Do I Really Need the Differential Lock? -help

[Mr.4runner]

Hey guys, I'm currently hunting to buy a Gen3 exclusively for off road exploring up at our cabin but I have it stuck in my head that I need the Diff Lock which came on the Limiteds. There is very little mud up there, but I will be doing a lot of off-road snow driving and moderate difficult trails but not rock crawling or anything crazy at this point . I'm not looking to deck this thing out for hardcore wheeling but I will throw some fat rubber on there (Cooper Discover SST maybe?) and possibly a 2" lift if it's not too expensive.

Anyway, I'm passing on a lot of nice SR5's just because of the lack of Diff Lock. Am I putting too much stock in making the lock a "must have" or is it something I probably won't miss if I don't have it?

I'm ready to buy now so any thoughts appreciated. Most of the clean Gen 3's with 150-200K miles are asking in the $4000 a $6000 range which is about what I want to spend.

I would definitely wait and search for what u want. I waited and searched for mine for about 4 months until I found the one I wanted and fit my budget. I found my 96 4x4 limited with e-locker and 152,xxx miles for 4200. Need a lil work nothing major but most importantly I got what I was looking for. Now that I have it I'm happy I waited for it. The E-locker has helped me out a few times.

 

[jasonoflivingston]

So let me make sure I understand this:

I have a 2006 4Runner Limited. It is all wheel drive all the time. When I go off road, I lock the center differential in 4LO.

I also am getting a 2000 4Runner SR5. When I go off road I will switch it from 2WD to 4LO.

So... The 2006 4runner in 4LO with the locked center differential is going to be essentially the same thing as the 2000 4runner in 4LO. Is this thinking correct? In both circumstances, if ONE wheel loses traction, you will still be moving, but if TWO lose traction, then you may get stuck. Am I understanding this correctly?

In a word, Yes. You have the idea. Your 2006 in 4LO with centre locked is going to be the same as part time 4WD in a 3rd gen. The 2006 would have traction control of some sort though right? You won't get that on the 2000.

 

[adkinsadam1]

In a word, Yes. You have the idea. Your 2006 in 4LO with centre locked is going to be the same as part time 4WD in a 3rd gen. The 2006 would have traction control of some sort though right? You won't get that on the 2000.

Yes. So the ONLY DIFFERENCE would be that my 06 has ATRAC, right?

That's actually very risky. I cannot think of one single time I've been off roading where ATRAC has not kept me going. With out ATRAC, it might be risky business! I want to get a rear locker installed on my 2000, but I don't know how much that would cost. I am not capable of doing it myself, so I would have to have someone get the part and do it. Hopefully it wouldn't be more than $600.

 

[jasonoflivingston]

From a driveline operation perspective, you nailed it. What sets the earlier third gen's apart is the ability to get one with the rear diff lock, which I would take over ATRAC any day for offroad capability. I am sure some might argue otherwise.

 

[afg10000]

Yes. So the ONLY DIFFERENCE would be that my 06 has ATRAC, right?

That's actually very risky. I cannot think of one single time I've been off roading where ATRAC has not kept me going. With out ATRAC, it might be risky business! I want to get a rear locker installed on my 2000, but I don't know how much that would cost. I am not capable of doing it myself, so I would have to have someone get the part and do it. Hopefully it wouldn't be more than $600.

See BigFish's build thread. Retroing an e-locker is gonna take some doing. Though, it may be easier on a '00 than an '01-'02. I completely agree with jasonoflivingston, I would not trade ATRAC and center diff-lock for a rear locker any day. Much better that a fried tranny. I speak from experience and mistakes.

 

[02SE]

On '96 to '00 4Runners, the center diff is only applicable on Limited models

'96 to '98 Limited's are part-time 4wd. Pushing the 4wd button on the transfer case shifter, just shifts the transfer case into part-time 4wd. It achieves the same thing the manual shift transfer case in base and SR5 models does, when those are shifted from 2Hi to 4Hi. There is no differential in the '96 to '98 Limited transfer case.

Now '99-'00 Limited 4wd models DO have a Multi-mode transfer case which has a differential, which allows full-time 4wd (often referred to on here as AWD).

All '01'-'02 4wd 'Runners have a Multi-mode t-case. But those years didn't have the rear diff lock option. They do have a button on the dash to lock the transfer case differential. Locking the transfer case differential, sends equal power to the front and rear driveshafts, just like a part-time 4wd system. That means you ideally would only use that on slippery surfaces, to avoid driveline binding and possible breakage.

