I’m out

[rcjoe]

Bye :violin:

 

[marshal]

Im fairly certain its both for the PW, the diff has a locking magnet to make it a true locker. It is a torsion when unlocked compared to a open diff like most other manufacturers (Toyota, Nissan, etc.).

Ford was only for the Raptor in the front diff after a certain year, it is not a locker as you said just a better LSD.

The lockers in the PW are Aisin, electro-magnet coupling, but are open diffs when unlocked. The 03-06 Jeep Rubicon used Fuji heavy ind air lockers, and the rear locker had a helical LSD when unlocked.

 

[Vinsil]

People always want the Cummins for the PW. I disagree and you bring up valid reasons to have the 6.4 which, by the way for anyone who hasn't drove one is a BEAST. The Cummins would not be a great off-road engine for the PW and having owned a few, they are great for towing and heavy use, but I'd rather have the 6.4.


Yeah my truck works for a specific purpose and need, although I did make sure I got the rear locker, skid package and deepest gears they offer in a SRW. Lol. I went modest on the package with a XLT premium, but with discounts and rebates it wasn't bad at $50k OTD.

 

[FrontRange4Runner]

Good luck in your travels man. Hope the Power Wagon works out. I have always enjoyed your Forge stuff, and will continue to check it out.

 

[dafuture]

I'm new here, but the PW is one of my favorite trucks. Glad to see you at least got a worthy successor to the 4R!

 

[Jetboy]

Warning... off topic diversion ahead.

I think you misunderstand his point. There is very little need with electric drive... No car company sees any real long term future in making traditional automobiles of any sort right now. The guys at the top of every mfg (domestic, import...) are 100% focused on the future being autonomous self driving emissions free modules. The automobile as we know it is expected to be a thing of the past. The idea of owning a car will most likely not exist. You will just hit a button on your phone and one will show up within minutes.

The good news... the consumer is still demanding performance and enthusiast vehicles. The domestics are still responding with some of the most high performance and capable vehicles ever manufactured. This basically stems back to the car culture in the US where many of the mid to upper management in these companies are hard core enthusiast who grew up in the days before life was on a phone... and it is still obviously very profitable. However, they only see this as a short term way to survive.


The bad news.. it is just a matter of time. There is no long term future in traditional autos. Companies like Toyota will react a little different. Their management is from a much different culture and it makes no business sense to invest in a market that is predicted to shrink dramatically. They don't have near the passion outside of the business case.

The idea of a Dodge PW being sold that gets 14mpg.. with a solid axles, lockers, and a winch... in 10 years from now is pretty absurd. The fact that you can buy it now is really amazing.

Long story short.... get them while you can. Interesting times ahead for the automotive enthusiast. We may have hit the peak or soon will IMHO.

I agree with this.

People pan Toyota for not updating the Tundra for example and point to the domestics and say "Toyota's not a serious player in the truck market". The reality is the exact opposite. Toyota outperforms the domestics in PROFIT in the truck market. Tundra and Tacoma make more profit than the entire F series lineup on an annual basis. With less than 1/3 of the sales volume. The Tundra is a runaway success in terms of business profit. Every tundra sale is worth more than 3 F-series trucks in profit margin. And the F-series has the highest profit margin of the domestic trucks.

Building performance vehicles has left the big 3 either bankrupt or very close in the past decade. Toyota only builds vehicles that are profitable. They view the world very differently. Obviously Toyota sells lots of vehicles with front and rear lockers. The 70 series has them as did the 80 and the 105. I'm kinda surprise they still sell the 200 series at all in the USA. I just don't foresee a front locker in a Toyota in the USA ever again. I think we'll get electric torque vectoring drive systems before that happens - which would likely be better if done right because of the ability to skid steer and such. A virtual locker may soon outperform a mechanical one.

I might be totally off base on this. The new Tacoma rear axle is a big chink in my prediction. The upgraded locker is totally internal like the PW and Eaton models. And that's a big deal Especially when you consider that the 8.7 rear happens to be suspiciously similar to the Tundra/LC200 8.7 front differential size. Will that fit in the new tundra front diff? Is that the idea? Will there be a next 4runner with an 8.7 rear and 8.7 clamshell front with e-lockers in both? I sure hope so. But I doubt it.


