My Runner left me dead on the road! Please help diagnose.

SkidPalace

Member
Sorry for the long post, but please try to bear with me. My truck is my daily driver and I really need to get back on the road as quickly and cheaply as possible. Any help would be greatly appreciated.
I was headed back from the gym and my 2000 4Runner started hesitating.
The hesitation got progressively worse until I was forced to pull over and crawl 50 yards at a time. I could barely bring the engine to 1000 rpm before it would hesitate and sputter to a stall. I was able to resart and crawl about two miles, 50 yards a whack, all the way to the Advance Auto Parts store in my town with the hopes that I could have them scan the engine (it threw a CEL eventually).
So I finally get there 10 minutes before they close and the guy scans my truck and tells me:
P1130, mass airflow sensor malfunction.
P0171 System lean bank 1.
P0172 System rich bank 1.
So I say I have a K&N type oiled cloth air filter, so it probably is a fouled MAF and I should grab a can of MAF cleaner anyway. I spray the MAF from the air filter opening (I know, total waste of time) and no dice.
The really helpful guy comes out to me and let s me know that they have one MAF for my truck in stock and I might want to grab it before they close up. So I figure what the hell, I may as well get it. I have my girl meet me with my socket set and I swap out the MAF. Still no dice. I was able to at least get the truck to rev a bit higher by stabbing the gas pedal, all old skool carbureted style. By then the parts guy had finished closing up shop and came out to check my progress. He suggests that it sounds possibly like bad gas -which I had though of almost immediately - in fact, I had bought a bottle of fuel treatment with the MAF cleaner a half hour earlier. So I dump that in the tank. and run the truck a bit more.
I figure it is running enough to get me a mile and a half home. No sooner did I pull out of the shop did the thing fall back to the sputtering and stalling.
I eventually had to have my girlfriend tow me back with her CR-V.
Now the fun part...
I get home and fire up my toyota service manual system thingy and what do I see? P1130 is actually the A/F Sensor malfunction code. The freakin guy, as helpful as he was, mistook the MAF for the A/F sensors. I even said to the guy when he read the system lean and system rich codes that it sounded more like an a/f or an o2 sensor issue. Oh well.
So now I am even more confused. Can an A/F sensor cause the whole engine to shut down? I actually had one go bad 40K miles ago throwing the same P1130 code and the truck drove just fine. Does this sound right?
Sorry for the LOOOOONG post.
Advice please? I am dreading having to replace the a/f sensor. My studs are rusted badly. The friggin dealer replaced the last one to the tune of $460 - don't even get me started :redbrick:. I'll be changing this one assuming it is actually the culprit.
 
Register to hide this ad
I don't think your problem is with the A/F sensor. We had that go out on ours and it does not strand you. It simply goes open loop and pretty much runs almost the same except worse fuel economy.

Oh and BTW, as usual you were bent over and hosed by the dealer. I think our A/F sensor was about $110 and took all of 5 minutes to install. It's two bolts and a connector.
 
Last edited:
I don't think your problem is with the A/F sensor. We had that go out on ours and it does not strand you. It simply goes open loop and pretty much runs almost the same except worse fuel economy.

That's what happened last time. My CEL was on and there was a pretty nasty exhaust smell along with lousy gas milage, but it ran just fine.
This is something altogether different.
I am thinking it is a fuel delivery issue. Could it be a fuel filter or pump or pressure regulator?
 
Could be fuel related. You'll need to put a pressure gauge on the fuel rail. I think the pressure should be steady around 35 psi.
 
It doesn't help that you are supercharged ether, low fuel pressure could definately mean bad things for a S/C'd engine. I would check fuel pressure, maybe swap the fuel filter.
 
It doesn't help that you are supercharged ether, low fuel pressure could definately mean bad things for a S/C'd engine. I would check fuel pressure, maybe swap the fuel filter.

Yah, s/c'd without fuel mods. This sucks. I have to figure this out tomorrow and I do not want to have to bring it to the stealer. They will bend me way over. I wish there was a good Toyota truck specialist in the Boston area.
Anyway, just throwing this out there, but just yesterday I had posted about taping the slot in my intake silencer to simluate an ISR mod. My very first thought when the truck started sputtering was that the tape had come off and got into the engine. I pulled over and yanked the intake immediately and thankfully saw the tape intact inside the silencer. I ripped it out just to be safe. Any chance that change in airflow threw some ratios off? I can't imagine it could. Certainly not enough to grenade the engine.
Also, I filled up yesterday and I have only driven 50 miles since. Could these be symptoms of bad gas?
 
