DIY Residential Solar Panels
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ajonesnv
New member
Do you know anything about sell the acquired PEC's?
MStudt
official vendor
Sorry I didn't get back to you sooner. I do know some about the energy credits. I just don't know if it's going to differ from Missouri to Utah. What exactly are you trying to find out?
From my understanding 1 PEC is represents 1 kilowatt hour of energy generated. I'm also pretty sure since you're residential that you'll qualify for an additional .05 adder for each kilowatt hour generated. You do need to sign up for the PEC in order to receive any benefits. Try contacting the Public Utilities Commission of Nevada. You should be able to fill out an application and be good to go.
I remember reading somewhere that you only have until the end of the year before the PEC isn't available for new users.
ajonesnv
New member
Very cool and thanks for the additional info.
I have a friend of a friend that installs these in SoCal, so he is going to order me the kit he uses at wholesale. If all goes as planned Ill have it in at about 10-20K cheaper (depends on who you compare prices too) and it should pay for itself in about 4 years.
I don't know a lot about investments, but that seems like a decent return. In addition our power increases at about 5% each year. IDK why more haven't looked into solar...even if you do a 20 years lease deal, its still a bunch cheaper than doing nothing. Im also somewhat of a tree-hugger (in some areas of life) so Im glad to produce clean energy.
I have a friend of a friend that installs these in SoCal, so he is going to order me the kit he uses at wholesale. If all goes as planned Ill have it in at about 10-20K cheaper (depends on who you compare prices too) and it should pay for itself in about 4 years.
I don't know a lot about investments, but that seems like a decent return. In addition our power increases at about 5% each year. IDK why more haven't looked into solar...even if you do a 20 years lease deal, its still a bunch cheaper than doing nothing. Im also somewhat of a tree-hugger (in some areas of life) so Im glad to produce clean energy.
MStudt
official vendor
If you can afford it, do it. I installed a system in my aunt and uncles in Oregon a couple years ago. It's not very complicated to do, just time consuming. I'm going to be building a house in about 5 years and it's going to be completely solar. It's much easier working with solar when you're starting from scratch. Good luck to, and let me know how it turns out.
ajonesnv
New member
Will do. With a bunch of photos
Have you researched the battery system much? I would like to add that at some point too.
MStudt
official vendor
Keep me posted! The wife and I have been talking about the investment for our current house. I'm going to be doing a 100% gut on my house this fall before we leave to hike the AT. Would be a perfect time to upgrade the wiring and install some panels. I'm currently looking into wind options since I'm only about 50% full sun.
ajonesnv
New member
Will do. First thing you might wanna do is look through your last 12 months power bills and determine the kWh usage over the year, so you can determine the size system you need. We consume approximately 10,187 kWh and are installing a 6000w system that will produce 9843 kWh over the year.
Some of the online dealers sell kits that are close to whole sale, so what Ive seen will run about 12-13K for that size system.
Now this system won't produce 100% consumption during the peak months, but produces more than consumed in off-peak months. So after one year it averages out so I will use my power company credits to cover the peak months service and create more credits in off-peak months essentially making it 100% system.
With the amount of sun you have wind is a good addition, which I would consider too if we had less sun than we do and it didn't pose such an issue with HOA's and city code. (Wind is highly frowned upon here do to some turbines being noisy and an eye sore) Stupid city people.
The wind should help you make up for the difference. Keep in mind though, unless you have a battery bank to hold the power you don't want too big of a system because if you are constantly making power and using less than you make you essentially are making free power for the power company because most power companies don't offer cash for your production...just credits to your bill, which are useless if you can't spend them.
Some of the online dealers sell kits that are close to whole sale, so what Ive seen will run about 12-13K for that size system.
Now this system won't produce 100% consumption during the peak months, but produces more than consumed in off-peak months. So after one year it averages out so I will use my power company credits to cover the peak months service and create more credits in off-peak months essentially making it 100% system.
With the amount of sun you have wind is a good addition, which I would consider too if we had less sun than we do and it didn't pose such an issue with HOA's and city code. (Wind is highly frowned upon here do to some turbines being noisy and an eye sore) Stupid city people.
The wind should help you make up for the difference. Keep in mind though, unless you have a battery bank to hold the power you don't want too big of a system because if you are constantly making power and using less than you make you essentially are making free power for the power company because most power companies don't offer cash for your production...just credits to your bill, which are useless if you can't spend them.
ajonesnv
New member
Well, I got it all in and operating. It took some time, as I did it myself, but very much worth it. So far I have had no issues and everything is operating as intended. The system so far creates about 35 kWh of power a day (right now).
