Need a commuter car - Prius?

[Thai]

Now, another option for OP that you may want to consider is Chevy Cruze ECO. My brother has one...and i am very very impress with it. On the highway, it easily gets 40+ mpg...combined, he gets around 34-45 mpg. And this is a very high quality car...very quiet and nice riding. Interior materials are OK, but put together very solid. Top safety ratings. And i think that he got it for around $19k out the door. Cruze was designed from the ground up to bring GM back into relevance...so, they spent a lot of money on it.

Actually, if i were to do it again and wanted cheap, then i would get Cruze ECO...and this is coming from a big fan of Toyota and hybrids! If i want something roomier (for kids) and more refinement, then i would get Camry Hybrid (but this comes at about a $12k penalty). If i want something awesome and luxurious, then Avalon Hybrid...OR Acura RLX!! Acura RLX is like a party in my pants!!

 

[Gerdo]

As already said. Get a good econocar (either gas or diesel). It'll cost less and get about the same MPG. Also less maintenance. You also aren't looking at a ton of batteries that will need to be replaced sometime down the road.

 

[Thai]

As already said. Get a good econocar (either gas or diesel). It'll cost less and get about the same MPG. Also less maintenance. You also aren't looking at a ton of batteries that will need to be replaced sometime down the road.

Huh?! Really? Dude, read up on stuff! Love to see some FACTS behind those claims...JohnsD90 failed miserably in the past...maybe you're different? Love the less maintenance part!! Tons of batteries to replace! That's funny.

But, i do agree with gasser ecobox like Cruze ECO...very nice option.

 

[Gerdo]

Eventually those batteries will need to be replaced. Maybe you sell before that point.

Ok, I'm off base with the maintenance issue. More potential issues with the addition of the electrical system.

 

[SV_Dude]

Maybe I'm a bit off base with this suggestion too... BUT, if you want to get a good car that gets good mileage (to save money of course), then go find a 5-10 year old camry or honda. Maintenance will be very minimal and you'll still get 25-30mpg or more. Plus you can find a used one for under 5k. The monthly payment you'll be making on a new hybrid is more than what you'll spend in a month for gas.

I never understood the idea that people have to spend 20k or more on a vehicle to save money on gas. That line of thinking seems kind of backwards, gas is cheap in comparison to the cost of a vehicle. I would say to buy a vehicle that you would enjoy and is easy for your needs and deal with the economics of that particular vehicle. If you can afford an expensive gas guzzler, then odds are you can afford the gas. If you cannot, then don't buy the guzzler.

 

[Thai]

Eventually those batteries will need to be replaced. Maybe you sell before that point.

Ok, I'm off base with the maintenance issue. More potential issues with the addition of the electrical system.

Do you even read? Huh?! Read above posts dude. Toyota HYBRID system has been proven for over a decade to be extremely reliable with NONE of the issues you raised. None. Nada. Zero.

 

[GMZ]

Wow, this got interesting! Very lively discourse. Love my TDI for the blend of sportiness and efficiency, but agreed it does come with a price. For a pure efficiency standpoint it is hard to go wrong with Toyota. New Camry Hybrid are amazing and fast too!

I still think the best route to go would be a used late model Corolla LE. With the LE you get all the conveniences, and a lightly used (or certified) specimen can probably be had for around $15k. A solid 40 mpg on the hwy and very reliable.

New TDIs do still use injectors. The Jetta/Golf use piezo and the Passat uses solenoid driven injectors which fire at a slightly lower pressure (-200 psi IIRC).

 

[Thai]

Maybe I'm a bit off base with this suggestion too... BUT, if you want to get a good car that gets good mileage (to save money of course), then go find a 5-10 year old camry or honda. Maintenance will be very minimal and you'll still get 25-30mpg or more. Plus you can find a used one for under 5k. The monthly payment you'll be making on a new hybrid is more than what you'll spend in a month for gas.

I never understood the idea that people have to spend 20k or more on a vehicle to save money on gas. That line of thinking seems kind of backwards, gas is cheap in comparison to the cost of a vehicle. I would say to buy a vehicle that you would enjoy and is easy for your needs and deal with the economics of that particular vehicle. If you can afford an expensive gas guzzler, then odds are you can afford the gas. If you cannot, then don't buy the guzzler.

The problem with buying a used car (5-10 years old) is that, in all likelihood, the maintenance will end up being more than you expect. Starters, shocks, AC system, etc..

In addition, is safety a top issue? If it is, then you may want a more current car. Stability control, airbags, safety cage, high-tensile steel, etc. favors the current car over 5-10 year old car.

And buying used means that you really don't know what the prior owner did with it. I understand buying a used 2-3 year old car with low mileage...but 5-10 years old??? Ooooo...that's risky!

I still think the best route to go would be a used late model Corolla LE. With the LE you get all the conveniences, and a lightly used (or certified) specimen can probably be had for around $15k. A solid 40 mpg on the hwy and very reliable.

