Getting serious about off-road navigation

[Bumbo]

Been needing some serious off-road nav for a while, and wanted a Lowrance setup but it was almost impossible to justify the cost of a dedicated unit

Lowrance
HDS-7 Live Multifunction Off Road GPS Baja Bundle By Lowrance

I kicked around the iPad idea and after running with some friends who use iPad mini in their sports UTVs. Pretty impressed they could hold their own in that environment. I decided on the iPad Pro 11" with cellular to get a true GPS receiver.

My friends are currently using Motion X, but does anyone have any experience with the application options? I found these two that also look popular.

LeadNav

Best 4x4 App - Offline Offroad and Overlanding Trail Maps | Gaia GPS

MotionX GPS HD on the App Store

 

[dade73]

I have been looking into this as well. Which is why I am looking at the android head unit swap. This way I can run Gaia or other software app directly on the head unit without needing another device to clutter up the dash. plus I have torque pro so I could blue tooth all that data in a heads up live feed.

I am waiting to see others reviews before I jump on that.

 

[Bumbo]

I like the idea of having something in dash. Not sure if Apple CarPlay has any support for what I am trying to do here, ill have to look into it.

Being able to use the iPad Pro which appears to be a pretty capable device for other tasks. Lots of value for the “other tasks” portion like adding the ability for video editing, which I wanted to start doing for 4Runner and project videos to share, seems like a good use of cash. Especially when you consider I would have just about spent the same on the Lowrance and still had to deal with the same challenges with mounting/install.

Either way, been hearing a bunch of good stuff about Gaia, but the LeadNav has peaked my curiosity. I think that’s what the KOH 4Runner was running as well. I like that I can connect it to the Iridium sat network for real time positioning. Considering I wanted the Sat communicator anyways, might be another check box for LeadNav.

 

[dade73]

yeah GPS live tracking is a huge plus. That's kinda why I was looking at the Samsung e tablet. But it doesn't transmit. Right now im not that in depth into it. right now just at the collections of info and options stage.

 

[Bluesky 07]

Here’s my setup in case anything there is helpful in making your choice.

 

[4Reak Show]

Still pretty new to the whole scene, so grain of salt with any of my input:
The Gaia app is pretty badass to use on my cell phone at least. Only crummy part is that to retain the maps for "off the grid" use (which I believe means no cell towers) you need to not only buy a yearly subscription (only like $20 but still a thing to know) but also actually draw out a map and save it to your device to use it off the grid. This means you need to be on the grid, and potentially save a huge ass map to use for a large trip.

This isn't a big deal if you're just gonna run one well known trail in one day. Done and done. But what happens if you have a multi day adventure planned, and some roads are closed? So you need to detour but your detours aren't on the "saved" map you did the week before? Maybe someone else can chime in on that part.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Bumbo]

I got my iPad pro last night, what an amazing device… got Gaia, Motion X GPS, and even LumaFusion video editing software which is amazing… Handles 4k video editing smoothly. I am impressed.

I have not bought it yet, but reading I learned LeadNav is pretty expensive, nice but expensive because you have to dump money into the app annually to really get benefit of satellite imagery and other features.

A friend who uses Motion X showed me how to get google sat images into the thing, downloaded for off-line use, along with other map types which could be useful.

With 512 GB, more than adequate to download large areas of places I generally visit. I will most likely run this until I find a deficiency, but I think it a good setup. It does car to car positioning with cellular, but I can always use ham radio / APRS to accomplish something similar. Not as convenient, but it works if I need it.

Gaia looks good too, but I like the "one and done" aspect of Motion X. Maps on in the device, dont have to worry about subscriptions.

Now to figure out my ram mounting situation.

 

[RonJR]

I have a Samsung android tablet, with cellular data and GPS capability. I mounted it with a pro-clip mount that fits securely to my dash just left of the glove compartment. It stayed put with no issues on the entire White Rim trail.

I use Earthmate from Garmin, which is part of my Garmin Inreach subscription. It's not the best nav program, but gets the job done, and it's "free" since I already have the Inreach subscription for backcountry communication and emergency purposes. I stuck a 32Gbyte memory card in the Samsung, and that's more than big enough to hold all of the maps I could ever need for any imaginable trip.

 

[Louisiana Overland]

Just a bit of info in case anyone is using a wifi only ipad... like me. I use gaia and added in the garmin glo bluetooth gps receiver. This gives the wifi only ipad its gps position. It is battery powered, although mine stays plugged in, so if you go on a hike it can be portable. Its pretty small and easy to find a placement for it.

