Hard hitting on bumps

[Seasparrow]

I purchased new michelins yesterday and as expected (with higher air pressure) they ride little hard and did before to a degree. My question is will deleting the existing XREAS and replacing just the shocks give me a noticeably better, smoother ride without replacing springs? What is it like to drive it after deleting the XREAS, is there a lot of body roll? My preference would be smoother ride much more than offroad.

Bounce test is useless as I can't get it to compress much.

04 sport 4wd
Daily driver
rarely offroad but once in a while I do
I carry some weight inside SUV but do not tow.
Original shocks and springs.

Thanks for any insight.

 

[Humble Leader]

I am not 100% sure but I have read on this forum that the XREAS springs are not the same as the ones that come with the standard suspension on the sr5. Depending on what you are deleting the XREAS for your ride may be similar or worse or better. something like a bilstein 5100 I've read is close to XREAS

is your XREAS leaking or are you replacing just to replace then? XREAS is supposed to make the 4runner handle on road better than a stock suspension

depending on how many miles you have on the truck if you were doing an XREAS delete it might be worth getting new springs and coils for front and back, you will have to take everything apart down there anyway to install the new suspension

If you want a smooth ride on road and your XREAS is functioning just fine I'd say keep it, that's what it's designed for

 

[bmgreene]

I just replaced the XREAS on my 2008 Limited, but I can't really say what specific impacts are due to just replacing with shocks (also replaced the RAS).

I haven't been cornering fast, but expect some more body roll since I did a 3" lift and increased my tire diameter by 4". I can't do a full range of steering yet because the tires rub about 60-70% of the way to full lock (getting the BMC done today). It's also riding pretty "lively" at the moment because I've still got about 400-500lb of armor/winch weight to put on before my build is done.

There's a good chance your prints could be somewhat worn on a 2004, especially if it's high miles or has done a lot of hauling/towing. Getting new springs along with shocks probably wouldn't be a bad idea with the XREAS delete

 

[firebirdguy]

why is there higher air psi? tires should be inflated to the psi for the vehicle, not to the max psi on the sidewall of the tire. unless you are towing with heavy weight or off roading & need more/less tire psi, the factory psi will give the best ride comfort & tire wear.

removing the xreas will have a little more body roll on hard corners if it was in good shape, but a good replacement shock will still corner & handle very good. a cheap/easy fix to improve body roll is to use poly sway bar bushings.

i used KYB shocks front/rear when i removed teh xreas on my 08 4runner, they have ~10% stiffer springs in front & 10% tighter valving in the shocks, they handle & ride very nice, i intend to get poly bushings but for 95% street use i havent really felt the need yet.

 

[Seasparrow]

Thanks for the answers.

They inflated them to 35, I have not fiddled with them yet I am going to have to do that. My previous duelers I kept at 30 and they rode fairly good. I think the max on the michelins are 44psi. Did you have/replace the shocks with struts, or do KYB's come with spring, I am unfamiliar with them. Some say new tires need a break in period. They are just a little bouncy, stiff, but my 4runner was anyway. I know shocks can get floaty when worn but my suspension is stiff over bumps, they kind of pound the car.

P.S. they said they inflated to 35 on paperwork but they (sam's club) were all over the place, 40rf, 37rr, 35lr, 42rf. I dropped them all to 35

 

[Bossman]

The recommended tire pressure for a 2004 Toyota 4Runner is 32 psi.

 

[Seasparrow]

I think it is probably more correct to follow michelin guidelines than toyota at this point. But Toyota manual says minimum cold 32.
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[Too Stroked]

I purchased new michelins yesterday and as expected (with higher air pressure) they ride little hard and did before to a degree. My question is will deleting the existing XREAS and replacing just the shocks give me a noticeably better, smoother ride without replacing springs? What is it like to drive it after deleting the XREAS, is there a lot of body roll? My preference would be smoother ride much more than offroad.

Bounce test is useless as I can't get it to compress much.

04 sport 4wd
Daily driver
rarely offroad but once in a while I do
I carry some weight inside SUV but do not tow.
Original shocks and springs.

Thanks for any insight.

How may miles on it?

 

[firebirdguy]

Thanks for the answers.

They inflated them to 35, I have not fiddled with them yet I am going to have to do that. My previous duelers I kept at 30 and they rode fairly good. I think the max on the michelins are 44psi. Did you have/replace the shocks with struts, or do KYB's come with spring, I am unfamiliar with them. Some say new tires need a break in period. They are just a little bouncy, stiff, but my 4runner was anyway. I know shocks can get floaty when worn but my suspension is stiff over bumps, they kind of pound the car.

P.S. they said they inflated to 35 on paperwork but they (sam's club) were all over the place, 40rf, 37rr, 35lr, 42rf. I dropped them all to 35

35psi isnt too bad & you wont notice much difference in harshness with 3psi over the toyota stated psi. be sure to check the tires when cool & no sun shining on any of them, a hot tire can read quite a bit more than a cool one. rule of thumb is ~1psi/10*f. i thought maybe you went closer to the 44 max psi that would cause a harder ride. tires dont really need a break in, aside from maybe 5-10 miles to wear off any oils or residue from the mold when making them.