The most time consuming part of the install is the track mounts. We have curved s-tile on our house so it wasn't as simple as lagging the track mount down. I had to remove the tile, mount the Tile-Track, and then drill a corresponding hole in the tile to receive a threaded bar. So this ended up accounting for the lion's share of time as I had to install about 50 of them at about 10-20 min each.
Once the mount were in the L-brackets were installed to hold the rails then came the panels.
Wiring was a cinch, since the panels and optimizers came with all the plugs from the factory. Plug and play if you will. I lucked out since I have attic space above my garage, so I ran all the wiring about 10' from the panels into the garage attic and then down the wall to the inverter that I hung next to the main breaker box.
Ill get some photos up soon.
The most time consuming part of the install is the track mounts. We have curved s-tile on our house so it wasn't as simple as lagging the track mount down. I had to remove the tile, mount the Tile-Track, and then drill a corresponding hole in the tile to receive a threaded bar. So this ended up accounting for the lion's share of time as I had to install about 50 of them at about 10-20 min each.
Once the mount were in the L-brackets were installed to hold the rails then came the panels.
Wiring was a cinch, since the panels and optimizers came with all the plugs from the factory. Plug and play if you will. I lucked out since I have attic space above my garage, so I ran all the wiring about 10' from the panels into the garage attic and then down the wall to the inverter that I hung next to the main breaker box.
Ill get some photos up soon.
ben550
New member
Solar works pretty well even with partial sun exposure. I wouldn't mess with wind. That is a total flop unless you are playing sim city 2000..
I use solar panels on remote cabins and they work very well even in the woods. They run plenty of stuff without needing a generator.
ajonesnv
New member
I was able to buy the system wholesale so it was just at 11,500.00 including permit and extras.
You don't have to have a contractor to get the rebates (in NV at least) (you just have to spend the time figuring out how to get to them), BUT typically if you get a rebate, say from NVEnergy, what you are actually doing is giving up your right to the REC's (Renewable Energy Credit's) that you accrue as a energy producer. As you obtain them you can sell them back to NVEnergy at about 600.00/yr. (based on my size of a system). So they offer you 2400.00 or so (In Nevada) to give that right up, which in the long run hurts you...especially once the State of NV starts to allow sales of REC's across state line. There are are many entities that will pay 2400.00/year for the same as what NVE is paying due to their inability to produce renewable energy themselves, yet still have to meet the renewable energy quota the .gov puts on them. REC's are based on state, so each one is different...for example it is my understanding that CA doesn't offer any REC's.
The government offers a 30% tax break on the system, assuming you have paid in more than what you are taking out in taxes. This is easy as filling out a tax form, which even Turbo Tax asks about. Most contractors that do in house financing actually give you 18 months interest free financing on this portion because they know once April 15 rolls around that cash will be in the buys pocket.
So by my math we should have our ROI by year 4, and that is not calculating the 5%/year NVE price increase. So actually just under 4. If they open up state lines for REC sales sooner than later then the ROI could be as soon as 2-2.5 years.
I have looked on several websites and have found that you can get 100% systems for a decent price, I just can't personally speak to their quality. For example: 6kW Online Solar Grid Tie Solar Power System offers this kit that is quite a bit cheaper than mine, however it lacks in some comparable functionality. My system has Optimizers at each panel that allows individual monitoring of each panel...this one does not. What that means is if your system is under producing you can't isolate the problem by a quick view in the monitoring portal, which monitors each optimizer and like the name says it optimizes the power production from each panel.
This web-site seems to offer a comparable system as to mine: Buy Solar Panels, Solar Power Kits, Photovoltaic Systems for Home I was actually going to buy from them prior to stumbling on a friend of a friend that sold me a system at their cost.
I do know that I had 2 quotes to have the system put in by a contractor and they were 2-3 times the cost of what I have, which gives you 2-3 times the length on the ROI. I most likely wouldn't have done it if our ROI wasn't so quick.
You don't have to have a contractor to get the rebates (in NV at least) (you just have to spend the time figuring out how to get to them), BUT typically if you get a rebate, say from NVEnergy, what you are actually doing is giving up your right to the REC's (Renewable Energy Credit's) that you accrue as a energy producer. As you obtain them you can sell them back to NVEnergy at about 600.00/yr. (based on my size of a system). So they offer you 2400.00 or so (In Nevada) to give that right up, which in the long run hurts you...especially once the State of NV starts to allow sales of REC's across state line. There are are many entities that will pay 2400.00/year for the same as what NVE is paying due to their inability to produce renewable energy themselves, yet still have to meet the renewable energy quota the .gov puts on them. REC's are based on state, so each one is different...for example it is my understanding that CA doesn't offer any REC's.