Will I need the special service tool pressure gauge (SST 09268-45014) mentioned in the service manual to check the fuel pressure, or will a universal gauge work? And are these stealership parts or are they available at parts stores?
 
The freakin guy, as helpful as he was, mistook the MAF for the A/F sensors. I even said to the guy when he read the system lean and system rich codes that it sounded more like an a/f or an o2 sensor issue.

Please correct me if I'm wrong, but AFAIK, the Mass Air Flow sensor is the only air flow sensor.
 
Please correct me if I'm wrong, but AFAIK, the Mass Air Flow sensor is the only air flow sensor.

Right. I think that how the parts guy made his honest mistake. He was reading me the codes in the dark while I was writing. We were both talking and thinking intake i.e. MASS AIR FLOW and the reader had spit out A/F, which is actually AIR/FUEL, not mass air flow. The air fuel is the sensor on the bung in front of the cat on the exhaust. The dead giveaway was the too lean / too rich 0171/0172 codes. Those are air/fuel mix trouble codes.
The )1130 according to the manual says:
A/F Sensor Circuit Range/Performance Malfunction (Bank 1 Sensor 1)
- Open or short in A/F sensor circuit
- A/F sensor
- Air induction system
- Fuel pressure
- Injector
- ECM

I am going to focus on the fuel pressure and ECM areas. Could be a short in some harness or connector, fuel filter clog, failed fuel pump. I have to go buy a fuel pressure tester. God I wish I had a friend or two that knew what a wrench was.
 
Did you check your plugs, wires and coil packs. Many people have chased issues for days to find they needed either just plugs and wires or had a bad coil pack.
 
Did you check your plugs, wires and coil packs. Many people have chased issues for days to find they needed either just plugs and wires or had a bad coil pack.

Its not that, the symtoms arent there for that. Change your fuel filter and check the fuel delivery lines to see if they are clogged. Glogged Lines = poor fuel delivery, whic them will stall the car out if it cant give enough fuel for the rpms.
 
If you need to get it going today you may want to bite the bullet, take it to the stealer and pay the diagnosis fee.
 
Thanks guys. I swung by the stealer to to pick the brains of the service counter guys. I had dropped $1400 on my 90K service there, so they seemed to be helpful in brainstoming the possible causes.
We were in agreement that the A/F or o2 sensors would not stall the engine.
A fuel pump or EFI system failure would throw a specific code.
The most logical cause seems to be a bad MAF sensor. I recall when I cleaned my TB a couple of months ago I tried to run the engine with the intake off. The engine would not stay running bacause the MAF sensor was not sensing any air.
My stock Denso dealer installed plugs are only 40K old, wires probably original, but we ruled them out since a failure there would only make the truck run like crap. not complete failure. They would also throw specific codes. A clogged fuel filter is unlikely to clog completely, killing the engine. The engine would not start at all with a fuel pump failure, or a blown EFI fuse.
I am targeting the MAF and it's connector and harness. The MAF is one of the sensors that will stop an engine dead.
So in the daylight, I noticed that my original MAF was filthy. I gave it a few good sprays with MAF cleaner and it appears that one of the platinum wires is crusted brown. I can't tell if it is a burnt wire or surface crud. Either way, it could be the issue. Faulty readings from MAF could throw off the A/F ratio so much that it could cause a P1130 A/F sensor trouble code, no?
That doesn't explain why the remanfcatured MAF I bought last night did not cure the problem.
I plan to yank the battery cables and clear the 'puter and restart with the old cleaned MAF and then the new MAF.
Thoughts?
Times a wastin', it's already 10:30.
Original MAF. Is that brown crusty stuff something I can clean with a Q-tip (carefully) & MAF cleaner?
<a href="http://s814.photobucket.com/albums/zz68/skidpalace/4Runner/?action=view&current=DSC_7914.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://i814.photobucket.com/albums/zz68/skidpalace/4Runner/DSC_7914.jpg" border="0" alt="Photobucket"></a>
Here is the reference "new" MAF. By the way, it is a remanufactured original Toyota Denso unit that looks brand new. $80 at Advance Auto.
<a href="http://s814.photobucket.com/albums/zz68/skidpalace/4Runner/?action=view&current=DSC_7923.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://i814.photobucket.com/albums/zz68/skidpalace/4Runner/DSC_7923.jpg" border="0" alt="Photobucket"></a>
 