I have been impressed with gaia. Yes you need to be “online” to save a map section, but I save LARGE sections to the ipad for a given trip. Currently all of North Georgia and Southern Tennessee plus the Georgia Traverse track, Th entire pigeon forge/gatlinberg/ smokey national park, and the whopper carlsbad NM to Wyoming enchanted rockies trail. This ipad...ipad mini...is dedicated to the t4r with apps like gaia, ioverlander, etc. i dont really use it unless I am exploring. I also have saved all of the Kisatchie and Homochitta national forest lands. If Im on the highway/blacktop, I typically use the in dash gps or more likely Waze on my iphone.

 

[DavidR1]

Just a bit of info in case anyone is using a wifi only ipad... like me. I use gaia and added in the garmin glo bluetooth gps receiver. This gives the wifi only ipad its gps position. It is battery powered, although mine stays plugged in, so if you go on a hike it can be portable. Its pretty small and easy to find a placement for it.

I have been impressed with gaia. Yes you need to be “online” to save a map section, but I save LARGE sections to the ipad for a given trip. Currently all of North Georgia and Southern Tennessee plus the Georgia Traverse track, Th entire pigeon forge/gatlinberg/ smokey national park, and the whopper carlsbad NM to Wyoming enchanted rockies trail. This ipad...ipad mini...is dedicated to the t4r with apps like gaia, ioverlander, etc. i dont really use it unless I am exploring. I also have saved all of the Kisatchie and Homochitta national forest lands. If Im on the highway/blacktop, I typically use the in dash gps or more likely Waze on my iphone.

Lots of great information here. Thanks for providing it.

 

[WhiteBoomer04]

I'm participating in the Baja XL 2021 and most of the previous event drivers used a Samsung Tab A with a 10.5 screen. The navigation software is called Oruxmaps and only runs on android. Many also used the Gaia software.

 

[ElectroBoy]

With any GPS app you have to play around with it and experiment to get to know all the features and shortcomings. I use several often simultaneously to compare while driving or hiking. In the truck that’s not a problem but while hiking I take a portable battery pack to recharge the iPhone due to higher battery usage. I’m not totally proficient with all features of all apps, but for my uses here are my opinions:

MotionX:
Pro - Very good maps, tracking, statistics. I’ve used this a lot for many years. Easy to use. Sometimes shows hiking trails that do not show up on other apps. One time purchase, $2.99.
Con - In order to use off-network you have to download maps to device memory. If you want very fine details (which I do) I set a high “zoom level”, which results in a large file of many “tiles”. This takes a long time to download, like 8 to 10 hours. I start my downloads days ahead of time at night. Any network outage can result in resuming or restarting the process. And downloads are paused when the app is backgrounded so you should avoid using your phone until the download is done.

Avenza Maps:
Pro - PDF map reader with tracking capabilities. Easy to use. Download maps from their “Map Store”. Lots of free maps of off-road areas, BLM land, parks. App is inexpensive. Fast downloads.
Con - Some park maps are not very detailed. The USGS maps are pretty useless since they are old and trails/roads are often not named or identified. You have to poke around the store and search for free maps of the area you want. Sometimes downloading then deleting the map because the preview feature is lousy. There are really nice National Geographic Trails maps and other park maps for sale in the store, but at around $15 per map that gets pretty expensive.

Gaia:
Pro - Excellent maps, tracking features, fast downloads, very impressive. Many layers can be enabled or disabled to get the detail and clarity you want. The free version can be used with a cell connection. You need a subscription to download maps for tracking. Then all maps are free. I was so impressed that I purchased a 5 year premium membership when I found it on sale.
Con - More expensive of course. More complex to get proficient. You have to set up your area of interest with the layers you want enabled before downloading the maps.

Maplets:
Pro - A simpler, inexpensive GPS locator and offline map viewer of all sorts of city, park, campuses, bike trails, etc. Quick easy downloads. Easy to search for maps in store.
Con - No tracking capabilities (yet); you drop “pins” if you want to track your progress.

I use a combination of all of these. Remember that map downloads can use up a lot of your device’s memory. Use airplane mode to conserve battery power. Take a spare battery pack when hiking. And paper maps and a compass.

 

[SpeedyKevin]

I use my phone alot of backpacking and have been pleased with BackCountry navigator. Tried Gaia last weekend (with the premium sub to use my own custom maps thru mobac) and wasn't too pleased with it. It seems to have a difficult time tracking while google maps (on the same phone) doesn't. BackCountry navigator worked flawlessly with my Caltopo USGS/USFS and MapBuilder Topo maps.

 

[ac1617]

I got my iPad pro last night, what an amazing device… got Gaia, Motion X GPS, and even LumaFusion video editing software which is amazing… Handles 4k video editing smoothly. I am impressed.

