Maybe this is a "generational" thing, but -
- Thread starter Ron4RNevada
- Start date
BLACK-FL4RUNNER
Member
With all the LED sales, the prices have plummeted over the last couple years making them VERY affordable.
If only we could get all these people to buy ICON suspension kits and have the price drop on those also..... :high5:
If only we could get all these people to buy ICON suspension kits and have the price drop on those also..... :high5:
wfo9
New member
I've spent a lot of time offroading on bikes. trucks and motorcycles.
What most people don't realize is that more light is not always better. In fact. I would say that most light bars are completely wrong and do more harm than good....
You want your eyes well adjusted for smooth even light. The brighter the light the less detail you can make out. High speed is the only situation where super bright lights make any sense, and I have no need for that in my 4R.
The worse thing is some A-hole behind you on the trails trying to show off his retarded light bars, blinding you.
What most people don't realize is that more light is not always better. In fact. I would say that most light bars are completely wrong and do more harm than good....
You want your eyes well adjusted for smooth even light. The brighter the light the less detail you can make out. High speed is the only situation where super bright lights make any sense, and I have no need for that in my 4R.
The worse thing is some A-hole behind you on the trails trying to show off his retarded light bars, blinding you.
bimrunner
New member
I actually use my Amber fogs more than anything because with HID the combo gives me back some definition. Light bar is just sexy but unless I'm illuminating the trail when I'm out of the truck, I don't use it while driving... I definitely did not need it.
My inlaws live in the country North of Missoula MT. They smack about 1 a year. I have found that being an aware and observant driver is much safer than 50 million lights. My wife has nearly killed us more times than I can remember and she drives just like her parents. I swear they all have horse blinders on. I've seen deer 10-20 times standing around or headed towards to road and thought in my head.. "She has to see this..... SHe HAS to see this... " Nope. "HUN!!!! Deer!!!" Then we swerve around it or she loks in the general direction I was pointing... It's scary driving with them. I'll often see dear in the mountains here in CA and point them out or I'll see their eyes at night and know they are there, but she even as the passenger will never notice them..... I have never hit a deer.
philsey
New member
jwkilgore
New member
For the most part, considering that the majority of tricked-out 5th gens are urban "mall crawlers" that never see anything rougher than a speed bump or pothole, extra lights are useless.
For me, I grew up in a rural area with no street lights. None. Driving twisty dirt roads to get to the hunting stand before dawn with heavy cloud cover is a good example of a situation where more light would be useful. Typically I want all the light I can get at the start to drive as fast as possible, then dim down and slow down as I get closer to my destination. Final half mile or so I would be creeping along only using parking lights to let my eyes adjust.
Also just normal driving down regular roads with deer everywhere. I hit a total of three in high school (well, technically, one of them hit me) but none since.
Long range forward facing spots: Very useful if you are desert racing at night where you can see straight ahead for immense distances... which applies to what? 0.1% of people here? Otherwise wasteful decoration. Possibly useful as long-range spotlights in a pinch if you can maneuver your vehicle around.
Wide-range forward spot/floods: Very useful for spotting deer off to the side at a distance while driving down unlit rural roads. Also somewhat useful for seeing better around sharp back-road curves.
Area lights around perimeter of rack: Pointing to sides and rear, possibly also at corners. Immensely useful for setup/takedown of a campsite after dark, also for seeing around 180° hairpin mountain curves while driving. Rear lights are unbelievably useful for backing up in a dark area. Pillar ditch lights would be in this category, but are mounted lower down.
Under-vehicle Rock Lights: I'd never heard of these until recently (no rocks in my home area), but I can see where they would be immensely useful if driving in rocks at dusk or after dark. Otherwise you'd need a spotter with a flashlight to see under the vehicle.
I'm getting a wide-array LED bar as soon as I get a front bumper, and perimeter roof lights as soon as I get a rack. Rock lights will arrive eventually; probably before the roof rack.