I had a 2005 Corolla...pretty crappy IMO. Rattles, noisy, bouncy. And poor crash test scores.

For $15k, i would rather wait and get another $3k and buy a Chevy Cruze ECO!

 

[atv223]

I appreciate everyone's input.

I am currently doing the "10 year old car", have done it and am done with it. I am thinking that plan may really be penny wise and pound foolish when you factor in the repair costs and residual value of $0.00, not to mention the extreme aggravation of breakdowns. I have had 3, 10 plus year old vehicles a commuters and all of them needed a tow at least once.

That's why I am just looking at this as a "consumable" buy it for $XX,000 new, put 120,000 miles on it, sell it for $X,000 rinse and repeat.

The Camery Hybrid XLE has peaked my interest. Looks like there is about a $3,000 premium over the standard Camery XLE comparably equipped. With my estimated annual mileage and $3.50/gallon gas, 5 years is pretty much the break even point. If gas goes up, I keep the car longer than 5 years (meaning exceed my mileage estimates), the Hybrid looks better. But we are not talking a huge about. However, Consumer Reports claims the Hybrid has better acceleration, so that's a plus. Also, if I extrapolate from the Prius, I assume the regenerative braking on the hybrid Camery means the longer lasting brakes, so I assume they hybrid will be lower maintenance costs in the long run.

In my 5 year - $3.50/gallon scenario, the Prius still comes out $4,000 a head, even though the purchase price is smack in the middle of the XLE and XLE Hybrid (I am used Edmunds TMV)

I have to agree with Thai that the "battery issues" is a red herring today, the Nickle Metal-hydride battery technology is proven and nearly bullet proof. This was my biggest hold back 6+ years ago on hybrid technology, but I consider it proven today. The Lithium based technology is still a question mark in my mind, but that's only used in the plugin, which has no practical use for me.

Still a difficult one.

So where to people thing gas prices are going with the reelection of Obama?

 

[Thai]

The Camery Hybrid XLE has peaked my interest. Looks like there is about a $3,000 premium over the standard Camery XLE comparably equipped. With my estimated annual mileage and $3.50/gallon gas, 5 years is pretty much the break even point. If gas goes up, I keep the car longer than 5 years (meaning exceed my mileage estimates), the Hybrid looks better. But we are not talking a huge about. However, Consumer Reports claims the Hybrid has better acceleration, so that's a plus. Also, if I extrapolate from the Prius, I assume the regenerative braking on the hybrid Camery means the longer lasting brakes, so I assume they hybrid will be lower maintenance costs in the long run.

So where to people thing gas prices are going with the reelection of Obama?

Camry Hybrid uses the same exact technology as Prius, except with a bigger gas engine. So, yeah, all my pluses above apply to Camry Hybrid as well.

IMO, with Camry hybrid hitting 40 mpg (combined!), it is the way to go IMO. I love my Prius...so does my wife...but she wants TCH next for the refinement.

IMHO, gas prices will gradually go up with Obama. But, we will see i guess.

HOWEVER, atv223, do yourself a favor...go testdrive a Cruze ECO. It is tighter than Camry hybrid (in space) and handling (a good thing). It is probably just as quiet. And within a few mpgs, it gets similar numbers. All of this in a much cheaper package. Testdrive one and see how you like it.

 

[JohnsD90]

Gas Prices are gonna go up over time, just expect it. I do agree that a couple year old civic will be your best bet, it will be cheaper overall. My dad had a civic years back, said he had it for 115k miles and only ever changed the oil.

But i wouldnt reccomend a hybrid unless you are doing city traffic. I have gotten 56mpg in my 99.5 jetta for an entire tank and i average around 47mpg beating the crap out of it with a stage 3 tune and injectors (been on since 80k), and im sure if i take the 2011 out i could get close to that. Occasionally a piece of plastic trim breaks on the interior, usually its more operator error, but i will say my 4runners interior held up better at 204k miles vs. the jetta at 204k miles, but its not a bad place to be, and the parts that break can be had cheap. But i doubt that there will be many Prius's making much futher than 200-250k without battery replacement or other extensive parts, whereas i am still using the original turbo, and other than an odd part here or there, its all been regular maintanence items like Timing belt, water pump, wheel bearings, CV shaft, Ball Joint, but most of that stuff was replaced at around 250k, which is way past the expected life of the part. I do the T-belt every 100k, id urge you on any car you on to not stray past the belts limit if it is an interference motor.

On the 50k mile oil change, if you take an oil sample every 15k miles and send it out, it will show the oil wear and viscosity and tell you whether it is contaminated or not, or if it is no good to continue using, VW may not tell you to do it, but it is completley safe for the vehicle.

Buy whatever you want to buy, but you wont be dissappointed with a Jetta or Golf tdi, i'd urge you to test drive one.