It really poses the symptoms of a bad MAF. As you said, disconnect the battery with the new MAF in, grab a coffee, and then connect back up. Also, since you have been paying around with your intake, look for any disconnected lines in the intake and throttle body area.
Forgot to mention; do not touch those wires with a q-tip. You can blast them with the cleaner but they are delicate and you do have a chance of damaging them. If the new MAF works, then there is no real risk cleaning the old one though since it is already (most likely ) faulty.
 
Last edited:
Success. Dirty MAF.

Well, looks like I am up and running.
I gently swabbed at the original MAF wire until it came pretty clean. you can compare the below pic to mine from above.
<a href="http://s814.photobucket.com/albums/zz68/skidpalace/4Runner/?action=view&current=DSC_7925.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://i814.photobucket.com/albums/zz68/skidpalace/4Runner/DSC_7925.jpg" border="0" alt="Photobucket"></a>
I swapped the original MAF back in and she fired right up. No rough idle, no hesitation. I could not be more relieved. I do not have the scratch to drop a big chink of change on car repairs right now.
I did not try to start the car today with the new MAF. Not sure why the truck would not run last night with it installed. It is possible that the new reman unit was dead out of the box. I wonder also if the truck sitting over night with a dead battery had cleared the codes on it's own. By dead I mean too weak to start the engine, but all the dash lights and hazards were still flashing. When I tried to start her this morning, she cranked once or twice then clickity-click. I would think that would be still enough juice to hold the programs in memory. I was planning to disconnect both positive and negative leads and touch them together for a couple of minutes as the service tech said. Oh well, not necessary apparently.
It appears that the parts guy was on the money after all. Looks like the moral of the story is... If it walks like a duck and quacks like a duck, then it must be a... dirty Mass Airflow Sensor.
Thanks for all your input and advice.
:cheers:
 
Its not that, the symtoms arent there for that. Change your fuel filter and check the fuel delivery lines to see if they are clogged. Glogged Lines = poor fuel delivery, whic them will stall the car out if it cant give enough fuel for the rpms.



I would say a spark issue was equally as possible as a clogged fuel filter.
 
Good to hear you resolved the issue with minor cost, and that the q-tipping worked. How sturdy do those wires feel?

Thank you and let me tell you that I cannot believe I did what I did.
I just saw a video from K&N regarding what they call a myth that their oiled filters foul MAFs.
At roughly 2:10 into this video you can see what those delicate wires look like. The fine wire that we can see is merely the POST around which the actual platinum wire is wound!!! The video shows the wires at 5000x magnification!
If I had saw this video, I would never have touched the wire with a Q-tip.
I am positive there are fine threads of cotton stuck in the wires and will probably collect more contaminants in the future.
What felt to be a gentle rubbing of the Qtip was probably like a wrecking ball to the wire.
I, for one, will not be Q-tipping my MAF sensor anymore.
Do so at your own risk!!!! At the very least rub your q-tip up and down perpendicular to the wire, NOT lengthwise along the wire.
Here's why:
YouTube - MAF Mystery - Part 1 of 4 - Intro & Test Results
 
On a side note, you said your Denso plugs have 40K. Service interval is 24K or 2 years. That could still have something to do with your issues, I'd at least have a look at 'em.
 
just read your post, im glad you got it running again , i know how u feel to get it running after something like that. funny coz i still got grease and junk on my hands from cleaning down my MAF sensor an hour ago. took apart the intake box and took me a while to take out the MAF sensor part. i've never had it cleaned since i've bought it and that was in '01. however, it didnt look dirty..but i still gave it couple of sprays. hope ur truck runs well now and we both get better mileage!
 

Members online

Forum statistics

Threads
278,316
Messages
3,554,111
Members
248,016
Latest member
Advally Service

Trending content

Back
Top