For me, I grew up in a rural area with no street lights. None. Driving twisty dirt roads to get to the hunting stand before dawn with heavy cloud cover is a good example of a situation where more light would be useful. Typically I want all the light I can get at the start to drive as fast as possible, then dim down and slow down as I get closer to my destination. Final half mile or so I would be creeping along only using parking lights to let my eyes adjust.
Also just normal driving down regular roads with deer everywhere. I hit a total of three in high school (well, technically, one of them hit me) but none since.
Long range forward facing spots: Very useful if you are desert racing at night where you can see straight ahead for immense distances... which applies to what? 0.1% of people here? Otherwise wasteful decoration. Possibly useful as long-range spotlights in a pinch if you can maneuver your vehicle around.
Wide-range forward spot/floods: Very useful for spotting deer off to the side at a distance while driving down unlit rural roads. Also somewhat useful for seeing better around sharp back-road curves.
Area lights around perimeter of rack: Pointing to sides and rear, possibly also at corners. Immensely useful for setup/takedown of a campsite after dark, also for seeing around 180° hairpin mountain curves while driving. Rear lights are unbelievably useful for backing up in a dark area. Pillar ditch lights would be in this category, but are mounted lower down.
Under-vehicle Rock Lights: I'd never heard of these until recently (no rocks in my home area), but I can see where they would be immensely useful if driving in rocks at dusk or after dark. Otherwise you'd need a spotter with a flashlight to see under the vehicle.
I'm getting a wide-array LED bar as soon as I get a front bumper, and perimeter roof lights as soon as I get a rack. Rock lights will arrive eventually; probably before the roof rack.
jrandom
New member
I keep it reasonable. I have an Aux set of ambers and a pair of 4" driving lights (an a yet to install set of amber rock lights, lol not even sure I will like them)
I definitely like the driving lights as work lights, you'll never kill the battery. My high beams are actually a tad bit brighter than the driving lights. I have them set pretty wide. The beams don't overlap, they have a pretty good even spread. I use them when I want a way wider more even light at night. Frankly I wish the LED color temp were more around the ~3500K range.
Certainly not the know all be all of working/driving at night, I have worked 10 years of swing shift/graveyards driving a snowcat in my younger days, I too am of the more even wide spread and least possible amount of light you need the better theory. If its too dark and and your lights are too bright with not enough spread you might as well be driving through a tunnel you can only see what is in your beams. I prefer less. Snow storms we would drive with the amber strobe on :mod: that was a trip! but you could see where you were going in a white out, kinda important when driving a $350k 7-ton machine on a road made of snow above 1000 vertical feet of steep terrain, trees, and cliffs.
I definitely like the driving lights as work lights, you'll never kill the battery. My high beams are actually a tad bit brighter than the driving lights. I have them set pretty wide. The beams don't overlap, they have a pretty good even spread. I use them when I want a way wider more even light at night. Frankly I wish the LED color temp were more around the ~3500K range.
Certainly not the know all be all of working/driving at night, I have worked 10 years of swing shift/graveyards driving a snowcat in my younger days, I too am of the more even wide spread and least possible amount of light you need the better theory. If its too dark and and your lights are too bright with not enough spread you might as well be driving through a tunnel you can only see what is in your beams. I prefer less. Snow storms we would drive with the amber strobe on :mod: that was a trip! but you could see where you were going in a white out, kinda important when driving a $350k 7-ton machine on a road made of snow above 1000 vertical feet of steep terrain, trees, and cliffs.
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Ron4RNevada
New member
Some interesting responses - - -
Yes it definitely seems like a generation thing -
Where I come from:
I'm nearing 75. I wear glasses - for many years. But evidently my night vision is excellent.
I do not own a cell, i-pod, smart phone, tablet - None of those little screen things that everyone seems glued to all day (24 hours most days?). So my eyes are not sensitized to a little LED screen.
I live in the desert in northern Nevada. Out here we see a multitude of stars at night - even the milky way every night unless it is snowing or raining (which doesn't happen very often. I can even see the international space station transiting every 90 minutes (when it is over Nevada).
I stuck a couple of lights on the roof rack of my 2002 Land Rover once. Took them off the day after trying them out for the first time on a night off-road trek - - They were blinding the other guys. All of us in the club at the time voted to outlaw extra lights specifically for that reason.
