Loose Upper Control Arm

HotRodKing

HotRodKing

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I've been chasing an issue where the wheel of my 98 V6 4x4 jerks to the left under sudden braking. In the last 6 months, I've replaced all the brakes (braided lines, calipers, leaky rear axle seal, the works) and the steering rack with outer tie rods, ball joints, and sway bar bushings and end links. None of this has fixed my problem.

Today, I stuck a GoPro to my fender and aimed it at my upper control arm. I found that there is excessive play in the arm near the frame. Here's a video of it looped so you can see what's going on:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kTdst-Jfm2A

So now what? I've got new bushings on order from Toyota and will be changing that in the coming days, but is there anything else? I torqued the nut you see in the video to spec when I did the work to my front end and it was a bit loose. Do you think the nut came loose again or that the bushing is just blown out? Any advice is appreciated.
 
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Any noise in the suspension when you hit pot holes? Just curious as I have a clunk and am trying to narrow it down. Thought this might be part of it.
 
Well, why get toyota upper bushings?? it's easy and cheaper to just do the energy suspension ones.

Definitely the bushings. I'm pretty sure my drivers side LCA was doing that before i replaced the bushings.


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If you have 300k miles I would say your bushings are shot Get ready to replace the lower control arm bushings too. My tacoma did the same thing, brake and it would jerk. I replaced the upper and lower bushings and it good as new. When you remove the coilover to replace the uppers and there is no tension on the lower control arm that is when you should check those bushings too.
 
Mudeprived said:
Why is everything behind the bushing moving too? Or am I seeing things?
Click to expand...

No I see it too. Focus on the space in between the 2 brake lines. It gets bigger and smaller. Also looks like the the 3 strut mounting studs are moving. Maybe it's just the Gopro shifting a little and changing perspective.
That said, that gap between the bushing and washer and subsequent movement aint right at all.
 
I'm curious, how are you planning on getting the old bushings out?

And yeah, like [MENTION=124742]St Runner[/MENTION] mentioned, if you have 300,000 miles on your rig and your UCA bushings are doing that, it probably means your LCA bushings are toast too.

It does look like the top nuts for the strut are moving back and forth. Since the strut is connected the the LCA, I bet the worn LCA bushings are allowing that movement on the lower end and the (3) 14mm nuts on the top are loose allowing for the movement on the upper mount to the frame.

You live close by. Maybe we could make a video of it?
 
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185Runner said:
Any noise in the suspension when you hit pot holes? Just curious as I have a clunk and am trying to narrow it down. Thought this might be part of it.
Click to expand...

I actually do notice some short clunks and pops occasionally, but they have been that way for a while. I thought it might be CV joints, but I'm not sure. Haven't been able to consistently replicate it.

JRZEE2000TR4LTD said:
No I see it too. Focus on the space in between the 2 brake lines. It gets bigger and smaller. Also looks like the the 3 strut mounting studs are moving. Maybe it's just the Gopro shifting a little and changing perspective.
That said, that gap between the bushing and washer and subsequent movement aint right at all.
Click to expand...

I see the motor move exactly with the control arm, and I see the frame seem to twist up towards the body. Kinda worrisome to say the least. I agree, it could be a weird camera angle, but I'm just not sure. Might as well try to fix what I can while I have everything apart.
 
HotRodKing said:
I actually do notice some short clunks and pops occasionally, but they have been that way for a while. I thought it might be CV joints, but I'm not sure. Haven't been able to consistently replicate it.



I see the motor move exactly with the control arm, and I see the frame seem to twist up towards the body. Kinda worrisome to say the least. I agree, it could be a weird camera angle, but I'm just not sure. Might as well try to fix what I can while I have everything apart.
Click to expand...

Well, it is body on frame so you are going to get movement at the motor mounts and transmission mounts. Whether that's excessive movement, don't know.
 
mtbtim said:
I'm curious, how are you planning on getting the old bushings out?

And yeah, like [MENTION=124742]St Runner[/MENTION] mentioned, if you have 300,000 miles on your rig and your UCA bushings are doing that, it probably means your LCA bushings are toast too.

It does look like the top nuts for the strut are moving back and forth. Since the strut is connected the the LCA, I bet the worn LCA bushings are allowing that movement on the lower end and the (3) 14mm nuts on the top are loose allowing for the movement on the upper mount to the frame.

You live close by. Maybe we could make a video of it?
Click to expand...

No idea on how to get them out yet. I could borrow a friend's press, use a big threaded rod with washers and nuts, or rig something with a bottle jack. Worst case, I could have a shop do it all so I don't spend too much time screwing with it, but where's the fun in that??

