Rear diff/locker dilemma

[BrandonF]

Well, my rear diff has had a tiny leak for almost 2 years now and recently, it's started to actually drip and create a small mark on the pavement if I'm parked for an extended amount of time. So... it's time to pull it apart and replace the gasket that sits between the 3rd and axle housing and what better time to install a locker?

I've been looking at the elocker swap but since I have a manual with 4.10 gearing, it's not that simple. I don't feel confident about modifying my own axle housing to accept a 4.10 locked 3rd out of a tacoma. I don't have any welding skills and overall, it seems like a bit of a pain in the ass and may be prone to leaking down the road.

Another option I thought of was to buy a 4.10 tacoma elocker 3rd and a complete 4.30 elocker 4runner axle, swap the 3rd's, and then swap my whole axle with the bastardized 4.10 elocker 4runner axle. But again, this may be more trouble than it's worth.

I have been inquiry with some shops about ARB air locker pricing, but I feel like it may be a bit more than I'm willing to spend. I'm still awaiting some price quotes. That being said, I would like on board air anyways.

My last option is to go with a cheap auto locker. I prefer to spend the money and do things right the first time, so this is a toss up. I plan to regear and go to bigger tires eventually, so maybe it wouldn't be a bad idea to get an auto locker to tie me over until I want to regear. Once my 4.10 gearing is out of the question, an e-locker swap becomes much simpler. Who knows, maybe I would be completely happy with DD'ing an auto locker. I've only ever driven one auto-locker equipped 4runner and it was too brief of a drive to really judge it.

I'm really just thinking out loud here, but anyone's input is appreciated.

 

[amalik]

Just throwing this out there but... do you plan to do rear axle seals while all the rear end is apart? Might as well.

 

[KidVermicious]

I think these things:

It makes no sense to not regear while you have the third member out, if you know you want to regear eventually anyway.

ARBs are a great locker, and require minimal modification of 3rd/housing, but they're much more expensive and you don't need that much strength.

Swapping axle housings is not a tough job. If you can find a 4runner housing and a 4.10 third that's not a bad option. A better option while we're on the topic of regearing is to find a 4.30 third and housing, and a 4.30 front diff to go with it.

Spartan lockers are cheap, strong, and not nearly as scary as all the guys who have never used one will try and tell you. There's a learning curve for a couple days while you get used to it and then you're good. I'm not saying a selectable isn't better overall, but if budget is an issue, absolutely don't be scared of an autolocker. They're great bang for the buck.

Those are the things I think.

 

[BrandonF]

Just throwing this out there but... do you plan to do rear axle seals while all the rear end is apart? Might as well.

That is a good point. I have no idea when (or if ever) my axle seals were done last.

 

[BrandonF]

I think these things:

It makes no sense to not regear while you have the third member out, if you know you want to regear eventually anyway.

ARBs are a great locker, and require minimal modification of 3rd/housing, but they're much more expensive and you don't need that much strength.

Swapping axle housings is not a tough job. If you can find a 4runner housing and a 4.10 third that's not a bad option. A better option while we're on the topic of regearing is to find a 4.30 third and housing, and a 4.30 front diff to go with it.

Spartan lockers are cheap, strong, and not nearly as scary as all the guys who have never used one will try and tell you. There's a learning curve for a couple days while you get used to it and then you're good. I'm not saying a selectable isn't better overall, but if budget is an issue, absolutely don't be scared of an autolocker. They're great bang for the buck.

Those are the things I think.

That is a good point about switching to a 4.3 front diff. I also considered this option. I wonder if 4.3's paired with a manual would create enough of a difference to allow me to comfortably run 285's. Ratio-wise, I would end up a hair lower than what I'm currently at, so it'd just be a matter of rotational weight. I'm currently on 265's with a decent amount of armor and plans for full skids and a winch. With my existing gearing, I would not run 285's. I had 33x10.5's on my first 4runner (also 3.4 4x4 manual... rolled) with no other additional weight and was not happy with it for hilly highway driving, which makes up the majority of my miles.

 

[KidVermicious]

I have 4.30/auto in my '99. 285s brought the suck. I'm not terribly happy with 265s, but it's not an unusable combo. I think 4.30/5speed would be great with the 265s, and just a little lacking with 285s. That's at 5k elevation tho, so if you're lower than that you'll be happier with less gear likely.

