up, just in case! I must say it was easier than I thought it would be and quite fun!!

 

[crackman]

Disclaimer. Hate to kick up an old thread, but...

I've been beating my face in wall over this same issue for a month now.

2005 4runner / 4.8 / 2wd / A01A with e locker and a fried pinion bearing. I know it's the pinion because I just put in new axle bearings, seals and such.

At this point I just want to swap out with a used 3rd member instead of pulling it and having it torn apart in my garage for a couple weeks while it's being rebuilt.

The thing is, NOBODY can seem to tell me what rear end Toyota put in it. I call the dealer with the VIN. They can only give me the gear ratio and tells me to check the tag on the firewall. Heh. Ya right.

Driveline / differential shop in town says it's either one of two and it depends on the ring gear size. We can't tell until you bring it in.

Ebay shows me 3rd members that don't look exactly like what I have. The closest thing I've seen there is out of a Sequoia.

Is there a case stamp somewhere on it? Spline count on the axles? When I got the parts for the axle bearings I only had one choice.

Why did Toyota make this so difficult? I'd rather spend a few hours swapping it out, than forgetting how it went together after 14 sleeps.

Any help please? Anybody have one of these available? Pointers? Tips?

Much TIA.