Driveshaft options and questions

[1985taylor1925]

I am fairly certain at this point that the cause of my highway vibrations are driveshaft related. They tend to start at around 65mph, and then gradually get worse up to about 85, which is about as fast as Ill ever go in the rolling box.

The oddest thing about my highway vibration is that it comes and goes, with no apparent reason. So Ill be cruising at 75, and the vibrations will be terrible, then they'll start to decrease a bit, and then come back again. This intermittent coming and going of the vibration is constant on the highway. I have never found any pattern behind it. Anyone have an idea what could be causing that if not the driveshaft?? My front wheel bearing were replaced with Oem not long ago, so I can rule that out

So I replaced my rear most u joint just a few thousand miles back, and thought that helped, but it was probably just wishful thinking as the vibration now seems as bad as ever.

So my options now are

- Low mileage used driveshaft (no way of knowing if it will be free of vibrations)
- New OEM (too expensive)
- Remanufactured (cheap parts)
- Tom Wood custom driveshaft

Or I could rebuild mine. I could just get three new u joints, but I have read that there is a rubber piece in the spline that wears out. Can that piece be replaced? I have searched and cannot find any info on that. My concern is that that is the source of my vibrations, with 242K on the driveshaft.

So what are your guys thoughts. I am leaning toward a Tom Wood driveshaft at this point, but dont want to spend $300+ for it. Or if I can replace the rubber piece in the spline, I may consider just rebuilding mine. Or is there another good option out there?

 

[nissanh]

The rubber bushing is for 2WD models.
Since you said you have 3 U-joints I suppose you have the 4WD axle.

Best way to go is find a good used drive shaft. If you want one, I have an extra that I keep for my truck and is in excellent condition.

It is for 96-98 models only (without the center diff lock)

I went though the same path as you. Finally got a good used drive shaft and no more vibrations! Whenever I come across a good drive shaft, I'll keep it without sending into the crusher. I sold many and no complains so far.

 

[catrains]

Drive shafts do not wear out but U joints will. they also will seize. I had this happen earlier this year my rear U joint had a bearing frozen. had vibs at 67MPH.

had to drop drive shaft for the reveal.

fixed for $25.

 

[pauldub]

Remove the rear drive shaft and drive the vehicle in 4H. If you still have vibrations, it's not the rear drive shaft.

 

[JayRolla]

I am fairly certain at this point that the cause of my highway vibrations are driveshaft related. They tend to start at around 65mph, and then gradually get worse up to about 85, which is about as fast as Ill ever go in the rolling box.

The oddest thing about my highway vibration is that it comes and goes, with no apparent reason. So Ill be cruising at 75, and the vibrations will be terrible, then they'll start to decrease a bit, and then come back again. This intermittent coming and going of the vibration is constant on the highway. I have never found any pattern behind it. Anyone have an idea what could be causing that if not the driveshaft?? My front wheel bearing were replaced with Oem not long ago, so I can rule that out

So I replaced my rear most u joint just a few thousand miles back, and thought that helped, but it was probably just wishful thinking as the vibration now seems as bad as ever.

So my options now are

- Low mileage used driveshaft (no way of knowing if it will be free of vibrations)
- New OEM (too expensive)
- Remanufactured (cheap parts)
- Tom Wood custom driveshaft

Or I could rebuild mine. I could just get three new u joints, but I have read that there is a rubber piece in the spline that wears out. Can that piece be replaced? I have searched and cannot find any info on that. My concern is that that is the source of my vibrations, with 242K on the driveshaft.

So what are your guys thoughts. I am leaning toward a Tom Wood driveshaft at this point, but dont want to spend $300+ for it. Or if I can replace the rubber piece in the spline, I may consider just rebuilding mine. Or is there another good option out there?

Here is the issue rebuilding the double cardon. Only one manufacture makes the replacement ball and cap. Its cheap and will fail. You are able to source I believe OEM quality u joints for the rear but thats it.

