Elocker retrofit and regearing

[tS_kStin]

Hey guys, I tried to do a search on this but didnt see much of what I am thinking about.

So I do not know squat about diffs aside from mine is open and a 4:10 and I want a locker. I am probably still going to go the route of an aussie for the $ benifit of it however I am still looking at doing an elocker retofit, however chances are is that it is going to be a 4:30 if I understand correctly...

My question is: Could I just regear the elocker with the 4:10s out of my open diff or does that not work? I mostly don't want to deal with getting into my front diff to regear that to a 4:30 to match a locker. There is probably a reason I have not seen this done but figured I would ask cause to a person like me who does not understand diffs and gearing well it seems like it would work to just take the ring and pinion out of my diff and stick it in the elocker diff....

Still have not pulled the trigger on any locker yet, currently checking prices of places to have the backlash set if I go aussie.

 

[Mark_BC]

From what I hear the gears are not compatible between locker and non-locker. To avoid regearing the front diff you can just swap that out too to match the back, get both form the same donor car. I have mine but haven't put it in yet, apparently it is a pain to drop the front diff but easier than removing it + cracking it open.

 

[kolelt]

From what I hear the gears are not compatible between locker and non-locker. To avoid regearing the front diff you can just swap that out too to match the back, get both form the same donor car. I have mine but haven't put it in yet, apparently it is a pain to drop the front diff but easier than removing it + cracking it open.

Jack up the engine just a little. It will make your removal and installation much easier.

 

[AxleIke]

Hey guys, I tried to do a search on this but didnt see much of what I am thinking about.

So I do not know squat about diffs aside from mine is open and a 4:10 and I want a locker. I am probably still going to go the route of an aussie for the $ benifit of it however I am still looking at doing an elocker retofit, however chances are is that it is going to be a 4:30 if I understand correctly...

My question is: Could I just regear the elocker with the 4:10s out of my open diff or does that not work? I mostly don't want to deal with getting into my front diff to regear that to a 4:30 to match a locker. There is probably a reason I have not seen this done but figured I would ask cause to a person like me who does not understand diffs and gearing well it seems like it would work to just take the ring and pinion out of my diff and stick it in the elocker diff....

Still have not pulled the trigger on any locker yet, currently checking prices of places to have the backlash set if I go aussie.

If it were me, I'd just look around online for a third gen with an automatic being parted. If it has the locker, grab the front and rear diffs out of it.

My 99 came with a rear locker stock, but I wanted deeper gears when I went to the larger tires, so I swapped in a locker from a limited and the front diff as well. Took about 3 hours to swap everything.

 

[AxleIke]

Jack up the engine just a little. It will make your removal and installation much easier.

No, there is a much easier way. Go buy a 30 dollar air hammer from somewhere. The rear stud is what makes these a pain, but it is just lightly pressed into the hole with splines, similar to a wheel stud.

Remove the allen nut on the rear stud, loosen the front two mounts. but don't remove them. Then use the air hammer to pop the rear stud up. It won't come out, but it will go up nearly an inch, and will be loose in the hole. get a floor jack under it. Then, remove the front two mounting bolts and the whole thing will just rotate out.

Once the axles and everything are clear, the diff removal takes about 5 mins and is super easy.

Only took me 3 times pulling a diff to figure that out. LOL

 

[rkntoy]

From what I hear the gears are not compatible between locker and non-locker. To avoid regearing the front diff you can just swap that out too to match the back, get both form the same donor car. I have mine but haven't put it in yet, apparently it is a pain to drop the front diff but easier than removing it + cracking it open.

Pretty sure the ring and pinions are the same - every part list I have looked at lists the same part numbers between the regular and e-locker.

+1 on grabbing the matching front if you get a 4.30 e-locker rear. They usually throw them in cheap. My last two have been $50.

 

[tS_kStin]

From what I hear the gears are not compatible between locker and non-locker. To avoid regearing the front diff you can just swap that out too to match the back, get both form the same donor car. I have mine but haven't put it in yet, apparently it is a pain to drop the front diff but easier than removing it + cracking it open.

That's what I was afraid of... Yeah I am wanting to get a donor car to do both diffs but being up in MT it is hard trying to find one cause of a low population in general with an even lower number of wrecked 4runners...

If it were me, I'd just look around online for a third gen with an automatic being parted. If it has the locker, grab the front and rear diffs out of it.

