Drum Brakes Size question

S

swampy_swimmer

New member
Probably silly question, but I feel that I need to replace rear brakes,
and searching rockauto gave me two options for drum and shoe kit:
297mm and 319mm for front discs.
both by Centric btw.
I have no idea what it means, shouldn't be drums be of the same size?

I have 2002 Sport Ed with 16" wheels.

I emailed this question to rockauto, but it's been over a week and no response.

Which size drums should I order, maybe someone here knows?

thanks.
 
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IMHO, just find a shop to turn your OEM drums. Should be $20 per side. Being in NY rust may play a big part in getting them off.

Use OEM shoes. Hardware kits can be found from Raybestoes, etc and will work well as long as everything moves freely. Sometimes the horseshoe washer may need to be reused, which is fine. Make sure neither cylinder is leaking. Apply some Fluid Film where needed to prevent rust and seizing.
 
LittleCaesar said:
IMHO, just find a shop to turn your OEM drums. Should be $20 per side. Being in NY rust may play a big part in getting them off.

Use OEM shoes. Hardware kits can be found from Raybestoes, etc and will work well as long as everything moves freely. Sometimes the horseshoe washer may need to be reused, which is fine. Make sure neither cylinder is leaking. Apply some Fluid Film where needed to prevent rust and seizing.
Click to expand...

My drums were turned at least once for the previous owner (I found that info on the toyota site, dealer's entry)
And my parking brake does not work at all. It doesn't hold the truck when engaged and put on drive without even depressing the gas pedal.
I'm not sure if it's a good idea to turn rotors more then once.
And on top of it all, I hear nasty screeching noise from the drums when push on the brakes when car is parked. Oh and my brake pedal is dangerously soft, even though I bleed them about a month ago, so it gives me an idea to replace the cylinders and entire rear brakes mechanisms. As my front pads and rotors were replaced less than 30,000 miles ago...
 
Second vote for turning the drums. Just did this a few weeks back since my drums were terribly pitted. Really helped out the brakes!

That way all you need to buy is new shoes and springs and reduces your costs. Drums should be able to be turned at least once with plenty of material left.

EDIT: Just saw your post. Take one off and bring it to a machine shop and see what they say. Or if you have a spare vehicle just take them both off and make up your mind at the shop. Should only be about $25-$30 per drum.
 
gamefreakgc said:
Second vote for turning the drums. Just did this a few weeks back since my drums were terribly pitted. Really helped out the brakes!

That way all you need to buy is new shoes and springs and reduces your costs. Drums should be able to be turned at least once with plenty of material left.

EDIT: Just saw your post. Take one off and bring it to a machine shop and see what they say. Or if you have a spare vehicle just take them both off and make up your mind at the shop. Should only be about $25-$30 per drum.
Click to expand...

Thanks. I do not have spare vehicle. And I'm pretty sure I need to replace the cylinders as well.
Are you suggesting to turn them simply because it's OEM part vs. the aftermarket cylinders? Because new Centric rotors would cost me about $40 each, and original that I have had been turned at least once already...
 
swampy_swimmer said:
Thanks. I do not have spare vehicle. And I'm pretty sure I need to replace the cylinders as well.
Are you suggesting to turn them simply because it's OEM part vs. the aftermarket cylinders? Because new Centric rotors would cost me about $40 each, and original that I have had been turned at least once already...
Click to expand...

I know these 4Runners eat aftermarket rotors for lunch up front. I have not heard of many using aftermarket drums on the rear, but it's pretty hard to warp a rear drum on these rigs so you might be ok. If it just comes down with $30 for turning them or $40 for a new drum you feel comfortable with, then just go for new drums. Like you are saying, you'll have all new parts and a fresh start.
 
Right, but I'm just not sure why Rockauto has two different sizes, and what does it mean?
And which size should I order?
I noticed that they sell rear brake kits only by Centric, and only Centric has 2 different sizes, if I choose drums by Raybestos or AC Delco for instance, they only come in one size.
Maybe I'll just order drums and shoes separately.
 
swampy_swimmer said:
Right, but I'm just not sure why Rockauto has two different sizes, and what does it mean?
And which size should I order?
I noticed that they sell rear brake kits only by Centric, and only Centric has 2 different sizes, if I choose drums by Raybestos or AC Delco for instance, they only come in one size.
Maybe I'll just order drums and shoes separately.
Click to expand...

