It IS my head gasket...now what

[mendozer]

I had an older thread that detailed the long journey it took to get to where I am now...a head gasket leak between cylinders 4 and 6, but not where the holes for the coolant lines lea into the cylinder. There was coolant junk under the manifold gasket, but that's probably been there a while from the previous owner. So after all the spark plugs, valve covers, fuel injectors, etc now it's the head gasket. A shop quoted me 3500 or so to do the head gasket and timing belt/pump. I'm at 172k so might as well to the TB anyways. This seems high, but I don't have anything to compare it to. And that's without finding a cracked head. But those prices are approaching crate motor cost.

the attached photo is where he says the leak is, that's not my head

 

[BoomerBob]

I just spent $2100 on an American reman long block (not JDM) and $1100 to have it installed. Plus a timing belt kit (good one) for $230 and a new radiator just to play it safe plus Toyota brand coolant ($60 for 2 gal concentrate but only needed one). Decided to bypass the trans cooler in the radiator and bought a Hayden external cooler ($40) to avoid any possibility of the dreaded Pink Milkshake. Since the engine was coming out I got the starter from the shop and rebuilt the starter solenoid. It was about half worn but it was a good time to do it for just $14. The engine seller recommended replacing the fuel filter so I did at a cost of $21. One thing I didn't think about which was required to maintain the engine warranty was a new oil pump ($86). Plus incidentals like oil, filters, radiator cap, radiator hoses, pcv valve, etc. which you may or may not need.

Basically I have a new drive train from the trans forward. Total cost: $3641.

Toyota 5VZ 3.4L 0 miles Engine Tacoma Tundra T-100 4Runner 1996-2004 | eBay

https://amazon.com/Evergreen-TBK271...Water+Pump&qid=1567732395&s=automotive&sr=1-1

https://amazon.com/Victory-Lap-ND-3...Repair+Kit&qid=1567732483&s=automotive&sr=1-2

https://amazon.com/WIX-Filters-Comp...er,+Pack+of+1&qid=1567732680&s=gateway&sr=8-1

https://amazon.com/Aisin-OPT-022-En...e+Oil+Pump&qid=1567732792&s=automotive&sr=1-1

It's worth noting I overheated the engine and thought all I needed was new head gaskets and both heads rebuilt which I spent 2 months doing only to find out I had also had bad rings. I should have just gone with the reman long block right from the start. Granted, I ended up with some cool tools and learned a lot about my rig, but if I had to do it over again I would have gone with the long block. Engine had 147k miles when the top radiator hose blew off and blew my engine. Only had the rig 6 weeks or so at the time.

So if you can learn something from my mistakes and not jump over a 100 dollar bill to pick up a dime then something good came from it.

You might want to shop around your area, maybe get some input on Facebook about reputable smaller shops who can do a swap, and start fresh. Or you can replace the head gasket, do the TB, and rebuild just the one head. Maybe have to do it all over again next week or next year for the other head.

 

[jross20]

I had an older thread that detailed the long journey it took to get to where I am now...a head gasket leak between cylinders 4 and 6, but not where the holes for the coolant lines lea into the cylinder. There was coolant junk under the manifold gasket, but that's probably been there a while from the previous owner. So after all the spark plugs, valve covers, fuel injectors, etc now it's the head gasket. A shop quoted me 3500 or so to do the head gasket and timing belt/pump. I'm at 172k so might as well to the TB anyways. This seems high, but I don't have anything to compare it to. And that's without finding a cracked head. But those prices are approaching crate motor cost.

the attached photo is where he says the leak is, that's not my head

Based on the services I've gotten from my shop for things and also listening to them talk about other big jobs they are doing. $ 3,500 sounds like they are on drugs. For that much you could get a new engine and have it installed.

Find yourself a cool Korean mechanic who charges realistic prices haha

 

[rideexileex]

Do you like to turn wrenches?

Took me a weekend to do headgaskets on a 3.4. It sucked, but it wasn't "3500 OR SO" (emphasis on the SO part, as it always ends up being more) worth of suck.

 

[mendozer]

I do wrench on my rig but my challenge is my schedule for arranging taking heads to a shop, it's my daily driver, and I can do the head gasket but finding the details like inspecting the surface and determining of the heads good might be beyond my abilities

 

[mendozer]

I came across this site last year when I was fooling around with car stuff. Seems like a cool head, remade into one block.

Toyota 5VZ-FE 3.4 Long Block Crate Engine Sale, Remanufactured

I asked the guy about it but he hadn't heard of it, not did he trust the "expansion and contraction" of a head shape going in that direction.

 

[Gward]

I do wrench on my rig but my challenge is my schedule for arranging taking heads to a shop, it's my daily driver, and I can do the head gasket but finding the details like inspecting the surface and determining of the heads good might be beyond my abilities

Start with taking a straight edge to the head and see if it is warped if the head is already off the engine.

 

[BoomerBob]

I do wrench on my rig but my challenge is my schedule for arranging taking heads to a shop, it's my daily driver, and I can do the head gasket but finding the details like inspecting the surface and determining of the heads good might be beyond my abilities

You will likely need to resurface the head and have the valves re-lashed to spec so let the machine shop tell you if the head is still good. They will wash it in a solution to make it clean enough to see hidden cracks and remove the valves to see if there are any crack hidden in between them. You can buy a good straight edge and some feeler gauges to check it for flatness and simply look to see if you can see any cracks but ultimately it will be the machine shop who determines if it's still good.

Yes, some shade-tree mechanics will rebuild the heads themselves through various tricks but if you want it done to precision, a pro will need to do it.

