Help! This time I'm stumped

[4Runnin Tahoe]

So, I never have had a problem with my battery. There's a couple stickers on the battery that says 11/11. I assume that's when the battery was installed? (I bought the car in 2012) So the battery should be still good.

So this morning my brother goes to move my car so he can get his car out of the driveway (he later said there was nothing out of the ordinary with the car) I went to start my car a few hours later and it started very slowly. I thought hmmmm, maybe he left a light on and it almost drained the battery so I let it run for a few minutes and check if any lights were on. 30 min later I go to start my car again, and same thing, cranks slowly. 1 hour later, I go to start it and the battery is dead, clicking, lights dim, the classic sign of a dead/bad battery. I jump it, and it starts right up, but it throws a code. I have an ultragauge so I checked the code and it shows P1780 which is some weird neutral switch thing? I run it/drive it for like 5 minutes, turn it off and tried it again and nothing. Dead.

This is just weird for me cause it's all out of the blue.

So in short; I probably need a new battery, but why am I getting this P1780 code all of the sudden?

 

[RedSled]

A battery that is not putting out enough power can trigger several different codes.

 

[Doc2012]

You're neutral safety switch.

Basically, it doesn't let the automatic start in any gear other than park or neutral.

This could be draining your battery. Bad switches do that.

Replacements are expensive. 300 bucks or around there.

 

[Doc2012]

Try cleaning your terminals first.

 

[rideexileex]

You're neutral safety switch.

Basically, it doesn't let the automatic start in any gear other than park or neutral.

This could be draining your battery. Bad switches do that.

Replacements are expensive. 300 bucks or around there.

Doc, can you expand on this? I've had a few times where the battery has unexplainably died... bench tested the battery and it checks out fine. How does it work / how much current does it draw?

 

[TheDurk]

Here is the diagnostic for the P1780. I doubt it is draining the battery because the associated circuits are not energized when the key is off. Bad battery or corrosion in cables, terminals or important grounds are more likely. 11/11 is also not too old for a battery to crump out, especially if it has been fully discharged at any point in its two-and-one-half years of service. Random codes are indeed a frequent by-product of weak battery voltage.

I would:

1. Fully charge and then load test battery or sub in a known good battery.
2. Check big 3 cables, terminals, and fender ground, and engine ground by diagnostic plug.
3. Confirm 12.5V+ at battery terminals when key off and 13.5-14.5 V when engine running.

When 1,2, and 3 are OK, reset code and see if it returns. If it does, follow attachment.

 

[4Runnin Tahoe]

[MENTION=106270]RedSled[/MENTION] [MENTION=83356]rideexileex[/MENTION] [MENTION=10169]TheDurk[/MENTION] [MENTION=76419]Doc2012[/MENTION]

Thanks guys. I ended up taking the battery to Carquest and they ran the test on the battery and found it was not just dead but most likely short circuited inside. I bought a new one and it started up and didn't throw any codes. It's still weird that all of this happened out of the blue. Imma give it a couple hundred miles until I feel like it's resolved.

So do you guys think it threw that code because of the bad battery?

 

[jreask]

[MENTION=106270]RedSled[/MENTION] [MENTION=83356]rideexileex[/MENTION] [MENTION=10169]TheDurk[/MENTION] [MENTION=76419]Doc2012[/MENTION]

Thanks guys. I ended up taking the battery to Carquest and they ran the test on the battery and found it was not just dead but most likely short circuited inside. I bought a new one and it started up and didn't throw any codes. It's still weird that all of this happened out of the blue. Imma give it a couple hundred miles until I feel like it's resolved.

So do you guys think it threw that code because of the bad battery?

Of course. There is no doubt.

 

[TheDurk]

[MENTION=106270]RedSled[/MENTION] [MENTION=83356]rideexileex[/MENTION] [MENTION=10169]TheDurk[/MENTION] [MENTION=76419]Doc2012[/MENTION]

Thanks guys. I ended up taking the battery to Carquest and they ran the test on the battery and found it was not just dead but most likely short circuited inside. I bought a new one and it started up and didn't throw any codes. It's still weird that all of this happened out of the blue. Imma give it a couple hundred miles until I feel like it's resolved.

So do you guys think it threw that code because of the bad battery?

Yes, as I stated quite clearly in my post.

However, you are missing an important point. The 'out of the blue' could be a problem in your charging system. From what you have written, you have done absolutely nothing to check that. So if your teen-aged alternator took a crump, or is just weak enough to not throw a red alt. light but not charge the battery well, you will just be running your new battery until that one goes discharged, and you will have started it on the road to the same early death your other one took.

Lots of places will check your charging system for free if you can't handle it. Better to know now and have peace of mind because if you wait for it to crump on its own it is guaranteed to do it at the worst possible time. As I said, all you need to see is 13.5-14.5 volts with the engine running. A Cheapo DMM costs $7 at Wal-Mart.