My 99 came with a rear locker stock, but I wanted deeper gears when I went to the larger tires, so I swapped in a locker from a limited and the front diff as well. Took about 3 hours to swap everything.

Yeah thats the ideal way, I am having a hard time finding one within a reasonable distance from me.

Only 3 hrs to do both front and rear diffs? That seems very impressive. Of course I would have to do all the wiring and such but still, I would expect a much bigger day than just 3 hrs to at least swap diffs.

 

[idlingmike]

I've done a bunch of research on this very thing, so I'll save you the time. First, the conclusion I came to is an ARB locker doesn't end up being much more and is probably worth it.

If you have 4.10 gearing currently and don't want to regear your front diff, your only options are 1) Complete rear axle/diff from a manual trans 4Runner with E-locker. Hard to find, but not impossible. 2) Axle housing from any elocker 3rd gen 4Rrunner + swap in the actual diff and locker from a Tacoma (where 4.10's are the norm). The axle from a Tacoma will not fit because use leaf springs. 3) Get one of the above 4.10 elocker diffs and modify your existing axle housing. You'll still need the ecu & harness or 3rd party harness which is about $150.

Unless you're going to do it yourself and your time isn't worth much If you add up all the little bits and pieces, you're towards the price of an ARB including the more difficult part of the installation.

 

[tS_kStin]

Pretty sure the ring and pinions are the same - every part list I have looked at lists the same part numbers between the regular and e-locker.

+1 on grabbing the matching front if you get a 4.30 e-locker rear. They usually throw them in cheap. My last two have been $50.

But if the ring and pinions are the same couldn't I change the locker to a 4:10 if I wasn't able to get the front diff as well.. or just didn't want to deal with the front diff.......

 

[tS_kStin]

I've done a bunch of research on this very thing, so I'll save you the time. First, the conclusion I came to is an ARB locker doesn't end up being much more and is probably worth it.

If you have 4.10 gearing currently and don't want to regear your front diff, your only options are 1) Complete rear axle/diff from a manual trans 4Runner with E-locker. Hard to find, but not impossible. 2) Axle housing from any elocker 3rd gen 4Rrunner + swap in the actual diff and locker from a Tacoma (where 4.10's are the norm). The axle from a Tacoma will not fit because use leaf springs. 3) Get one of the above 4.10 elocker diffs and modify your existing axle housing. You'll still need the ecu & harness or 3rd party harness which is about $150.

Unless you're going to do it yourself and your time isn't worth much If you add up all the little bits and pieces, you're towards the price of an ARB including the more difficult part of the installation.

Yeah i'd be able to do most of the work myself (I do not have much time or $$$ but my time is much easier for me to spend ) but I do not want to deal with setting up the gears, so i'd have to have a shop do that because I do not feel comfortable with trannys and diffs. Everything else I will deal with for the most part.

If it is getting that close to an ARB I would probably have to go the auto locker route cause I am not going to be using a locker all that much anyways with the types of trails that I go on with the group I am in along with I am hiking more weekends than wheeling.

 

[AxleIke]

But if the ring and pinions are the same couldn't I change the locker to a 4:10 if I wasn't able to get the front diff as well.. or just didn't want to deal with the front diff.......

You can. The gears are the same.

I don't usually do that because setting up used gears in a different third so they don't whine is harder than new gears. Not impossible, just more difficult. I know people who can do it but I've never had luck with it.

Whining isn't that big a deal unless it bugs you to have the noise.

Bottom line, you can definitely go that route. It'll cost more than a simple swap as I would not recommend going through the hassle of swapping gears without new bearings, etc.

If you don't want to regear, a taco diff is a great way to go.

 

[kolelt]

No, there is a much easier way. Go buy a 30 dollar air hammer from somewhere. The rear stud is what makes these a pain, but it is just lightly pressed into the hole with splines, similar to a wheel stud.

Remove the allen nut on the rear stud, loosen the front two mounts. but don't remove them. Then use the air hammer to pop the rear stud up. It won't come out, but it will go up nearly an inch, and will be loose in the hole. get a floor jack under it. Then, remove the front two mounting bolts and the whole thing will just rotate out.

Once the axles and everything are clear, the diff removal takes about 5 mins and is super easy.