I have nothing against LED or CFL lights for efficiency (around the house). I think they are rather dumb on most of the newer "classy cars"-> Mercedes, Audi, Lexus, etc.....
When I am driving at night around here where there are no trees mostly all I have to worry about as far as wildlife are coyotes crossing the road; the antelope, mountain lions, bobcats, foxes seem smarter than the coyotes. When in California I slow down in case of deer or bears. Most people I know who have hit wildlife have just been driving too fast for conditions.... Incidentally; just because the posted speed limit is 70 doesn't mean you have to go that fast.....
Driving in snow - Extra lights really don't help - I typically drive about 30mph or less when it's snowing. If you ever have to slow down, braking takes ALL THE CONTROL AWAY FROM YOU. Nobody has yet invented an A-TRAC or locker that helps while braking.
SO - Now go on with your justifications - It's fun to read. :lol:
Yes it definitely seems like a generation thing -
Where I come from:
I'm nearing 75. I wear glasses - for many years. But evidently my night vision is excellent.
I do not own a cell, i-pod, smart phone, tablet - None of those little screen things that everyone seems glued to all day (24 hours most days?). So my eyes are not sensitized to a little LED screen.
I live in the desert in northern Nevada. Out here we see a multitude of stars at night - even the milky way every night unless it is snowing or raining (which doesn't happen very often. I can even see the international space station transiting every 90 minutes (when it is over Nevada).
I stuck a couple of lights on the roof rack of my 2002 Land Rover once. Took them off the day after trying them out for the first time on a night off-road trek - - They were blinding the other guys. All of us in the club at the time voted to outlaw extra lights specifically for that reason.
I have nothing against LED or CFL lights for efficiency (around the house). I think they are rather dumb on most of the newer "classy cars"-> Mercedes, Audi, Lexus, etc.....
When I am driving at night around here where there are no trees mostly all I have to worry about as far as wildlife are coyotes crossing the road; the antelope, mountain lions, bobcats, foxes seem smarter than the coyotes. When in California I slow down in case of deer or bears. Most people I know who have hit wildlife have just been driving too fast for conditions.... Incidentally; just because the posted speed limit is 70 doesn't mean you have to go that fast.....
Driving in snow - Extra lights really don't help - I typically drive about 30mph or less when it's snowing. If you ever have to slow down, braking takes ALL THE CONTROL AWAY FROM YOU. Nobody has yet invented an A-TRAC or locker that helps while braking.
SO - Now go on with your justifications - It's fun to read. :lol:
:
Ron4RNevada
New member
I noticed.
ST1FLER
Banned
I am surprised you arent baffled by the fact that cars use gasoline and television is in color! LOL
LawnDart
Senior Member
So here's a good question, I don't believe Oregon has a law regarding light bars having to be covered when on-road. I know California does, but I doubt you'd be stopped for that. I may just buy a set of Rigid covers just to protect the light bar when driving on the highway.
Anyone else know the laws and how they break down state by state?
Anyone else know the laws and how they break down state by state?
YodaPride
New member
That is a great point. I hit a deer doing 25 - very minor damage. Hit him on the right front corner of the bumper as he leaped out into the road from my peripheral. My Light bar was installed but not wired. If it had been on I would have seen the deer in time to move over just a tad to avoid him.
I've gone moose spotting on some of the Maine back roads and the LED light bar is on point! Money well spent, just wish that I had it sooner for that ff'in deer.
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I'm 30, so younger than the OP, but I am on the side of logic with lighting. Modern cars *hack cough Hyundai Sonata rental* are interesting. I was in the Hyundai while my prior car was being serviced. LED DRLs were brighter and had better distance than the standard beam low beam. It was so bad driving in an urban area, I nearly hit a pedestrian at 8pm. after that, I said to myself, never again with non projector Lows. Preferably Projector HIDs or LEDs.