Seriously; consider the long block option if you like the rig and plan on keeping it a long time. Payments on a new $40k T4R will last a long time, be expensive, and cause the registration fee (in most states) and insurance to skyrocket.

I'm currently having a battle with myself about whether to keep my 98 T4R now that my 01 is up and running good again. I kinda like the idea of having the 98 setup to take my dogs out to the country and not care about it getting muddy or dirty in the back or outside. On the other hand it's one more expense I don't really NEED but do like.

On top of that I now have a beautiful set of rebuilt heads I need to sell.

 

[BoomerBob]

One other thought before you make a final decision. Do a compression test on all 6 cylinders. A leak-down test too depending on what you find your compression to be. If you find the compression is low on the good cylinders too then you know a long block is in your future. One with at least a 2 year warranty.

 

[nissanh]

FYI: If the engine rebuilders are using non oem parts, the engine will last close to 100K miles.

If you can find a low mile JDM (with proof/guarantee), go with it.

I did my first head gasket job on my 4 cylinder corolla and later realized, it was not too bad of a job. Got the heads done and it now has more power. Used the same bolts and after going with the manufacturers specifications with torque etc., I found a small leak in the coolant lines. then I retorqued the head bolts and all are good now. I did 50K miles since then and drive good! Saved lots of money!! and more importantly gained lots of experience!!! Ready for the next one.....

 

[phattyduck]

For that $3500 you can buy a ~20 year old Camry AND do the rebuild yourself (or JDM engine swap). Its always nice to have a beater around.

-Charlie

 

[gamefreakgc]

Lots of directions you can go here, and solid advice so far. I see you are in Seattle, that explains the insane repair bill price. Welcome to the 2nd state of California where housing is expensive and labor even more so. At that price you could get an entirely new engine installed.

1. A head gasket job is a bit of work, sometimes the exhaust manifold will give you a fight. However if you get yourself a good torque wrench and the service manual, you can do it. It's literally just hoses an bolts. Not hard, just takes a lot of time.

2. If you decide to go the engine swap route, try and find a low-mileage USDM engine. They are completely "plug and play" where a JDM is not. Most JDM engines are out of a Japanese van, so all the accessories, hoses, pulleys, everything has to come off and your old engine's parts move over. I'd say this added roughly 20 hours of work to my swap, partly because the JDM crank pulley is STUPID hard to take off. But it did have 210 PSI of compression across the board... so it was worth it in the end.

3. You'll find the new 4Runners to be just flashy versions of our 3rd Gens. Hardly anything has changed over 20 years which is quite shocking.

 

[rideexileex]

Did it ever overheat? If not, you are more likely to NOT have to re-machine, etc.

They also make thicker & squishier head gaskets for higher mileage engines that are supposed account for any slight warpage.

 

[APhelps]

3. You'll find the new 4Runners to be just flashy versions of our 3rd Gens. Hardly anything has changed over 20 years which is quite shocking.

Great post. I don't even think the 5th gen is as rugged as the 3rd gen. I do suppose these vehicles are very long in the tooth now though and if you're not mechanically inclined at all it's going to be a long costly road.

What's interesting in Europe you can buy a new LC with a manual. Heck you could even buy a 100 series with a solid axle front for a while. Or the new 70s in Australia, drool..

 

[BoomerBob]

FYI: If the engine rebuilders are using non oem parts, the engine will last close to 100K miles.

I'd like to see some reliable sources for that statement please. At the very least; I'd expect to see reman/rebuilt engines last 200k miles as long as they were maintained correctly such as 3k oil changes; 5k if using quality synthetics.

 

[mendozer]

Compression was fine in the other cylinders. 180 in three of them, 195 in one, 90 in cyl six and 135 in cyl 4.

It hasn't overheated with me but I bought it in 2015. I suspect poor care from the P.O. As the valve covers were scorched horrendously when I did those gaskets.

 

[mendozer]

What's a fair price on a motor? 1k?

Like this

 

[BoomerBob]

What's a fair price on a motor? 1k?

Like this

96 02 TOYOTA 4RUNNER 3.4L 4CAM V6 ENGINE JDM 5VZ-FE 5VZ | JDM Engine Depot Inc

Link was bad. This one might work better.

Like mentioned before; it can take a lot of extra time to move things over but even a USDM long block will require the moving of all the other parts except for, obviously, the block and heads. Plus all that extra stuff I mentioned before.

The difference is the JDM engine must be partially disassembled first before all the USDM parts can be taken off the old engine then installed on the JDM. The savings might go up in smoke if you're paying someone by the hour to do this at $80 an hour (shop time).

Still; it will be an OEM engine and you wouldn't have to break it in for 500 miles before driving it normally and using the cruise control on the highway.

I wonder why the parts are so different between Japan and here... I mean if they work there; they work here and visa versa. I wonder if some of it is government mandated. We all know how any government can screw up a wet dream.

 

[mendozer]

My quick inquiry for "USDM 3.4L engines" came up with these JDM engines. What parts are different? Also may be a dumb question but how will I know where my engine came from?

How many parts are we talking because these JDMs have 50k sometimes. That's awfully tempting.

 

[mendozer]

Well I suppose any local scrap engine would be better than nothing. It would take me time to rebuild it for sure. I'm just worried by beater F250 won't last that long haha. Plus actually installing it into the engine bay will require tools and skills I don't have like properly meeting it to the tranny. I wouldn't mind paying for that labor. But then again...that's at the very bottom. Can't pay for that without paying for the rest.