As for making a video, that sounds like a great idea except that I am currently in SoCal. I may end up making an instructional video if I end up doing all the work.

AZBub said:
Well, why get toyota upper bushings?? it's easy and cheaper to just do the energy suspension ones.

Definitely the bushings. I'm pretty sure my drivers side LCA was doing that before i replaced the bushings.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Click to expand...

I'll have to look into that. I have a wholesale discount on parts, so one set of bushings for the UCA wasn't too expensive. The lowers however are very expensive. Should I do UCA and LCA bushings on both sides? I've already put a lot of time and money into the truck chasing this problem and I'm frustrated to say the least, but I'm planning on keeping it till I hit 400k, so maybe it's worth it? I don't daily drive it anymore though.
 
mtbtim said:
Well, it is body on frame so you are going to get movement at the motor mounts and transmission mounts. Whether that's excessive movement, don't know.
Click to expand...

Yeah I understand that it's supposed to move a little, its just suspect that its moving exactly as much as the UCA
 
HotRodKing said:
No idea on how to get them out yet. I could borrow a friend's press, use a big threaded rod with washers and nuts, or rig something with a bottle jack. Worst case, I could have a shop do it all so I don't spend too much time screwing with it, but where's the fun in that??

As for making a video, that sounds like a great idea except that I am currently in SoCal. I may end up making an instructional video if I end up doing all the work.

I'll have to look into that. I have a wholesale discount on parts, so one set of bushings for the UCA wasn't too expensive. The lowers however are very expensive. Should I do UCA and LCA bushings on both sides? I've already put a lot of time and money into the truck chasing this problem and I'm frustrated to say the least, but I'm planning on keeping it till I hit 400k, so maybe it's worth it? I don't daily drive it anymore though.
Click to expand...

A press won't work because you have to press them from the inside out. I thought I could use a press to do the LCA bushings out but no go because the opposing arm gets in the way. The UCA has less room between the arms so I don't know if you could get a bottle jack in there. Maybe the stock bottle jack that comes with the truck would fit. The threaded rod idea could definitely work. Also, if you have a vice that open wide enough, you could use a vice to press them out and back in. Some torch action would definitely help release the bushings bond with the control arm.

Definitely do both sides. I wouldn't make sense to do just one side because the other side is probably wasted too.
 
mtbtim said:
A press won't work because you have to press them from the inside out. I thought I could use a press to do the LCA bushings out but no go because the opposing arm gets in the way. The UCA has less room between the arms so I don't know if you could get a bottle jack in there. Maybe the stock bottle jack that comes with the truck would fit. The threaded rod idea could definitely work. Also, if you have a vice that open wide enough, you could use a vice to press them out and back in. Some torch action would definitely help release the bushings bond with the control arm.

Definitely do both sides. I wouldn't make sense to do just one side because the other side is probably wasted too.
Click to expand...

BTW, your vid on the LCA bushings really helped! My cams came out by hand surprisingly. Also the video doesn't do any justice on how loud the sound is when the bushings pop free. Id suggest to have some extra drawers ready cause it can really catch you off guard.
 
AZBub said:
BTW, your vid on the LCA bushings really helped! My cams came out by hand surprisingly. Also the video doesn't do any justice on how loud the sound is when the bushings pop free. Id suggest to have some extra drawers ready cause it can really catch you off guard.
Click to expand...

Ain't that the truth Chris. It scares the crap out of you when the bushing pops.
 
AZBub said:
Well, why get toyota upper bushings?? it's easy and cheaper to just do the energy suspension ones.

Definitely the bushings. I'm pretty sure my drivers side LCA was doing that before i replaced the bushings.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Click to expand...

Where do you buy the energy suspension bushings?
 
Just remember when installing Poly bushings that after some time they will squeak. I used to always say I never had issues with POLY's and normally dont.

I silicone sprayed the crap out of my LCA ES bushings and they are so loud now its pretty annoying.
 
the whiteline bushings have some sort of molded in seal on the poly part. when you press the sleeve in it makes a pretty tight seal, in hoping it helps keep the grease in the bushing.


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HotRodKing said:
Where do you buy the energy suspension bushings?
Click to expand...



For the uppers, Toytec has them, but if you reference the number you can get them on Amazon. Most likely the same price but if you have Prime the free shipping is worth it.


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JayRolla said:
Just remember when installing Poly bushings that after some time they will squeak. I used to always say I never had issues with POLY's and normally dont.

I silicone sprayed the crap out of my LCA ES bushings and they are so loud now its pretty annoying.
Click to expand...

Yeah I used to have poly sway bar bushings. Most annoying shit ever. I changed em out recently to OEM and it's great.
 
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