Florida School Shooting

[mscot]

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-new...ng-obama-era-gun-checks-people-mental-n727221


This along with impending cuts to Medicaid and Medicare shows where our current regimes heads are.


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[Xhado]

People on the no-fly list are able to buy.

There are huge issues with the no-fly list which make it a very bad benchmark for restricting rights.

 

[Bumbo]

There are huge issues with the no-fly list which make it a very bad benchmark for restricting rights.

I see where ur going with that... perhaps its the catchy slogan someone came up with that stuck in my head...

"No Fly No Buy"

Maybe I don't understand well enough how a background check actually works, but from the standpoint of someone who lives in CA... you can't even buy a box of ammo without some sort of licence or purchase permit.

I don't know how its done in other states, but here, the only thing I hear about are restrictions on top of restrictions in CA. The bump-fire stock is already illegal here. So is a regular magazine release on an AR, making it a fixed magazine.

 

[ran]

why can't the crazies pick up a pump shotgun. hope my CAR-15 upper hasn't gone up in price.

 

[jordanrb81]

I see where ur going with that... perhaps its the catchy slogan someone came up with that stuck in my head...

"No Fly No Buy"

Maybe I don't understand well enough how a background check actually works, but from the standpoint of someone who lives in CA... you can't even buy a box of ammo without some sort of licence or purchase permit.

I don't know how its done in other states, but here, the only thing I hear about are restrictions on top of restrictions in CA. The bump-fire stock is already illegal here. So is a regular magazine release on an AR, making it a fixed magazine.

wait... you can't even buy ammo? wow in NH you can buy as much as you like, they don't even ID you.. I was doing a group shoot and I bought 3 350 round boxes of .40 cal that's just over 1,000 round as Bass Pro in addition to feeling a little strange walking up to the registers I assumed that I may have to fill out a form or something nope didn't have to show an id or answer a question the cashier who I think was 22 said, wow looks like you're about to go have some fun, almost like she was flirting. welcome to the "Live Free or Die" state

 

[Bumbo]

wait... you can't even buy ammo? wow in NH you can buy as much as you like, they don't even ID you.. I was doing a group shoot and I bought 3 350 round boxes of .40 cal that's just over 1,000 round as Bass Pro in addition to feeling a little strange walking up to the registers I assumed that I may have to fill out a form or something nope didn't have to show an id or answer a question the cashier who I think was 22 said, wow looks like you're about to go have some fun, almost like she was flirting. welcome to the "Live Free or Die" state

Sure, I remember those days. 1000 rounds was like one or two good range trips with a couple friends. Literally no different than hitting a bucket of balls or two at the golf driving range. Now, you look like a crazy man if you want to buy that amount.

Firearms are very restricted in CA... lots of new laws on the books as of 2018.

https://rocketffl.com/california-ammunition-law-2018-explained/

Google the laws surrounding 2018 AR-15 registration, featureless conversions, and Pistol Roster Microstamping if you want your mind blown.

The AR-15 as you understand it in your state, is already banned and illegal to own in CA.

Also... there is no such thing as a gun-show loophole in CA, regardless of what the media says. ALL firearms transactions are subject to background check and must go though a licensed FFL.

 

[vlad drac]

what would happen if he pulled the fire alarm, everyone ran outside to the curb and then he plowed them down with a truck

Just out of curiosity how old are you?

It's a legit question - If this kid had an accomplice that pulled the fire alarm, and he drove a truck into the gathering crowd outside and killed a bunch of kids, would you be blaming the truck?

 

[swampdodo]

https://www.washingtonpost.com/loca...1d91fcec3fe_story.html?utm_term=.43c08976e47d

 

[hikenbike]

Yes, guns can be better controlled. It requires more intrusion. We need to be more intrusive and nobody with guns who owns them responsibly will have a problem with it. It will prevent these events. Period. If they are "still out there and available illegally" then laws and their enforcement get support and investment to eradicate.


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[Rightside Up]

Yes, guns can be better controlled. It requires more intrusion. We need to be more intrusive and nobody with guns who owns them responsibly will have a problem with it. It will prevent these events. Period. If they are "still out there and available illegally" then laws and their enforcement get support and investment to eradicate.


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Wow!

 

[RCFJ]

How the rest of the world sees people like you. You are afflicted with a cultural disease. And the rest of us suffer for it.

 

[jordanrb81]

Sure, I remember those days. 1000 rounds was like one or two good range trips with a couple friends. Literally no different than hitting a bucket of balls or two at the golf driving range. Now, you look like a crazy man if you want to buy that amount.

Firearms are very restricted in CA... lots of new laws on the books as of 2018.

https://rocketffl.com/california-ammunition-law-2018-explained/

Google the laws surrounding 2018 AR-15 registration, featureless conversions, and Pistol Roster Microstamping if you want your mind blown.

The AR-15 as you understand it in your state, is already banned and illegal to own in CA.

Also... there is no such thing as a gun-show loophole in CA, regardless of what the media says. ALL firearms transactions are subject to background check and must go though a licensed FFL.

