Interesting read from Centric on ABS bleeding

[Bob22222]

http://www.centricparts.com/files/technical guides/bleeding-abs-brakes-2.pdf

I found this link informative. Helped clear up some concepts for me. Draw your own conclusion.

A note here: they still suggest the traditional furthest first approach contrary to FSM meathod. I'll stick with Toyota recommendation on bleeding fronts first for sure.

 

[CookieRoe]

http://www.centricparts.com/files/technical guides/bleeding-abs-brakes-2.pdf

I found this link informative. Helped clear up some concepts for me. Draw your own conclusion.

A note here: they still suggest the traditional furthest first approach contrary to FSM meathod. I'll stick with Toyota recommendation on bleeding fronts first for sure.

I agree. When I do my 5th gen brake upgrade, I'll bleed as per Toyota's instructions. This would be great to share in the 5th gen Brake update thread.

 

[V8Man]

IMO the beading order procedure doesn't matter as much as the old duel cylinder master cylinders that incorporated balancing valves, proportional valves and single lines splitting into two, one to each wheel per end of the vehicle.
Our trucks have one line from the MC to each wheel. So if you only replaced the front calipers, they would be the only thing that needs bled to remove the air. If you are doing a fluid exchange, then bleeding in any order will work.

 

[Bob22222]

IMO the beading order procedure doesn't matter as much as the old duel cylinder master cylinders that incorporated balancing valves, proportional valves and single lines splitting into two, one to each wheel per end of the vehicle.
Our trucks have one line from the MC to each wheel. So if you only replaced the front calipers, they would be the only thing that needs bled to remove the air. If you are doing a fluid exchange, then bleeding in any order will work.

V8 Man,
Did you read through the link?

The point I would direct you to is, to paraphrase, as I read it:

When flushing (which has really nothing to due with air or bleeding, hopefully anyway) a main purpose of the "factory" tool is exercise or open and close the antilock system valving. If that step is not taken the old fluid in the antilock system will remain in the system and not be flushed out. Us poor folks without access to factory scan tool or simalar program can open the valves by locking the brakes on a loose surface. My guess one would best approach this as you would any other hydrolic system drain and fill realizing it would take several flush cycles getting the vehicle back on the road to lock the brakes then back under to flush, repeat. Add this to needing a helper to peddle press if there is a trusted dealer anywhere near you it might be easier to go there for a final flush after doing your brake job. Or I do suppose one could get it dealer flushed first then do the calipers working with fresh fluid in the system. Then just do a routine caliper bleedto bleed the small amount of air introduced at the caliper swap.
I hope I didn't loose you here. And for me the more knowledge a have of any system from biological to mechanical to political and beyond the more comfortable I am with my understanding of said system.
Also, I have no clue of your knowledge base of ABS evolution you may well know and have a full understanding how the valving and the service tool interface during a Flush of these systems.in which case I congratulate you on you vast knowledge base. However, I suspect there are many other members here who like I have never stumbled across such a clear explanation of the issue and could benefit from the fine points offered by Centric.

 

[Bob22222]

Before someone corrects me. I know I have fallen prey to the dark side by neglecting to include "Flushing Our ABS" system in the title.
"

 

[V8Man]

Yes I read the Article

Before someone corrects me. I know I have fallen prey to the dark side by neglecting to include "Flushing Our ABS" system in the title.
"

I guess you stating you neglected to mention "flushing" in your title was your apology for basting me for giving my opinion to the question you asked in your title and the body of your question about "bleeding".
When you start flaming someone for their knowledge (or lack of) you lose all credibly. If you find anything I said that is wrong in my post, be sure to let everyone know. In my over 40 years wrenching on cars, I have serviced every type of brake systems from 1965 to 2004. Specifically on the 4th Gen. T4R I have replaced 1 master cylinder, swapped out 6 front calipers, replaced front & rear rotors and pads, and repaired the motor on the MC. I have done fluid exchanges and bled air from the systems both the manual way and with the help of the motor on the system and I never had any problems. If your entire point of your post is that if you don't have the factory tool to get all the old fluid out, then your being more anal-retentive than me and you probably really get upset because when you do an engine oil change there might be 4 ounces of old oil left in the engine. The amount of oil in the master cylinder, excluding the reservoir, cannot be more than a few ounces.
I agree, the purpose of this forum is the share information and to learn from others experiences both positive and negative. I hope you learn all you can from this forum about your 4Runner, just be careful and don't piss too many people off because the answers to your questions may not get answered.

 

[Bob22222]

I guess you stating you neglected to mention "flushing" in your title was your apology for basting me for giving my opinion to the question you asked in your title and the body of your question about "bleeding".
When you start flaming someone for their knowledge (or lack of) you lose all credibly. If you find anything I said that is wrong in my post, be sure to let everyone know. In my over 40 years wrenching on cars, I have serviced every type of brake systems from 1965 to 2004. Specifically on the 4th Gen. T4R I have replaced 1 master cylinder, swapped out 6 front calipers, replaced front & rear rotors and pads, and repaired the motor on the MC. I have done fluid exchanges and bled air from the systems both the manual way and with the help of the motor on the system and I never had any problems. If your entire point of your post is that if you don't have the factory tool to get all the old fluid out, then your being more anal-retentive than me and you probably really get upset because when you do an engine oil change there might be 4 ounces of old oil left in the engine. The amount of oil in the master cylinder, excluding the reservoir, cannot be more than a few ounces.
I agree, the purpose of this forum is the share information and to learn from others experiences both positive and negative. I hope you learn all you can from this forum about your 4Runner, just be careful and don't piss too many people off because the answers to your questions may not get answered.

Huh, ?
Do you feel basted.? Why?

I was just wondering if you had read the link since your post had nothing to do with the topic or the link.
There are plenty of other discussions on bleedings meathod them self. But since you want to linger on the topic myself I try to do things correct. If I'm changing the front calipers and flushing the system I'm damn well going to bleed or flush the rear lines and calipers as well. Maybe I'm overly cautious but when a change my socks I general change both as well.
Centric also has a good write up on how to properly bleed a standard vacuum assist brake system. The link sited above is meant to offer additional information information on modern system such as ours.
Go in peace in use whatever bleeding meathod you feel comfy with.

 

[lbhsbz]

We really should update that article...it was written about 18 years ago...times have changed.

Most vehicles now have traction control systems of some sort, and many require rather specialized processes, usually involving a scan tool.

Follow the FSM procedure

 

[AuSeeker]

We really should update that article...it was written about 18 years ago...times have changed.

Most vehicles now have traction control systems of some sort, and many require rather specialized processes, usually involving a scan tool.

Follow the FSM procedure

Ibhsbz,

If I'm not mistaken and from what you posted above also I believe I read sometime in the past that you work for Centric?

Maybe you should add that info as your signature so most would know where you're coming from when you post other info as above, just a thought on my part but it may be more of a headache if members start flooding you with brake info requests.