The government offers a 30% tax break on the system, assuming you have paid in more than what you are taking out in taxes. This is easy as filling out a tax form, which even Turbo Tax asks about. Most contractors that do in house financing actually give you 18 months interest free financing on this portion because they know once April 15 rolls around that cash will be in the buys pocket.
So by my math we should have our ROI by year 4, and that is not calculating the 5%/year NVE price increase. So actually just under 4. If they open up state lines for REC sales sooner than later then the ROI could be as soon as 2-2.5 years.
I have looked on several websites and have found that you can get 100% systems for a decent price, I just can't personally speak to their quality. For example: 6kW Online Solar Grid Tie Solar Power System offers this kit that is quite a bit cheaper than mine, however it lacks in some comparable functionality. My system has Optimizers at each panel that allows individual monitoring of each panel...this one does not. What that means is if your system is under producing you can't isolate the problem by a quick view in the monitoring portal, which monitors each optimizer and like the name says it optimizes the power production from each panel.
This web-site seems to offer a comparable system as to mine: Buy Solar Panels, Solar Power Kits, Photovoltaic Systems for Home I was actually going to buy from them prior to stumbling on a friend of a friend that sold me a system at their cost.
I do know that I had 2 quotes to have the system put in by a contractor and they were 2-3 times the cost of what I have, which gives you 2-3 times the length on the ROI. I most likely wouldn't have done it if our ROI wasn't so quick.
ajonesnv
New member
So if you look closely you can see each roof mount, this by far is the most time consuming aspect of the job:
Now, I didn't get any shots of the mount under the tile (I will add them later cause Ive decided to add a couple mounts to longer rails I decided not to cut down), but essentially the install goes in the order of this photo:
From bottom to top:
1. The "Tile-Track" base and lag screw is drilled into the truss under the tile.
2. The "Tile-Track" receiver is adjusted along the base to correspond with the up slope of the s-tile, which has a hole drilled though.
3. The "Tile-Track" receiver holds the threaded bar that runs up through the tile hole. As shown in the previous photo the flashing and nut is then attached leaving you with a threaded anchor for the "L" bracket that holds the rail.
-Copious amounts of roof sealant are used in each penetration.
-If you have flat tile or composite shingles this wold be a far easier task.
The optimizers (if you get a system with them)(micro-inverters will be the same) can be installed various ways, just as long as they are clear of the panel edges. This photo is of one way...I didn't go this route but it is an option. Also, this shows a close up of the connectors, the panel connects to the shorter optimizer leads and then the longer leads from the optimizer goes to the neighboring optimizer. + into - and so on.:
I choose to attach the optimizers directly to the rail like so:
All installed:
I did two runs, as this diagram shows. From the end of each + & - run I ran leads to a J-Box:
J-Box to J-Box. The J-Box on the far end is over my garage attic, so this run drops into the attic. Essentially, I have two J-Boxes sandwiching the roofline on the far end:
I have no pictures of the run in the attic, I can get some if you guys want them, but the DC runs come down into the garage right next to the main panel / the AC goes right back up and drops into the main panel:
Inside the Inverter:
Inside the Main:
Operational (note this was just a test, as the city inspector will be by next week to, well...inspect):
Now, I didn't get any shots of the mount under the tile (I will add them later cause Ive decided to add a couple mounts to longer rails I decided not to cut down), but essentially the install goes in the order of this photo:
From bottom to top:
1. The "Tile-Track" base and lag screw is drilled into the truss under the tile.
2. The "Tile-Track" receiver is adjusted along the base to correspond with the up slope of the s-tile, which has a hole drilled though.
3. The "Tile-Track" receiver holds the threaded bar that runs up through the tile hole. As shown in the previous photo the flashing and nut is then attached leaving you with a threaded anchor for the "L" bracket that holds the rail.
-Copious amounts of roof sealant are used in each penetration.
-If you have flat tile or composite shingles this wold be a far easier task.
The optimizers (if you get a system with them)(micro-inverters will be the same) can be installed various ways, just as long as they are clear of the panel edges. This photo is of one way...I didn't go this route but it is an option. Also, this shows a close up of the connectors, the panel connects to the shorter optimizer leads and then the longer leads from the optimizer goes to the neighboring optimizer. + into - and so on.:
I choose to attach the optimizers directly to the rail like so:
All installed:
I did two runs, as this diagram shows. From the end of each + & - run I ran leads to a J-Box:
J-Box to J-Box. The J-Box on the far end is over my garage attic, so this run drops into the attic. Essentially, I have two J-Boxes sandwiching the roofline on the far end:
I have no pictures of the run in the attic, I can get some if you guys want them, but the DC runs come down into the garage right next to the main panel / the AC goes right back up and drops into the main panel:
Inside the Inverter:
Inside the Main:
Operational (note this was just a test, as the city inspector will be by next week to, well...inspect):
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