1. Best option would be low mileage driveshaft from junk yard if you can find one. You can use a crowbar to pry and look for play in the u joints and CV.

2. Call these guys. High Angle Drivline-Call Jesse at 530-877-2875. They do an OEM rebuild and they will inspect the OEM CV joint. If its good they reuse it and its a cheaper rebuild. If its bad they source OEM toyota parts from a like CV joint that Toyota sells oem parts for and swap them in. Of coarse they wont give out the info on how they source this part or they could be pulling my chain. They quoted me few years back $150 for parts and labor if all u joints and CV needed rebuilt. Again they agreed that the aftermarket ball and cap for the CV is trash and fails rather quickly when installed on a lifted rig.

 

[JayRolla]

SUBSCRIBED.

I am right there with you except my front and rear vibrations are pretty much constant and repeatable. Been sorting through and trying to isolate these new, never had before highway vibration problems after recently having 3 u-joints replaced at the same time (in hindsight very bad idea since among other re-assembly issues the yokes are the same part for all 3 {think about it... all disassembled on a shop bench with no matchmarks lol}).

My understanding is that in 2016 parts are no longer available for rebuilding the double-cardan, I say this after reviewing TTORA, Pirate4x4, other forums.

Have you thought about:
* Test driving on only the front DS to see if the vibration goes away?
* Having rear DS checked and balanced?
* Are all your c-clips present and accounted for?
* Are factory DS balance weights present or missing leaving behind a surface rust dot?
* Are your front sway bushings fresh and un-split?
* Did your yokes get damaged in a vice during u-joint replacement, thus damaging the flanges later?
* Is your suspension shot?
* Are your tires fairly new and expert balanced on Hunter Road Force?
* Does your steering slip joint have the slop or did you weld-fix it?
* Brake issues?
* Proper grease types and not over or under greased?

From what I've seen, any or all of these can contribute to highway vibration, and if more than one issue are present, the results tend to become synergistic and sometimes intermittent, depending more on the road surface itself to bring out.

I've heard from Carolina Driveline that if you have a custom rear DS built you will lose some angle since nothing off the shelf will move as far as the factory double cardan. Do you hit full wheel stuff or droop often or want to? Maybe not an option then.

Hope this helps get the problem-solving process started.

Have you contacted these guys? High Angle Drivline-Call Jesse at 530-877-2875

Per my post above yours they said they can source OEM parts for the double cardon few years back. Back then the parts where not available also. Maybe he now is not able to source parts either?

 

[GangsterOfLove]

Of coarse they wont give out the info on how they source this part or they could be pulling my chain. They quoted me few years back $150 for parts and labor if all u joints and CV needed rebuilt. .

I paid $175 at a local driveline shop to have the work done along with balancing the driveshaft. (2wd). I didn't know about the variance in parts quality or what they used but it's working great for now. I suppose if it fails early I'll have them do it again.

One thing they told me, and something I have seen on this board many times, is that checking for slop in the u-joints is not a reliable indicator. There are several threads where various mechanics declare everything is fine only to change the u-joints later and have the problem go away. I wish I had known this earlier.

I sold my last (and much nicer) 3rd gen T4R on a road trip to Toronto when it developed driveline vibration in Ohio and a local, well regarded shop did all sorts of stuff to try and fix it to no avail. I asked about the driveshaft several times and they swore it looked good - which it probably did. Had I known then what I know now I would have had them replace the u-joints anyway. We rented a car and completed the trip.

The mechanic gave me a fair price for the truck, what with all of the repairs they did on it, but I still miss it. He was happy to get it - the whole shop gathered around to marvel at the rust-free undercarriage when they put it on the rack.

 

[JayRolla]

I paid $175 at a local driveline shop to have the work done along with balancing the driveshaft. (2wd). I didn't know about the variance in parts quality or what they used but it's working great for now. I suppose if it fails early I'll have them do it again.

One thing they told me, and something I have seen on this board many times, is that checking for slop in the u-joints is not a reliable indicator. There are several threads where various mechanics declare everything is fine only to change the u-joints later and have the problem go away. I wish I had known this earlier.