 

[slapdappy]

def get the locker

my 99 limited has the multi mode transfer case. It is so user friendly. Just push a button on the transfer case lever while moving at up to 60mph and you get AWD, which is like 4H without center diff locked. Flip the lever at up to 60mph and you get 4H, which locks the center diff. Stop, put it in neutral, flip the lever and you get 4L. Then push dash the button and you've got 4L (center diff locked) plus rear diff locked. My limited (no pun intended) experience with this flexibility and ease of use on snowy mt roads and summer trails has made me a believer. The rear locker is v effective, scoots me right up and over rocks or other obstacles i'd otherwise have a rear tire spinning on.

 

[Jon]

'96 to '98 Limited's are part-time 4wd. Pushing the 4wd button on the transfer case shifter, just shifts the transfer case into part-time 4wd. It achieves the same thing the manual shift transfer case in base and SR5 models does, when those are shifted from 2Hi to 4Hi. There is no differential in the '96 to '98 Limited transfer case.

First I've ever heard of "part time" 4wd. That 4WD button is responsible for sliding the selector fork in the front diff over to engage it. As I remember it (before I did the 5spd swap) the front drive shaft was always engaged. All the wheels were waiting on was that front diff to be engaged to get power.

Now back to the locker debockle :fencing:

I love the damn thing! My truck was going places in 2wd (E-locker engaged) that others weren't making in 4WD. It depends on the obsticles but always better to have it than not.

 

[Swimmerboy2112]

About the locker vs no locker thing, let me put it this way,

I have a 2002 Tacoma, it has the locker.

I have a 1997 4Runner, it does not have the locker.

I miss the locker.

 

[jasonoflivingston]

'96 to '98 Limited's are part-time 4wd. Pushing the 4wd button on the transfer case shifter, just shifts the transfer case into part-time 4wd. It achieves the same thing the manual shift transfer case in base and SR5 models does, when those are shifted from 2Hi to 4Hi. There is no differential in the '96 to '98 Limited transfer case.

Now '99-'00 Limited 4wd models DO have a Multi-mode transfer case which has a differential, which allows full-time 4wd (often referred to on here as AWD).

All '01'-'02 4wd 'Runners have a Multi-mode t-case. But those years didn't have the rear diff lock option. They do have a button on the dash to lock the transfer case differential. Locking the transfer case differential, sends equal power to the front and rear driveshafts, just like a part-time 4wd system. That means you ideally would only use that on slippery surfaces, to avoid driveline binding and possible breakage.

Oops. That is what I get for posting late at night when I am half asleep. I forgot about that distinction between transfer cases in the earlier years. My bad. What I said is still applicable for the '99 - '00 4Runners though. At least I didn't totally screw that up. hwell:

 

[1sick4runner]

Toyota 4Runner Toyota 4Runner Limited SR5 4 Runner | eBay

 

[Grenvilleter]

You say "diff lock" are you talking center diff lock or rear locking diff?

They are two completely different things.

The 4runners that have a center diff lock can be driven on non-slippery roads un-locked (there is a diff in the transfer-case that can be locked) and locked to positively lock the front axle to the rear axle. Locked center diff makes the vehicle act like a conventional 4wd.

If you are in slippery conditions and have the center diff unlocked, you could have one wheel spinning and 3 stopped and be stuck. This is due to the open front axle diff, the open read axle diff and the un-locked (open) center diff (transfer-case diff).

The 4runners that don't have the center diff lock, if driven on non-slippery roads and trails, will have drivetrain bind. It's not suggested to drive on dry roads when 4wd. (this is how a center locked vehicle will act too)

If you are talking rear axle locking diff, that locks both rear wheels together.

A warning on locked axles. If the road/trail is off chamber (leaning toward the edge of the road/trail) a locked axle will cause the vehicle to slide sideways/down hill. This can get you into trouble quick. I rarely snow bash with my rear axle locked. Mainly just to get thru the deep snow. I'm very aware and use only when safe.

If I was snow wheeling by myself like you are talking, I would invest in a winch. Personally more important than a rear diff locker.

Sorry...I should have used the term "e-locker" rather than "diff lock" not thinking about lock up transfer cases which uses the same terminology.

It's because farm tractors always have a differential lock to lock the rear wheels and that's the term I've always used for locking the rear axle.

