KDSS rotted out-need replacement advice please!

[Catskill4RNR]

So our KDSS module and lines have rotted away in the Northeast salt belt and are completely shot. I've read a bunch of posts about the cost to repair the KDSS system and have decided I would like to remove it and go with some sort of conventional system if that is possible.

Can someone please point me to a thread that gives a clear explanation of what it would entail to do this? The dealer is recommending some TRD parts but I have not talked in depth about what they will do. I wanted to get schooled here first before I agree to a line of B.S.

I have 132,000 miles and my extended warranty ran out at 125,000 so it's all out of pocket now.

I'm running the FJ Cruiser TRD lift with 1" spacers up front and Dobinson 1-1/4" springs in the rear.

 

[EC15.]

Toyota used 2 different frame and axle housing configuration for the kdss and non kdss models. Frame and axle housing does not have the mounts for the conventional sway bars. The frame doesn't have holes in the front for the sway bar bracket and the rear of the frame doesn't have the brackets for the sway bar links. Toyota sells the rear sway bar link mount brackets separately but needs to be welded on. I'm not sure if drilling holes in the front and using nutserts is strong enough.

The real costly part is changing the axle housing.

 

[premise]

I wonder if a solid race car/truck fab shop could install a SB set-up? Maybe use non-KDSS OEM SB parts as a starting point?

 

[Furagwa]

I don't have the exact same problem, but I have been trying to reach the same end point. I plan to simply fabricate fixed links to replace the hydraulic rams. This would utilize the existing sway bars and not require switching to the non-KDSS sway bar setup. I would then have to disconnect the hydraulic lines and deal with the dashboard light. I've been warned that this idea will result in a teeth chattering ride. While i can see the reasoning, I'm not so sure since this is a sway bar drop link and not a shock absorber. Anyway, the machine shop quoted me less then $200 labor per link, so I will be out $400 plus the cost of the parts I will use to fabricate the links. I just ordered the front and rear fixed links online, and the machine shop will basically cut them in half and extend them to the size of the ram. The two fixed links cost less than $100 each. I figure this is cheap enough to give it a shot. the machine shop has been taking its sweet time, so I'm sorry to say that I can't verify whether this is a decent solution or not.

 

[premise]

^ Note that the SB stiffness (bar diameter) is high for KDSS trucks. It can get away w/ this due to how KDSS functions. Fixed end links might typically use less stiff SB's?

 

[Furagwa]

Yes, I know the thickness is different between the stock and KDSS systems. Before I go through the hassle of converting to stock I thought I'd give my idea a try...

 

[///AIRDAM]

Yes, I know the thickness is different between the stock and KDSS systems. Before I go through the hassle of converting to stock I thought I'd give my idea a try...

How tall are they? I have not looked into this, but i remember seeing a picture floating around here before of what the KDSS links look like. There is a few companies in the offroad world that make hydraulic/shock absorber style sway bar end links

https://www.proutvparts.com/cdn/sho...c6d42f88eb5_463x.progressive.png?v=1625847234

Walker Links - Rear Sway Bar Shock for Polaris RZR XP 1000/Turbo by Wa – Pro UTV Parts

https://www.superatv.com/media/cata...ality=70&optimize=high&crop=1:33:1&width=1600

 

[Catskill4RNR]

My Wife took it in for the evaluation so when I called service to discuss after they had time to look they told me the KDSS repair would cost "thousands" of dollars but they could delete it and use some TRD parts for $800-$1,000. I doubt they even know what they are talking about.

I called back today and spoke directly to the parts guy and he is going to look into whether or not it's even doable. He claimed that the KDSS pump has been discontinued ???

 

[Furagwa]

I can't remember how long the existing hydraulic ram is, but I think it's on the order of 14 inches or a bit shorter. The top end has a bolt hole, but the bottom end is connected to the sway bar using a clamp similar to the way a piston connects to a crank shaft. This is why I want to try using the (another) fixed link from the other side, cutting it in half and lengthening it by welding a rod between the cut halves (or something similar in concept to lengthen it). I suppose a reasonable alternative would be to weld a spring between the two halves...

I recall that recently someone was quoted $17k to replace the system, but there were no details given IIRC. And if memory serves there will be no more KDSS for 4Runners produced after this year (only on Lexus?).

 

[honda250xtitan]

el oh el. weird things going on in here.



best bet, buy the non kdss sway bars and brackets. mock it up, figure out where you need to weld and drill. do that. than enjoy. if you up your front spring rate on your shocks, you can get away with just doing the rear sway bar.


swapping an axle housing is just silly. you guys realize people exist who can do this cool thing called welding????? i'm a total potato and i can do this.

 

[bzizzi]

Or you can do what I do, trade in every five years on a new 4R.