 

[Thai]

But i doubt that there will be many Prius's making much futher than 200-250k without battery replacement or other extensive parts,

On the 50k mile oil change, if you take an oil sample every 15k miles and send it out, it will show the oil wear and viscosity and tell you whether it is contaminated or not, or if it is no good to continue using, VW may not tell you to do it, but it is completley safe for the vehicle.

Buy whatever you want to buy, but you wont be dissappointed with a Jetta or Golf tdi, i'd urge you to test drive one.

John, where do you get your information?? 200k battery replacement and extensive parts?? Huh? Dude, even if Prius gets a new battery every 100k miles (which it does NOT), i would bet that it will still come out ahead of any TDI! Consumer Reports pretty much disprove everything you just regurgitated.

50k mile oil changes! Haha, yeah, good luck getting VW to warranty your engine or anything related to powertrain! But then again, VW warranty is about as good as the toilet paper i used this morning to clean my arse, right John?! You know it well. :nono:

 

[JohnsD90]

John, where do you get your information?? 200k battery replacement and extensive parts?? Huh? Dude, even if Prius gets a new battery every 100k miles (which it does NOT), i would bet that it will still come out ahead of any TDI! Consumer Reports pretty much disprove everything you just regurgitated.

50k mile oil changes! Haha, yeah, good luck getting VW to warranty your engine or anything related to powertrain! But then again, VW warranty is about as good as the toilet paper i used this morning to clean my arse, right John?! You know it well. :nono:

Warrenty is to 30k miles last i checked. Normal Service is free within warrenty, i would assume he would use these. You are picking very specific points to argue with me on, which is fine but each car will have positives and negatives. I also thought 200-250k was generous for a battery in a car, much longer than most cars live.

 

[Thai]

I have gotten 56mpg in my 99.5 jetta for an entire tank and i average around 47mpg beating the crap out of it with a stage 3 tune and injectors (been on since 80k)

This claim is always interesting. Lets take the driver out of the equation. Let's use a more objective measure...EPA.

EPA (with its new rating system to be more realistic) rates:

2000 VW Jetta TDI 5-speed manual: 35/44/38 (combined)

2010 Toyota Prius: 51/48/50 (combined)

Sorry, you may modify crap to your car, but lets talk OEM vs OEM. And we're not even talking about reliability and durability, which consistently puts Prius at the top and VW at the very bottom next to Hummer and Yugos.

 

[Thai]

Warrenty is to 30k miles last i checked. Normal Service is free within warrenty, i would assume he would use these. You are picking very specific points to argue with me on, which is fine but each car will have positives and negatives. I also thought 200-250k was generous for a battery in a car, much longer than most cars live.

But then again, you need to do more research into the lives of these batteries.

Does VW recommend oil changes every 50k miles? If not, then please keep quiet.

 

[Atlanta_man]

Let's quit annoying Mr Thai
He likes the Prius !

 

[atv223]

HOWEVER, atv223, do yourself a favor...go testdrive a Cruze ECO. It is tighter than Camry hybrid (in space) and handling (a good thing). It is probably just as quiet. And within a few mpgs, it gets similar numbers. All of this in a much cheaper package. Testdrive one and see how you like it.

Even suggesting a Chevy is entering unfriendly territory with my wife! She is totally biased against any American made car these days! If I suggested a Chevy, we bought it and we had problems it would be "I told you so!!" If we buy a Toyota and the sames thing happens "Hmm, must be a fluke". So a high risk proposition for sure!

I am tempted to believe that either Toyotas will have better resale value than the Cruze.

 

[Thai]

Let's quit annoying Mr Thai
He likes the Prius !

Oh great, another intelligent response. Btw, I prefer Camry Hybrid. Read the thread!

 

[JohnsD90]

But then again, you need to do more research into the lives of these batteries.

Does VW recommend oil changes every 50k miles? If not, then please keep quiet.

Does Toyota Reccomend using idependent mechanics? If not then realize what the manufacturer says should used as a guideline, but most certianly not something that is set in stone. Toyota also says their fuel filters are a lifetime product which is obviously false considering i have changed mine 4 times in 60k miles.

 

[JohnsD90]

This claim is always interesting. Lets take the driver out of the equation. Let's use a more objective measure...EPA.

EPA (with its new rating system to be more realistic) rates:

2000 VW Jetta TDI 5-speed manual: 35/44/38 (combined)

2010 Toyota Prius: 51/48/50 (combined)

Sorry, you may modify crap to your car, but lets talk OEM vs OEM. And we're not even talking about reliability and durability, which consistently puts Prius at the top and VW at the very bottom next to Hummer and Yugos.

EPA results were slanted then, go on tdiclub, every month they have highest MPG contests, most people just submit there normal driving numbers and most are above 50 without trying. I can take a bone stock 2000 jetta tdi 5 speed and get 55mpg hand calculated without hypermilling tactics for as long of a distance on normal highways as you want, i am doubting your prius will do that. I got 35mpg once ever, and it was a very cold week, drivinging in the snow with no speedsover 45mph, i usually never go below42mpg.