I sold my last (and much nicer) 3rd gen T4R on a road trip to Toronto when it developed driveline vibration in Ohio and a local, well regarded shop did all sorts of stuff to try and fix it to no avail. I asked about the driveshaft several times and they swore it looked good - which it probably did. Had I known then what I know now I would have had them replace the u-joints anyway. We rented a car and completed the trip.

The mechanic gave me a fair price for the truck, what with all of the repairs they did on it, but I still miss it. He was happy to get it - the whole shop gathered around to marvel at the rust-free undercarriage when they put it on the rack.

No checking for slop is not the best way to check them but when in the junk yard its better than nothing. You can really feel the slop in the CV joint. If you look inside the CV joint you can see the ball. If its shiny its most likely worn since the cap has come off.

I install non OEM u joints on a few vehicles. They all failed within a year. That was on an old bronco and few Mitsubishi's I owned.

 

[1985taylor1925]

The rubber bushing is for 2WD models.
Since you said you have 3 U-joints I suppose you have the 4WD axle.

Best way to go is find a good used drive shaft. If you want one, I have an extra that I keep for my truck and is in excellent condition.

It is for 96-98 models only (without the center diff lock)

I went though the same path as you. Finally got a good used drive shaft and no more vibrations! Whenever I come across a good drive shaft, I'll keep it without sending into the crusher. I sold many and no complains so far.

Are you positive the 4x4 rear driveshaft doesnt have the rubber bushing? How many miles on the used one you have for sale?

Remove the rear drive shaft and drive the vehicle in 4H. If you still have vibrations, it's not the rear drive shaft.

Youre not supposed to go much over 55mph in 4x4, so I wouldnt really be able to test this. The vibrations dont start until around 75mph.

 

[1985taylor1925]

Here is the issue rebuilding the double cardon. Only one manufacture makes the replacement ball and cap. Its cheap and will fail. You are able to source I believe OEM quality u joints for the rear but thats it.

1. Best option would be low mileage driveshaft from junk yard if you can find one. You can use a crowbar to pry and look for play in the u joints and CV.

2. Call these guys. High Angle Drivline-Call Jesse at 530-877-2875. They do an OEM rebuild and they will inspect the OEM CV joint. If its good they reuse it and its a cheaper rebuild. If its bad they source OEM toyota parts from a like CV joint that Toyota sells oem parts for and swap them in. Of coarse they wont give out the info on how they source this part or they could be pulling my chain. They quoted me few years back $150 for parts and labor if all u joints and CV needed rebuilt. Again they agreed that the aftermarket ball and cap for the CV is trash and fails rather quickly when installed on a lifted rig.

I would definitely prefer a used driveshaft for the price, I just know how you would have any idea if its good or not.

I'll look into highangledriveline. Do you know anything about Tom Wood driveshafts? Apparently theyre really strong parts, and with a good warranty.

 

[1985taylor1925]

I paid $175 at a local driveline shop to have the work done along with balancing the driveshaft. (2wd). I didn't know about the variance in parts quality or what they used but it's working great for now. I suppose if it fails early I'll have them do it again.

One thing they told me, and something I have seen on this board many times, is that checking for slop in the u-joints is not a reliable indicator. There are several threads where various mechanics declare everything is fine only to change the u-joints later and have the problem go away. I wish I had known this earlier.

I sold my last (and much nicer) 3rd gen T4R on a road trip to Toronto when it developed driveline vibration in Ohio and a local, well regarded shop did all sorts of stuff to try and fix it to no avail. I asked about the driveshaft several times and they swore it looked good - which it probably did. Had I known then what I know now I would have had them replace the u-joints anyway. We rented a car and completed the trip.

The mechanic gave me a fair price for the truck, what with all of the repairs they did on it, but I still miss it. He was happy to get it - the whole shop gathered around to marvel at the rust-free undercarriage when they put it on the rack.