 

[<<<<]

bzizzi, you have commitment issues.

 

[trainman605]

Living in Texas where rust is pretty much unheard of, we probably would never run across a problem like this. My concert would be if rust is in that area, I would think it would be in many more places than just there. For myself if I lived where rust was most common in vehicles, I would be trading every three or four years and not dealing with problems caused by rust. I hate you have additional expenses on your vehicle when it's not really Toyota's fault, but conditions where you live add expenses to vehicle ownership.

 

[bward4runner]

I recently have run into essentially the same issue.

Just purchased a 2016 SR5 sight unseen in an auction thinking that I could save some money on a daily driver. I sure did save on the purchase but now am paying for it with this KDSS system :crazy: .

I did not think SR5s had KDSS. Anyways...I plugged in engine scan tool to find the code "C1851 low pressure in KDSS system"... pressure reads 0PSI on the scan tool. removed the skid cover for the kdss valve/accumulator and found it to be rusted out completely with what looked to be crystalized hydraulic fluid... and the valve is corroded to SH!T...my guess is that this is leaking and is the culprit for low pressure.
all the lines look OK and the hydraulic rams don't seem to be leaking. However the heads on the bleeder screws of the hydraulic rams are pretty well rusted away to nothing. If I want to try to recharge the system then I would have to get a vice grip on them and hope you can turn them lose. ( and there is not much room for gripping onto these screws in the rear of the truck

Long story short for the the truck: The highway ride is not ideal and there is a 1.5 inch lean to the drivers side. both I want to fix and guessing is related to the non functional KDSS.

Right now I'm debating on...
A) purchasing an accumulator/valve and try recharging the system myself
B) Upgrade shocks and springs and just leave the KDSS system connected as is uncharged in hopes of a better ride and get rid of lean.
C) Do what Furagwa said and fabricate and install modified sway bar links and then upgrade shocks and springs all around.


I'm tight on cash right now so going to live with it for a while but I will be following this thread for ideas and will post my solution to my problem when the time comes.

If you guys have any other ideas solution please DO share.

KISS over KDSS... in the salt belt anyways....LOL cheers

 

[premise]

^ "B"
And maybe remove the old KDSS stuff - optional

 

[Furagwa]

Something else you might want to consider is to look for a replacement in a junkyard. Good luck, whatever you choose to do...

 

[flyrv9]

I remember a thread a few years ago about a guy with a similar issue - KDSS problem and no good fix. Any repair was also expensive; so he deleted it and installed a standard suspension. I did a site search to find this thread and came up empty. But a Google search on 4Runner KDSS removal did come up with several links and a video or two. You might try that.

 

[bward4runner]

So just wanted to post an update on my KDSS situation....
finally got back to addressing the KDSS issue on my rusty ol' Canadian 4runner. I was starting to get sick of the lean and rolling around corners.


Decided to go with option C) and remove the KDSS pistons and install some modified/fabricated links.

Finished the rear last weekend and it went really smooth. Ended up purchasing the rear right side link and lengthened it to 13 1/2 inches in length from center of the bolt hole to the bottom of the link. Also had to cut off 1/4 inch on each side of the upper bushing in order for it to fit in the perch where the KDSS piston used to be.


With just the rear link installed, the driver side lean is practically gone and the body roll has significantly decreased going around corners.

I have been driving for a week now and on road/highway ride is definitely better but this mod is going to to take away some wheel articulation and I'm guessing will make the ride off road a little stiffer/bumpy. I have yet to take it on a really rough trail to test.

I plan to fabricate and install the front link next week along with installing Bilstein 6112s/5100s all around and see how the performance is when all said and done.


So for all you northern folks that have rusted out or corroded KDSS components and don't wanna pay big $$$$ to have it replaced, this may be a solution for you. Ended up spending about $200 USD on parts for the front and rear sway bars. If you know how to weld or have a friend then this can be a pretty simple solution.

Some pics attached of the mod

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[smoisan]

Decided to go with option C) and remove the KDSS pistons and install some modified/fabricated links.

Hi, I just had the KDSS delelted by a shop on my 2010 TE. Northeast also.

The KDSS light remains on though. I would like to turn it off either by software (OBD2 scanner?) or physically (disconnect it).

Did you encounter this issue? If so, what have you done?

Thanks.

 

[mofokid69]

Hi, I just had the KDSS delelted by a shop on my 2010 TE. Northeast also.

The KDSS light remains on though. I would like to turn it off either by software (OBD2 scanner?) or physically (disconnect it).

Did you encounter this issue? If so, what have you done?

Thanks.

Where did you have the job done, how much did cost, how's the ride after the delete, I have the same truck and looking to do the same, if I can do some of the work myself I will..