Only took me 3 times pulling a diff to figure that out. LOL

Oh, well I just jacked up tiny bit in the engine. And it went right in over the top bolt. In case you don't have a air hammer

 

[Yoter]

I cannot speak from personal experience but I have heard that the factory 4.10 gears are stronger and less prone to breakage than the 4.30 gears.

 

[tS_kStin]

Another question... Is it possible for me to not do a wiring harness or anything to wiring in "factory" but instead just get my own switches and custom wire it? I know I won't have to fancy dash light but that is alright with me.

 

[AxleIke]

That's what I was afraid of... Yeah I am wanting to get a donor car to do both diffs but being up in MT it is hard trying to find one cause of a low population in general with an even lower number of wrecked 4runners...



Yeah thats the ideal way, I am having a hard time finding one within a reasonable distance from me.

Only 3 hrs to do both front and rear diffs? That seems very impressive. Of course I would have to do all the wiring and such but still, I would expect a much bigger day than just 3 hrs to at least swap diffs.

I've pulled a few, which helps. It'll take you longer to swap a rear housing, since I was only swapping the third, the rear goes quickly. I was going off of getting the truck driving again, as you don't need wiring. I also had the new stuff cleaned and prepped and new seals in the front ready to go. And I used an impact gun taking everything off.

I will make the caveat that mine is nearly rust free (spent a long time finding it, lol). If you have rust, it's a different story.

I was just thinking of a cheaper, easier option. Obviously if there aren't any around, it won't work. I paid 500 for the front and rear together.

 

[AxleIke]

I cannot speak from personal experience but I have heard that the factory 4.10 gears are stronger and less prone to breakage than the 4.30 gears.

I don't know about that. Maybe. It won't matter at the power and tire size most folks run. If you are trying to run 40s on 8" mini truck axles, then perhaps it's something to worry about. I've never come across anyone having that issue.

Another question... Is it possible for me to not do a wiring harness or anything to wiring in "factory" but instead just get my own switches and custom wire it? I know I won't have to fancy dash light but that is alright with me.

Yes. Its the easiest way to do it if you are retrofitting.

 

[Yoter]

Below is the thread where someone mentioned the strength thing, again I am only repeating what I have heard and I do not have any first hand experience with this. I do remember reading this elsewhere as well but cant find the link right now.....

http://www.toyota-4runner.org/3rd-g...erning-regearing-4-56-4-88-a.html#post2391380

 

[rkntoy]

Not sure I would call not using the factory 4x4ECU and switch easier if you grab the stock parts and they are thrown in when you buy the axle. Having done both routes I thought it was easier plugging in 2 plugs and running six wires and connecting them than the completely from scratch route.

I also heard from someone I trust (and that works on Toyotas a ton) that he had seen more of the actuation motors burn out when the stock parts are not used. That made me try the Toyota parts route and it was too easy.

 

[JWaldz]

The ONLY difference in a open V6 3rd and a elocker 3rd (aside from the obvious diff and housing shape) is that the carrier bearing on the driver side is larger to accommodation the shift mechanism. Everything else is the same.

So yes, you could put 4.10's in a elocker housing. I don't see why you would want to though. The cost of gears, install kit, and labor to do so would be more expensive then just getting a matching front diff with 4.30's in it. Swapping 4.10's in would be easier, I suppose, as the front diff swap can be a tedious job. If you're willing to put in the work though, you'd be better off and save money swapping out front diffs. 4.30 fronts are cheap. There's nothing special about them other than the fact that people need them to match rear swaps.

 

[AxleIke]

The ONLY difference in a open V6 3rd and a elocker 3rd (aside from the obvious diff and housing shape) is that the carrier bearing on the driver side is larger to accommodation the shift mechanism. Everything else is the same.

So yes, you could put 4.10's in a elocker housing. I don't see why you would want to though. The cost of gears, install kit, and labor to do so would be more expensive then just getting a matching front diff with 4.30's in it. Swapping 4.10's in would be easier, I suppose, as the front diff swap can be a tedious job. If you're willing to put in the work though, you'd be better off and save money swapping out front diffs. 4.30 fronts are cheap. There's nothing special about them other than the fact that people need them to match rear swaps.

The front is not bad if you pop the stud like I said. You don't need an air hammer if you can get the truck up enough to hit it with a punch and hammer. I find air tools easier, but its not required.