There's a 15" wheel option for some 4Runners. I'm guessing that's the smaller size you are seeing, but I don't know exact measurements. I'd go with the larger size.
 
swampy_swimmer said:
My drums were turned at least once for the previous owner (I found that info on the toyota site, dealer's entry)
And my parking brake does not work at all. It doesn't hold the truck when engaged and put on drive without even depressing the gas pedal.
I'm not sure if it's a good idea to turn rotors more then once.
And on top of it all, I hear nasty screeching noise from the drums when push on the brakes when car is parked. Oh and my brake pedal is dangerously soft, even though I bleed them about a month ago, so it gives me an idea to replace the cylinders and entire rear brakes mechanisms. As my front pads and rotors were replaced less than 30,000 miles ago...
Click to expand...

I would double check everything. I don't know how miles its got on the brakes, but they will go a LONG ways. maybe they just need adjusted, or the park brake cables needs addressed. the shoes and drums may be fine.


I looked it up on rockauto, the difference is in the wheel cylinder. its the same drum, but depending on what front brakes it has, it will have different size wheel cylinders. 15" uses 13/16", and 16" wheel uses 7/8".

so yours would use the 125D.
 
swampy_swimmer said:
I have no idea what it means, shouldn't be drums be of the same size?
Click to expand...

The drums are the same size for both, both kits use the CENTRIC 12244022 drum. The hardware kits and shoes are also the same.

The difference in the two kits is the wheel cylinder being used - one uses the CENTRIC 13444709, the other the CENTRIC 13444737.

To see which one to get, look at your front calipers. If the casting says S13WM, then use CENTRIC 13444709 wheel cylinders. If it says S12WE, then use the CENTRIC 13444737.
 
Oh, I see now. Thank you.
I guess if 16” wheels I should use larger size, but I will definitely check. Larger slave cylinder makes more sense on larger wheels.
 
Unless you have serious gouging in them, get the OEM turned. Believe me, there is plenty of material there.

If the bell cranks are seized, get them loose and use fluid film when finished to prevent when seizing.

Toyota offers a rebuild cylinder kit, my friend used some new Beck Arnleys on his years ago and they worked fine for him.

Until you can take the drums off, don’t assume too much. Make sure you have a BFH close by.
 
LittleCaesar said:
Unless you have serious gouging in them, get the OEM turned. Believe me, there is plenty of material there.

If the bell cranks are seized, get them loose and use fluid film when finished to prevent when seizing.

Toyota offers a rebuild cylinder kit, my friend used some new Beck Arnleys on his years ago and they worked fine for him.

Until you can take the drums off, don’t assume too much. Make sure you have a BFH close by.
Click to expand...

Can BFH crack the drums at full swing? Cast iron can be pretty fragile... Shouldn’t I use rubber mallet instead?
 
If they are stuck on by rust, no. Drums are pretty hardy. I hope you do have some M8x1.25 screws to aid in taking off the drums.
 
To those who say their ebrake doesn’t work. You can try readjusting the shoes on the drum. Especially if you off road.
 
So I opened my rear brakes past weekend for the first time of owning the truck.
A little horror…
Took some BFH and M8 bolts work, but they came off.
Everything is completely rusted, both cylinders are shot and fluid sprays out of them when pedal depressed. No wonder my pedal is so soft regardless of me bleeding it. Self-adjusting mechanisms are completely seized. Shoes rusted to the point that they don’t even compress back, I think rust was holding them.
I essentially have had no rear brakes for very long time.
The drums are rusted, but after I measured them they look like they still within the specked 295 mm. One drum has very rough inner surface, I suspect that brake was not working much longer than the other.
So, I’m thinking of replacing everything except the drums, I will ask a shop if they could turn them.

I know most would suggest OEM parts, but what is the second best option here? I’m talking about shoes, cylinders, springs and self-adjusters. Can you recommend a manufacturer?
 

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Unless there are serious grooves in the drums, just get them turned. Make sure and try and knock as much rust off the inside of the face that attaches to the axle.

Raybestos hold down springs, cylinders, and the like is what we used on my friend’s brothers drums in 2009. The only thing I recommended we keep OEM are the shoes and drums. And try and reuse the OEM bleeder screws.

Do you own a right angle grinder and compressor? It would help.

Presoak the hard line connectors to the existing cylinders before trying to remove them carefully. Also the bell cracks, which I imagine are seized.

Make sure the star adjuster turns freely before putting it all back together.

Invest in at least one can of Fluid Film for when you are done.
 
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