I am totally cool with that last part... never really understood how that was allowed to happen. you can't buy guns... well except here, here you can and no one will know. Like WTF plus it give excellent fodder for people who like to say things like our current laws around background checks should be enforces, yeah they should, so why is there still a gun show loop hole? boggles the mind really. I know to my south in Massachusetts the gun regulations are very different. I have always sort of passively wondered what happens if I move there... example you cannot have a handgun in MA that holds more than 10 rounds, my Springfield XD-40 holds 12 but I bought it legally while a resident of NH, so if I move to MA am I just immediately breaking the law, or is it grandfathered.

 

[Gunslinger-13]

You can’t arrest someone for liking guns and being a white supremacist coward, unfortunately.

You'd prefer that an unpopular opinion and liking - specific object you don't like be an arrestsble offense?

Holy cow, man! Talk about authoritarian fascist BS!

People used to like freedom. What the FVCK happened to this country!

 

[ndcent]

You'd prefer that an unpopular opinion and liking - specific object you don't like be an arrestsble offense?

Holy cow, man! Talk about authoritarian fascist BS!

People used to like freedom. What the FVCK happened to this country!

Unfortunate in the sense that a bunch of kids died as a result. Yay, freedom.

Authoritarian fascist BS is Trump calling people who didn’t clap for him treasonous, but that’s for another thread.

 

[AKmoney]

Coupla thoughts from an armchair quarterback after having my morning coffee..

We can't get rid of guns. They're out there. There's no putting the toothpaste back in the tube. Any effort to confiscate firearms at this point would only result in the disarmament of law abiding citizens. The bad guys will never give them up, and a world where only the bad guys have the guns isn't a world I want to live in. I'm not sure why some people can't understand this.

On July 14, 2016, a terrorist in Nice, France used a cargo truck to kill 86 people and injure over 450 others. I'm not a math major, but by my count this guy quickly and efficiently killed 28 more people than Mr. Paddock did in Las Vegas without using a single firearm. Observation: A determined, mentally deranged individual is going to wreak havoc one way or another, with or without using a firearm.

According to the CDC, 9 people die every day due to vehicle accidents caused by distracted driving. In the year 2016, on average, 102 people died every day in traffic accidents.

In 2017, 625 people were murdered via firearm in the City of Chicago, despite strict regulations on gun ownership within the city.

Just gotta keep perspective.

EDIT: The guy in France did have a weapon, but it would appear very few, if any of the victims died as a result of being shot.

 

[Bumbo]

Yes, guns can be better controlled. It requires more intrusion. We need to be more intrusive and nobody with guns who owns them responsibly will have a problem with it. It will prevent these events. Period. If they are "still out there and available illegally" then laws and their enforcement get support and investment to eradicate.


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I am trying to understand your post...

Maybe something is getting lost in translation here, but what do you mean by "more intrusion"?

Part of what you are saying almost sounds like some type of systematic disarming of people, and a blatant violation of 4th amendment rights.

That sir would be a tall order because it would literally be history repeating itself...

 

[Gunslinger-13]

I'd like to respond to every illogical emotional anti-gun post herein. But what's the use?

No one should be dictating anyone else's needs. Period. No one should speak on behalf of an entire segment of the population as if you can project your opinions and notions on to them.

Reality: guns aren't going anywhere. You want restrictions? You will likely get them slowly over a long period of time as has been happening for decades... and mass murders will still happen. Evil people will still do evil things.

The insanity of the anti gun crowd is ludicrous. Keep banning things and restricting things and it doesn't do ANYTHiNG! But let's keep doing the same thing even though it does nothing!

So what do you do? Double down and ask for more "something" to be done because obviously "we didn' do enough" with that last round of legislation.

Honest question- those of you wanting more restrictions/ what specific legislation would you pass to have stopped this or any other mass shooting from taking place?

Think about it and be specific. I'd really like to know. Because absolutely none of what's been proposed would have done anything to stop any mass shooting from happening!!!

Meanwhile states with the greatest access to firearms and constitutional carry are the safest places with the least crime!!! Go figure criminals who don't follow laws flock to places that restrict the law abididing from defending themselves. Mass shooters always got to gun free zones. That sign sure stopped the evil man from bringing ina gun right, and everyone who follows the sign is safer for not having a way to defend themselves in these zones, right?

Reality- Guns aren't going away.

The AR-15 is the most popular firearm in America and yet it's the handgun that the OVERWHELMING majority of people are murdered with.

Anyone with motivation and training can wreak havoc with any firearm. The difference in rates of fire between a 30 round magazine and a 5 round magazine are virtually meaningless with training. You lose a few tenths of a second changing magazines is all. Nothing substantial.

Not to mention if all Guns just, poof, disappeared tomorrow morning, mass murders would still take place and likely be worse.

Guns are actually very inefficient mass killing devices compared to bombs and fires.

A few Molotov cocktails lobbed into the classrooms of a school would kill hundreds! A bomb could take out the entire school.

This vitriol towards Guns and gun owners is misplaced.

Some more reality- most LE agencies have very little funds to train their LEO's.

Qualification for firearms is a joke. Typically 100-300 rounds per year fired at 15 yards to qualify.

It's common for non gun folks to think all police and military are expert shooters. It's not the case.