Its nearly 2016, lighting advancements have been made, but manufacturers arent utilizing them, or if they are, only on the top tier spec. Some are even stepping back. Others step up Toyota Corolla/Ford Explorer with standard LEDs. The Maxima used to come with HIDs a few years ago, now only the top tier comes with LED Lows. It would be truly wonderful to mandate a minimum standard of lighting. This way back yard mechanics wouldnt be so tempted to install over bright lights in inappropriate housings, shining all sorts of wrong.
All the crazy accent lights are distracting, there are numerous Tacos around here (Gulf coast FL) with hood scoop LEDs, bright as sin, never using headlights at night, but using roof light bars, that crap deserves a ticket and a groin kick.
I've got LED Lows on the way for my projectors, but before I put them to use on the public road, they will be inspected, re aimed if necessary.
Tuesday night, coming home 1am no lights on the highway, very few passers southbound, nobody around, a black refrigerator or freezer in the passing lane, but over just far enough into the right lane that I had to go 1/2 way off the road. I couldnt see what was down there, I know the road and its often 3 foot of water or swamp. Brighter lights would have been helpful to see whats down there, if it were safe to even go there. Im in the 4 runner, but had it still been raining, the average car would have gotten stuck. Bad situations like that come often enough to entice me to add more lights. Gulf Coast is like nothing Ive seen before for random crap in the road at night. Had I been depending on my S10 '03 model headlights, I know I wouldnt have been to see it in time to brake.
Its nearly 2016, lighting advancements have been made, but manufacturers arent utilizing them, or if they are, only on the top tier spec. Some are even stepping back. Others step up Toyota Corolla/Ford Explorer with standard LEDs. The Maxima used to come with HIDs a few years ago, now only the top tier comes with LED Lows. It would be truly wonderful to mandate a minimum standard of lighting. This way back yard mechanics wouldnt be so tempted to install over bright lights in inappropriate housings, shining all sorts of wrong.
All the crazy accent lights are distracting, there are numerous Tacos around here (Gulf coast FL) with hood scoop LEDs, bright as sin, never using headlights at night, but using roof light bars, that crap deserves a ticket and a groin kick.
I've got LED Lows on the way for my projectors, but before I put them to use on the public road, they will be inspected, re aimed if necessary.
Tuesday night, coming home 1am no lights on the highway, very few passers southbound, nobody around, a black refrigerator or freezer in the passing lane, but over just far enough into the right lane that I had to go 1/2 way off the road. I couldnt see what was down there, I know the road and its often 3 foot of water or swamp. Brighter lights would have been helpful to see whats down there, if it were safe to even go there. Im in the 4 runner, but had it still been raining, the average car would have gotten stuck. Bad situations like that come often enough to entice me to add more lights. Gulf Coast is like nothing Ive seen before for random crap in the road at night. Had I been depending on my S10 '03 model headlights, I know I wouldnt have been to see it in time to brake.
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Hellamatic
New member
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Hellamatic
New member
I can speak for Alberta's laws - I talked to an RCMP officer a few years ago about this. He said that technically ANY aftermarket light that is installed above the factory headlights is illegal. All other auxiliary lighting needs to be covered when not off road. However, he also mentioned that he would never waste his time pulling anyone over or writing a ticket unless they were being a dick with it on in town or something dumb.
I've often thought of this too - with the latest batch of mandated safety features on new vehicles (stability control, backup cameras,) it's funny there seems to be zero standards for headlight performance. Or maybe there is and I'm ignorant to it - can anyone chime in on this? This frustrated me when I bought my f250 for work last year - they come with just basic shitty halogen headlights, regardless of what model you go with.
Jhalko
New member
Done this at least 10 times myself, any large lightbar is worthless in those conditions. I have loved my Amber spots for this, nice contrast and doesn't throw light everywhere. Just put D2 Amber in so I'll see if they work as well as the duAlly spots. The true Amber color was key, I started with white, no Bueno.
Off-road yes, in a blizzard, no way.
But to the OP's comment, my lightbar in the upper grill is my camp finder. Because I am ALWAYS that fool rolling in to find a camp an hour after dark and the distance and spread is much better than high beams for this purpose.
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