As Gerdo says however, it can also get you in trouble if you are on a sideways grade and want to go forward. The two rear wheels spinning will allow your truck to slide in a downhill direction and can make your life "more complicated".
I would not trade in a winch for an e-locker but the question is "should I hold out for an e-locker?" and myself, I would say YES. Keep looking !

E-locker equipped vehicles have a button labeled RR Diff Lock .
Can someone tell me what the RR actually stands for?

 

[IBallEngineer]

:couch2::focus:

The trails around GVL aren't very challenging, except for a few. If you find yourself trying to get home from the Cedar Glen malt shop, outside Arrowhead Lake, you would be glad to have the locker if you take 3N36 through Crab Flats.

And it helps in the snow, if we ever get any.

 

[Aznwolf118]

Honestly my 2002 didn't have lockers and I got pretty much every where I wanted to go. I didn't add lockers until I went more remote and solo expo stuff.

You can buy and add lockers later.

Spend the money and find a good foundation, a well maintained good condition 4runner, bets focusing in on rear lockers.

 

[Grenvilleter]

Honestly my 2002 didn't have lockers and I got pretty much every where I wanted to go. I didn't add lockers until I went more remote and solo expo stuff.

You can buy and add lockers later.

Spend the money and find a good foundation, a well maintained good condition 4runner, bets focusing in on rear lockers.

I quite agree but I think he should look for all you mentioned PLUS make sure it has e-locker. It's not cheap to buy afterwards no matter how you do it as it takes some knowledge and experience to accomplish this.

Sometimes we get too close to the forest to see the trees. To the average person selling their 10-15 yr old vehicle, having a e-locker does nothing for the re-sale value except to folks like us who browse this forum.

What I'm trying to say is many who list their runners for sale do not consider the e-locker aspect of it so they list it for what they think they can get and let the market decide. The guy without the locker may list for more than the guy who has a locker on similar mileage vehicles.

Hold out and get what you want (an e-locker) but don't pay a premium for it.

 

[BlazeRunner]

E-locker equipped vehicles have a button labeled RR Diff Lock .
Can someone tell me what the RR actually stands for?

This was discussed in a land cruiser forum once. Their Rear locker is labeled RR like ours and front is FR, meaning rear relay and front relay diff locks.

 

[Grenvilleter]

This was discussed in a land cruiser forum once. Their Rear locker is labeled RR like ours and front is FR, meaning rear relay and front relay diff locks.

AhHa...another of life's little mysteries solved for me. Thanks !

Wish I had a button labeled FR Diff lock in my truck !
In fairness I would not use FR diff lock that often except when I wanted to "crawl" up over a log across the trail.

 

[Curtis f]

Do you NEED one ? Probably not

Do you WANT one ? Absolutely

It just makes things easier , which is nice. I cant count how many times I have been out puttin along a trail in low and hit a spot where the truck flexes right out , stops , looses traction and just spins , instead of backing it up and bumping up that section with more throttle (Hard on truck) .... I just push a button and up it goes with ease. One rear locker does an amazing amount of work on a stock vehicle. It is really nice in snow and mud too.

Sure you can add one later , but the stock setup just works so good. If your not in a hurry to buy why not just be patient until you find that perfect truck :wink2: I take my truck out a fair bit too , so something to consider.

My 2 pennies

 

[Aznwolf118]

Then get the best of both world, find a good 2000-2002 with a locking center and multi mode 4wd then retro fit an e locker (which isn't that expensive honestly) and Your set.

That way you have true flexibility and still factory components.

 

[Kraze]

I'm with everyone that's saying you should hold out and wait for one to come up that already has the e-locker. I really don't think it's going to add any more to the price. 3 out 4 factory locked 3rd gens I've been involved in buying, had absolutely no clue what the locker even was.

But really, whether you'll need the locker or not depends on the type of wheeling you'll be doing. Since you plan on doing snow wheeling, I'd say it's worth it.

I've been on plenty of trails that I never needed a locker for. Then there's the trails that I wouldn't have made it up without the e-locker. Then there's other trails that you won't make it up unless you're locked front and rear.

You can see in this video that even having a rear locker wasn't enough, I need the front locker:



And in this one, the hill at the end took [MENTION=75445]4Running Daily[/MENTION] 5 tries even with the rear locked, while I walked up it the first try. That part starts at 1:38, and unfortunately the camera died before I went up it:



So lockers can be very useful if you're on hard enough trails. Plus, they help to not mess up the trail so much since you're less likely to sit there, spinning the tires, digging a hole.

That's my two cents.