4runners dont have struts, the fronts are just a coil over shock, rears are standard shocks. yes the KYB come with new springs on the fronts & that is one of the reasons they are such a good deal at ~$100ea front & $50ea rear. the stock rear springs usually dont wear out unless lots of heavy towing or other abuse. the KYB also will give a little bit of a lift on the front over stock, about 1" which will help get closer to a level stance & help clear a one size bigger 275/70/17 tire that most guys step up to.

keep in mind 4runners are a heavy duty SUV built on a solid truck frame with solid rear, they will never ride like a cadillac or modern car but decent quality new shocks should improve the ride as much as possible.

some guys also use toyota OEM shocks pulled from low mile tacoms & 4runners & can usually be found for good prices.

 

[firebirdguy]

I think it is probably more correct to follow michelin guidelines than toyota at this point. But Toyota manual says minimum cold 32.

the only guidelines from michelin is the max psi rating of 44psi & that should really never be used for any normal driving & will make the tire wear very unevenly. stick with toyotas recommendation for any normal tire, you can play with the psi a bit if you want to improve the ride some but lower psi hurts mpg & higher hurts tire wear.

my 4runner rides great on 32-35psi & the tires are wearing almost perfectly even.

 

[Too Stroked]

If you have more than 50,000 miles on your OEM shocks, they are starting to degrade pretty quickly, but you won't notice the difference until you put new ones in since it's been a gradual decline in performance.

Getting back to your new tires, it would be interesting to compare weights with your old tires. Adding weight - specifically un-sprung weight - to shocks that are already tired will magnify the lack of dampening.

Finally, what model of Michelin tire did you install? Are they LT rated by chance? If so, they're automatically going to ride harsher and weigh more.

 

[MAST4R]

If replacing all shocks, maybe also consider replacing the springs.

If the springs are shorter due to age/sagging, the vehicle is essentially lowered which compresses the shocks and if the shocks have less uptravel, harshness will follow.

--32 is better than 35 on SL/P-metric tires since that is what Toyota says anyway, 35 may provide minor handling improvement.
--LT should not be used at less than 35 and would result in harsher ride on stock or other weak or worn shocks, but in better ride with an offroad/stiffer suspension.

Again, if those 17 year old springs are significantly shorter than they used to be, I would personally replace them.

 

[Seasparrow]

To answer some questions,

163,000 miles
Michelin XLT A/S which is the exact same as LTX MS but is sold in club stores
like Costco, sams, BJ's etc.
The weights are 37 dueler and 38 michelins
Dropping them to 35 last night this morning it rode better.
The springs I don't believe are sagging as the fenders are still to this day way above the tires, stock no lift.

I was thinking about going with SR5 shocks however, Our vehicles are getting old. No matter how much we love our vehicles at some point $1400 master cylinders and $2000 head gaskets etc etc, are going to be a tipping point especially for people like me that have/need just one vehicle. If I were to have thought much harder I may have even let myself wonder if $823.28 worth of tires might have been that point in this economy with used vehicles going for what they are. But I do love my runner, and vehicle hunting now would also have been expensive. In a couple of years my fourth gen will be available for antique tags !!

Old picture with duelers on. P.S. Damn those michelins have a lot of tread on them !!!
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[Bluesky 07]

The info & advice in the suspension post linked in my sig may be helpful. At work at the moment but I’ll weigh in more on this later.

 

[Seasparrow]

Thanks everyone, I read your link Bluesky 07 thanks. How did you compress the springs ?

 

[rdruss]

I have an '03 V8 LTD that had xreas when I bought it about 7 years ago. After a couple of years of on highway driving only I decided to go with Bils 4600 front and rear and new '07 FJ springs and I love the ride. My xreas had no gas pressure in it when I removed it, unbeknownst to me! Also added a 1" leveling spacer in front.
I also run Michelin stock size LT Defenders set at 37psi front/rear and they ride and handle excellent, my 2nd set and will put on a 3rd.

 

[Bluesky 07]

Thanks everyone, I read your link Bluesky 07 thanks. How did you compress the springs ?

That’s one advantage of such a swap, you just bolt in the whole assembly. So my fronts are the shocks & springs from a 2020 Tacoma TRD OR. There are usually low-mileage sets regularly available on FB Marketplace.

My suggestion is to do both shocks & springs in the rear as well. Springs aren’t very expensive & yours have been hauling over 2 tons of SUV the equivalent of 8+ times around the world for 17 years. They’re tough but their best days are surely behind them.

 

[meltdowner]

I purchased new michelins yesterday and as expected (with higher air pressure) they ride little hard and did before to a degree. My question is will deleting the existing XREAS and replacing just the shocks give me a noticeably better, smoother ride without replacing springs? What is it like to drive it after deleting the XREAS, is there a lot of body roll? My preference would be smoother ride much more than offroad.

Bounce test is useless as I can't get it to compress much.

04 sport 4wd
Daily driver
rarely offroad but once in a while I do
I carry some weight inside SUV but do not tow.
Original shocks and springs.

Thanks for any insight.

I have the 06 sport. Had to do the same thing due to leak in XREAS. I personally really liked the XREAS system since it would stabilize the vehicle front and back and side to side. The ride was good and it seemed to absorb small bumps and rocks and such on the road much better than my replacement bilstein 5100s. That said, the nose dive and stearing is much better with the 5100s, but the cost was a "harsher" ride.

I am in the process of replacing the bilstein 5100's with OME BP-51 coilovers up front along with replacement upper and lower control arms. I'm going to leave the rear bilstein 5100s there for now. I may replace with OME if I don't like how it rides still, but I imagine that replacing the front coilovers with something more higher quality will help absord all those small bumps better.

TL;DR Less body roll and nose dive with replacement shocks/struts btw... but a more truck like ride.