That's my ideal setup... an iPad pro for both navigation and photo/video editing on the go. Too bad they are so darn expensive here in Canada.

 

[Bumbo]

That's my ideal setup... an iPad pro for both navigation and photo/video editing on the go. Too bad they are so darn expensive here in Canada.

Considering I was literally ready to blow $1000+ on a Lowrance unit which would only get used a few times a year... this turned out being a bargain in my mind.

That said, it is an expensive device, but there is a lot of value if you use it for a lot of things.

 

[BagiMT]

I have used Backcountry Navigator for a while now. While you can download the tile based maps through the app, which is slow and uses a lot of space, I use Open Street Maps from here:

OpenAndroMaps - Cycle and Hike maps for Android

All of California is 620MB, not bad.

Recently I discovered OsmAnd which also used Open Street Maps and let's you download a full state at a time, but also offers off-line turn-by-turn navigation. For a small price you can get contour lines and hillshade. Open Street Maps are available world wide, with varying details of course.

Sent from my HTC 10 using Tapatalk

 

[Unretired]

Starter Nav: InReach Mini with Earthmate plus Wifi Tablet

I have a Samsung android tablet, with cellular data and GPS capability. I mounted it with a pro-clip mount that fits securely to my dash just left of the glove compartment. It stayed put with no issues on the entire White Rim trail.

I use Earthmate from Garmin, which is part of my Garmin Inreach subscription. It's not the best nav program, but gets the job done, and it's "free" since I already have the Inreach subscription for backcountry communication and emergency purposes. I stuck a 32Gbyte memory card in the Samsung, and that's more than big enough to hold all of the maps I could ever need for any imaginable trip.

Dredging up old threads - but that means I was using Search right?

I'm looking at navigation and comms and seriously thinking InReach Mini plus a small tablet as a starter.
I'm not doing multi-day mountain trips out west, so don't need super sophisticated mapping.
Just want to know where I'm at and keep forest roads and OHV trails straight.
And I'd like to ability to communicate in the middle of nowhere.

Are you still "happy enough" with Earthmate?
Not sure about what direction I'll go with the tablet - the iPads I have around the house are pretty old.

Anyone know any difference between Apple vs Android working with Garmin?
How about if I can use the InReach Mini as the GPS receiver for the tablet?
I see folks talking about Garmin GLO, Bad Elf... but wasn't sure the InReach Mini could be used the same way with a wifi tablet.

 

[RonJR]

I'm still using Earthmate, and my Garmin (Delorme) Inreach. I like the idea of 2-way text messages with my wife back home in non-emergency situations. Really de-stresses things when I'm having too much fun to get home on time.

I also use Avenza and download the free Forest Service MVUM maps. They're excellent for keeping track of which roads are legal and which aren't.

While you can use the Inreach Mini as your primary (only) GPS and send coordinates to your tablet through bluetooth, I'd get a tablet with GPS. It just gives you that much more flexibility and saves your Inreach battery for comms and emergencies. GPS on tablets nowadays is almost standard, and costs very little extra. Plus you can't use Avenza or other mapping programs besides Earthmate unless you have a tablet/phone with GPS. The only app on your tablet that the Inreach GPS can talk to is Earthmate.

 

[JuniorPigeon]

The only app on your tablet that the Inreach GPS can talk to is Earthmate.

I was under the impression that the InReach Bluetooth to the tablet was just acting as a GPS unit (like a GLO, etc.) and you could use the factory maps app as well as apps like Gaia. No experience but it seems to be what I've read everywhere and has been my plan for a while. Am I for sure wrong?

 

[RonJR]

I was under the impression that the InReach Bluetooth to the tablet was just acting as a GPS unit (like a GLO, etc.) and you could use the factory maps app as well as apps like Gaia. No experience but it seems to be what I've read everywhere and has been my plan for a while. Am I for sure wrong?

That has not been my experience. If I turn off location services on my phone (Samsung J7 Android) and connect via bluetooth to my Inreach, Earthmate works perfectly and will show my location using the Inreach GPS. However, Google Maps and other mapping apps cannot see the Inreach GPS info. They just complain about no location services available.

There may be settings available to fix this, but I don't know what they are. I haven't looked hard, though, either.

It's worth noting that Earthmate does not connect to the Inreach through the phone bluetooth tool, but uses a bluetooth tool inside Earthmate. I have not tried to connect to the Inreach using the phone's native bluetooth tool. My guess is it won't work.

Mine is an Inreach SE, from 2015, made by Delorme. The Inreach Mini may have updated connection capabilities.