What's coming out of Detroit really is pretty impressive to me. The new ZR1 corvette - a corvette with 750hp, goes well over 200mph, and probably runs a sub 7 minute lap at the 'Ring. I almost vomit in my mouth writing this - but even Camaros are cool again. A powerwagon with 2 lockers and a factory winch!?! Hell yeah. A lot of credit has to go to Jeep for the Rubicon for proving out the market for real locking differentials. Hell, even Toyota is making a Camry with over 300hp - and it's kinda boring in the sedan market.

 

[Jetboy]

Sierra and Silverado have locking diffs with the max trailering package. The 4Runner is falling behind the times, actually Toyota/LEXUS as a whole are.

Those are total garbage though. I know. I had one. Nothing like a true selectable locker, and they work very poorly in functionality even compared to auto lockers like detroits. Plus the front ends are weak - like they pulled axles out of a Cobalt to build them. ATRAC is WAY better than the GM trashlock.

 

[wfo9]

Those are total garbage though. I know. I had one. Nothing like a true selectable locker, and they work very poorly in functionality even compared to auto lockers like detroits. Plus the front ends are weak - like they pulled axles out of a Cobalt to build them. ATRAC is WAY better than the GM trashlock.

Just one data point.. I'm not saying it is good for hard core off-road use... but I have that locker on in my 2wd 2014 GMC tow rig. My trailer and crawler are stored in a very bumpy rough storage area with some big holes and I'm always surprised by how well that locker works in those conditions and in other slick areas where I take my trailer. I've considered a 4wd truck, but so far it has done really well and shocks me by how much traction it gets with what are basically street tires and a rear locker. It's totally smooth and has actually impressed me in those conditions. Now rock crawling would be a totally different story and that is where you just can't beat a selectable or detroit.... where it is a true spool from 0 RPM on up.

The mpg and power on that truck still impress the heck out of me.. GM has come a long way.. Still room for improvement though.

 

[Jetboy]

I think the problem is that it's a complex design that relies on precise machined parts with centrifugal weight actuation with springs inside an environment that has a wide range of varying temperatures and resulting fluid viscosity differences. Add to that dirt, water, wear, etc. The result is really erratic operation. Especially in cold weather. Any two models can have very different performance.

The benefit is that install in a standard axle housing, so they're a low cost option. For pulling up a wet boat ramp they probably work pretty well.

 

[Dalko43]

The idea of a Dodge PW being sold that gets 14mpg.. with a solid axles, lockers, and a winch... in 10 years from now is pretty absurd. The fact that you can buy it now is really amazing.

I get what you're saying, but I also disagree to some extent. For example, the problem with this hypothetical future PW isn't that it has solid axles, lockers and a winch; rather the problem is that it has a gasoline engine that only gets 14 mpg.

In 10 years from now, there will likely be powerplant options (diesel, CNG, hybrid variations, maybe even electric but I'm not optimistic) that provide far better efficiency and torque delivery. People will still want old-school, body-on-frame, mechanical traction SUV's and trucks, and so long as the power plants have been updated appropriately, those vehicles will both satisfy government regulations and meet consumer expectations.

Gasoline engines, even the turbo variants, only have so much efficiency juice to squeeze, so to speak. If and when the companies switch to newer powerplant setup's, these old-school vehicles will get a new lease on life.

 

[marshal]

I get what you're saying, but I also disagree to some extent. For example, the problem with this hypothetical future PW isn't that it has solid axles, lockers and a winch; rather the problem is that it has a gasoline engine that only gets 14 mpg.

In 10 years from now, there will likely be powerplant options (diesel, CNG, hybrid variations, maybe even electric but I'm not optimistic) that provide far better efficiency and torque delivery. People will still want old-school, body-on-frame, mechanical traction SUV's and trucks, and so long as the power plants have been updated appropriately, those vehicles will both satisfy government regulations and meet consumer expectations.

Gasoline engines, even the turbo variants, only have so much efficiency juice to squeeze, so to speak. If and when the companies switch to newer powerplant setup's, these old-school vehicles will get a new lease on life.

i agree with this, and i think these full size trucks are perfect applications of diesel/electric or gasoline/electric where the individual wheels have their own AC electric motors being driven by a ICE hooked directly to a generator. having a battery pack in place to act as a capacitor while the engine spools up generation

 

[Ryan1975]

Do we need a "Sold my runner and bought a truck but Im still lurking" sticky?

Welcome to the club!

Here's my goodbye truck

mebe

I sold my 2012 4Runner for a Suburban and inherited a Ford Explorer Sport from the wife. Hated my life so badly that the Explorer only lasted a year before I was back in my 2016 4Runner.
[MENTION=49845]marshall[/MENTION]