Thats good to know. I had never read that on the forum. I could actually see a tiny bit of movement in the rear u joint before I replaced it. But after replacing it I still have the vibrations.

 

[JayRolla]

I would definitely prefer a used driveshaft for the price, I just know how you would have any idea if its good or not.

I'll look into highangledriveline. Do you know anything about Tom Wood driveshafts? Apparently theyre really strong parts, and with a good warranty.

Ive heard they are good, just nice to have that double cardon that allows up to 4" lift without adjusting anything. With the non cv jointed driveshaft you may need to adjust axle angles in rear to not bind up.

 

[absalom]

And you have definitely tried a new set of tires and wheels? I've seen quite a few guys chase vibe issues, myself included, only to find it was in fact the tires, but only after unnecessarily replacing the DS components.

The wheels and tires don't even need to be new, just anything different to check. In any case, definitely looking forward to a resolution on this one. I know you've been chasing similar issues to this for awhile now.

 

[1985taylor1925]

And you have definitely tried a new set of tires and wheels? I've seen quite a few guys chase vibe issues, myself included, only to find it was in fact the tires, but only after unnecessarily replacing the DS components.

The wheels and tires don't even need to be new, just anything different to check. In any case, definitely looking forward to a resolution on this one. I know you've been chasing similar issues to this for awhile now.

Yeah Ive gone through three sets of wheels and tires chasing that route, and had probably 10 balances done over the past 6 years.

The thing that really rules out wheel/tire balance to me is the fact that the vibs come and go while driving at a constant speed. Tire vibs are usually very consistent with unbalanced wheels/tires. And from my experience balance vibs are worst between 55 and 70, and gradually steady out when you get up to around 75-85. My vibs start at around 70, and get steadily worse from there. At 85 if feels like Im driving through an earthquake

 

[1985taylor1925]

Want to disagree. The UM I believe says don't engage 4WD over 55?

I've gone 75 and a little more in FWD. It's OK. Just make sure your front diff fluid is fresh and topped before you head out. No jackrabbit starts or crazy cornering and you should be fine. Pick cooler weather or time of day if you're extra concerned. Front diff gets hot but not burning hot. Nothing you wouldn't expect.

Im not entirely sure on that. But if its not an issue than Ill certainly try it. Maybe a few other members can chime in here. How fast can you go with front dif engaged?

 

[Andy in Pa]

Im not entirely sure on that. But if its not an issue than Ill certainly try it. Maybe a few other members can chime in here. How fast can you go with front dif engaged?

Assuming everything else is OK, there is no reason you can't take your 4R up to highway speeds on just the front driveshaft.

Before you take out the rear driveshaft, lay down under the truck and grab it with both hands just behind the double cardan joint and try to forcefully move it up and down. If it moves at all, but you see no movement in the u-joints at the double cardan, then its the ball/socket that is bad, and that is what is causing your vibes.

 

[GangsterOfLove]

My vibs start at around 70, and get steadily worse from there. At 85 if feels like Im driving through an earthquake

Any chance of putting it on a dyno and see what happens? Long shot - but you might be able to see something.

 

[1985taylor1925]

Assuming everything else is OK, there is no reason you can't take your 4R up to highway speeds on just the front driveshaft.

Before you take out the rear driveshaft, lay down under the truck and grab it with both hands just behind the double cardan joint and try to forcefully move it up and down. If it moves at all, but you see no movement in the u-joints at the double cardan, then its the ball/socket that is bad, and that is what is causing your vibes.

By ball/socket are you talking about the spline in the center? I never heard of a ball/socket on a driveshaft

 

[nissanh]

I did 75 MPH in 4WD hi for at least 60 miles on a highway. No issues.

There are 5 things spinning when the truck is moving those are four wheels and the drive shaft. After balancing the wheels if you still experience the vibrations it should be the drive shaft.

 

[JayRolla]

By ball/socket are you talking about the spline in the center? I never heard of a ball/socket on a driveshaft

Its a cv joint. Its got a ball/socket or ball and cap in the center of the double cardon joint.