It's up to you.

 

[ELock3rdGen]

Agree with thedurk. A weak battery does a lot of weird things.

 

[VolcanoT4R]

Set up your Ultragauge to monitor voltage. You'll know pretty quickly if your alternator isn't working.

 

[Doc2012]

Doc, can you expand on this? I've had a few times where the battery has unexplainably died... bench tested the battery and it checks out fine. How does it work / how much current does it draw?

In his case, his battery was the culprit for throwing the codes.

I use to have a '99 Tacoma, 2wd. One night, I went to leave a friends party, and the truck did nothing. No turn, no slow turn, just clicked.

Well, I called my now ex-wife, she came and picked me up, and went home, came back the next day.

I wasn't very mechanically inclined at this time, so I woke my buddy up, and he jumped the starter relay. Literally jumped it. A screwdriver.

Put the truck into the run position, jumped the starter relay again, and the truck fired right up.

I threw NO CODES. I had NO idea wtf was going on. Replaced the relay, the starter, the whole 9 yards, and didn't fix the problem.

So I lived with it. I literally just jumped the starter relay EVERY TIME I had to drive my truck. Put the key in the run position, got out, used a piece of wire I kept in the truck, and jumped it.

When I came home from my first deployment, my truck was at a family friends house(mech) and he mentioned the NSS. Said he managed to bypass it. Truck worked great from there, but would start in ANY GEAR.

How much the switch drains, all that, I can't tell you. I can tell you that it basically keeps the truck from starting, unless it's in neutral or park, where the transmission is not going to engage gears right away.


HOWEVER, usually, if you put the truck in neutral, and try to start it with a bad NSS, it will start.

IIRC, only automatics have the NSS. Basically acts as a clutch, so that way it doesn't drive into something when you start it.

 

[IBallEngineer]

Better to know now and have peace of mind because if you wait for it to crump on its own it is guaranteed to do it at the worst possible time. As I said, all you need to see is 13.5-14.5 volts with the engine running. A Cheapo DMM costs $7 at Wal-Mart.

It's up to you.

Crump?

Sounds British

:blabla:

 

[TheDurk]

Crump?

Sounds British

:blabla:

Google tells me it's medical slang for a patient circling the drain. Guess I've dated too many nurses (two).

Then again, you can never date too many nurses.

 

[Doc2012]

Then again, you can never date too many nurses.

I would rather date either a Corpsman, or an Army Medic.

I know they can save my ass if it comes down to it. Plus, they aren't afraid to get thier hands dirty....

Especially a Dust Off medic. (yes, there is an all female crew of Dust Off).

 

[TheeMikeB]

I agree with The Durk, get a meter and put it across your terminals when the engine is running to measure your output... like he said should be 13.5-14.5 V when engine running.

This can quickly point out a charging system issue. If you don't know how to do it PM me I have a meter to test... you are in WC and so am I. It would be about time we cross paths anyway lol.

 

[4Runnin Tahoe]

Yes, as I stated quite clearly in my post.

However, you are missing an important point. The 'out of the blue' could be a problem in your charging system. From what you have written, you have done absolutely nothing to check that. So if your teen-aged alternator took a crump, or is just weak enough to not throw a red alt. light but not charge the battery well, you will just be running your new battery until that one goes discharged, and you will have started it on the road to the same early death your other one took.

Lots of places will check your charging system for free if you can't handle it. Better to know now and have peace of mind because if you wait for it to crump on its own it is guaranteed to do it at the worst possible time. As I said, all you need to see is 13.5-14.5 volts with the engine running. A Cheapo DMM costs $7 at Wal-Mart.

It's up to you.

Thanks, that's good advice. I'll fire up my dmm.

 

[4Runnin Tahoe]

I agree with The Durk, get a meter and put it across your terminals when the engine is running to measure your output... like he said should be 13.5-14.5 V when engine running.

This can quickly point out a charging system issue. If you don't know how to do it PM me I have a meter to test... you are in WC and so am I. It would be about time we cross paths anyway lol.

Haha thanks. I have a meter. But my ultragauge does show it's running 14.3ish while running. Would you trust an ultragauge, or should I do the meter test just in case?

 

[TheeMikeB]

Haha thanks. I have a meter. But my ultragauge does show it's running 14.3ish while running. Would you trust an ultragauge, or should I do the meter test just in case?

I'd trust the gauge it's reading from the ECU... however it would be interesting to physically meter and then compare results.

 

[TheDurk]

Haha thanks. I have a meter. But my ultragauge does show it's running 14.3ish while running. Would you trust an ultragauge, or should I do the meter test just in case?

I'd say you're good. Let us know if the code returns. So what brand of battery crapped out in 32 months? You should get at least a 4/36 or one-ninth rebate on most brands (not worth it, IMHO, get a different brand.)