I train LE, military and non LE and Non Military citizens alike. There is few differences except usually the non LE/military have more money to spend on training and gear!!! So they have an edge on their LE and military counterparts because LE and military careers pays dick unless you are top brass beauracrat dip shits!

If the idea that most people with CCW's are untrained morons were true we'd see it in negligent discharges and accidental murders- yet we don't!

In fact, by the numbers fewer people die in citizen involved shootings versus LE involved shootings, by more than half!

It's for obvious reasons. The LEO's can't be everywhere at all times to return fire the second something goes down, but the citizen who carries is there and can return fire immediately. It saves lives.

What is always lost on the anti gun crowd is that guns save far more lives than they take and provide force multipliers for woman so they can better defend against rape and assault.

You keep trying to ram gun control down our throats while it keeps failing to do any good when enacted . Pat yourself on the back while the problem gets worse and the divide in this country widens.

Keep focusing on an inanimate object instead of the real problem and no solution will be found. Because you've tried so many forms of gun control and restrictions that have failed, you must keep doing the same thing and the end result will change right? That's literal insanity!

So really answer my question- what legislation and restriction would have stopped this or any other mass shooting from happening? Be specific and let's debate it.

All you anti gun folks should go to the range and educate yourselves. It's obvious what most of you believe about tuns comes directly from Hollywood and the MSM. It's bollocks!

I'd gladly take any of you out and show you why a bumpstock is rediculius and the rate of fire is barely higher than firing without one, but accuracy goes out the window with them.

I'll show you how a show strong can do the same thing as a bump stock. Yep, a .50 cent shoe string can do the exact same thing. Better ban those evil shoe strings quick! And forget about twine, that evil stuff can cause a semi auto gun to turn into a baby killing machine in less than a minute!!!! Ban it!!!

I'd gladly show you a tactical magazine change that takes a tenth of a second and show you how shooting 150 rounds with 30 round magazines is virtually No different than shooting 150 rounds with 10 round magazines.

I'd gladly show you how fast a trained individual can take grand dads bolt or lever action rifle and be extremely accurate, reload incredibly quickly and get back on target.

Heck, I'll show you how I could take 10 single shot shot guns and shoot almost as fat as a 10 round shotgun.

If you really want to talk about guns- learn about them first. Half of what is posited about them is patently false or completely misunderstood.

It's like a bunch of neanderthals trying to tell quantum physicists how quantum mechanics works with virtually zero understanding of what they are speaking of.

And by the way- the founding fathers knew exactly the meaning and intent of utilizing the verbiage "Well regulated".

 

[BackOff]

The major issue no one ever wants to talk about is the fact that the world has already changed. And not for the better in my eyes.
This planet 'EARTH' that we all live on has had the population doubled in the last 50 years. That increase strains every part of our world.
That FL school...3000 kids. That's like a small town.

Less freedoms and more control are the only way to keep most in line.
A 'police state' and all would feel safe? Not me.

As an example, here in Central Oregon.
Last August, the local constabulary decided it was in their best interests to encrypt all radio communication. Can no longer hear what the cops are up to. They sighted 'officer safety' as the reason.
So now I cant hear about all the robberies, meth heads doing stupid shit and all the attempted suicides. We had a couple crazy car chases around that I had listened to. People do some really dumb stuff.

Also... no matter what you jack the gun prices up to, the bad guy can still get what they want. They don't play by the same rules as the rest of a deff/dumb/blind socially accepted society. They can steal or whip up a batch of meth, then go buy anything they want.
It just makes it harder for legal individuals trying to feed their 5 kids and go to church.

Elon Musk save us!

 

[Gunslinger-13]

Unfortunate in the sense that a bunch of kids died as a result. Yay, freedom.

Authoritarian fascist BS is Trump calling people who didn’t clap for him treasonous, but that’s for another thread.

What are you even talking about?

The FBI had 2 separate tips that this kid literally threatened shoot up the school and didn't investigate. They didn't even follow simple protocol.

But we should imprison people for their opinions and what objects they like?

Wait till an object and opinion you like become verboten and you get on a list.

That's a slippery slope. An ignorant ideal that basically turns us all into slaves to be dealt with by the state as they see fit without due process or even a crime being committed.

Can't even make one post without Trump in it! Do you secretly have a Trump crush? Trump-phobic perhaps?

 

[Bumbo]

Even if we banned all guns, mass murders and evil people won't stop. You'd have to ban gasoline, glass bottles, cotton cloth, vehicles, knives, machine shops, metal, plastic, 3D printers, fertilizer, Ammonia, etc.

.

You could ban all those things AND MORE, and there would still be guns. You can ban ammo too, and people would just make that as well, which they already do now anyways... casting bullets out of lead wheel weights on your tires.

People are smart, people are resourceful. It blows me mind what people can do. Both good and bad. If there is a will, there is a way.

Just look at this... "shit shovel AK"

Someone build an AK out of a shovel... the receiver is home made, which is the legal part that is considered the firearm. Everything else is just parts.

https://www.northeastshooters.com/xen/threads/diy-shovel-ak-photo-tsunami-warning.179192/

just wow