The other thing to consider is intended use - if you're talking highway primarily, that's great, but if you spend a fair amount of time in four low, I'd go with the highest gears you can tolerate just to avoid slipping the clutch so much.

 

[BrandonF]

I have 4.30/auto in my '99. 285s brought the suck. I'm not terribly happy with 265s, but it's not an unusable combo. I think 4.30/5speed would be great with the 265s, and just a little lacking with 285s. That's at 5k elevation tho, so if you're lower than that you'll be happier with less gear likely.

The other thing to consider is intended use - if you're talking highway primarily, that's great, but if you spend a fair amount of time in four low, I'd go with the highest gears you can tolerate just to avoid slipping the clutch so much.

I'm typically not at those kinds of elevations. The Coquihalla Highway that I drive frequently, for example, summits at 4100 ft.

4.30/5spd does sound like it'd be comfortable with 285's.

So much to consider...

 

[Snowy21]

Maybe I'm just weird but I don't think that pulling a third member is a big enough deal to justify a re-gear before you are really ready. Should take an hour or two tops to get a third out and then reinstalled. I'm a huge proponent of auto lockers but if you aren't wheeling then I don't really see the point of installing one. If you do really plan to wheel the truck hard then just tossing in an Aussie or Spartan is the way to go. 4.10 to 4.30's isn't enough to justify all the hassle tracking down junkyard diffs and installing them. Plus I don't really like the e-locker, weaker carrier and I've seen too many guys have to get out and manually lock and unlock it when the actuator isn't cooperating. ARB is the way to go for selectable

Edit: FWIW I was happy with my 285's paired with 4.10's and an auto. Not really at elevation here in the Midwest but I always got decent mileage (17-19) and even towed my 19 foot Mastercraft boat around without any issue (OD locked out)

 

[BrandonF]

Maybe I'm just weird but I don't think that pulling a third member is a big enough deal to justify a re-gear before you are really ready. Should take an hour or two tops to get a third out and then reinstalled. I'm a huge proponent of auto lockers but if you aren't wheeling then I don't really see the point of installing one. If you do really plan to wheel the truck hard then just tossing in an Aussie or Spartan is the way to go. 4.10 to 4.30's isn't enough to justify all the hassle tracking down junkyard diffs and installing them. Plus I don't really like the e-locker, weaker carrier and I've seen too many guys have to get out and manually lock and unlock it when the actuator isn't cooperating. ARB is the way to go for selectable

Edit: FWIW I was happy with my 285's paired with 4.10's and an auto. Not really at elevation here in the Midwest but I always got decent mileage (17-19) and even towed my 19 foot Mastercraft boat around without any issue (OD locked out)

Thanks for the input. I'd say my only concerns with the auto lockers are their driveability in ice and snow. Typically, I do not do much driving in those conditions. It totally depends on where my school/work schedule takes me. This past winter, I did a ton of driving on the infamous Coquihalla highway. Lots of ice, snow, fog and blizzard conditions and cruising at 45 mph or less in 4hi. I cannot even count how many accidents I saw over the winter, including many flipped cars. My concern is that an auto locker out back could make for some dangerous situations. In any conditions, I am always trying to drive as safely and smoothly as possible. However, without trying an auto locker for an extended period of time, I can't say how it'd be in winter conditions.

 

[Snowy21]

Thanks for the input. I'd say my only concerns with the auto lockers are their driveability in ice and snow. Typically, I do not do much driving in those conditions. It totally depends on where my school/work schedule takes me. This past winter, I did a ton of driving on the infamous Coquihalla highway. Lots of ice, snow, fog and blizzard conditions and cruising at 45 mph or less in 4hi. I cannot even count how many accidents I saw over the winter, including many flipped cars. My concern is that an auto locker out back could make for some dangerous situations. In any conditions, I am always trying to drive as safely and smoothly as possible. However, without trying an auto locker for an extended period of time, I can't say how it'd be in winter conditions.

I liked mine in the snow through a few Midwestern winters, some of the worst in history actually... I didn't think it was unpredictable at all. It was unnoticeable in 4wd and only noticeable in 2wd if you were driving like an asshat honestly. It actually made 2wd better for me because you could turn pulling out and not have all the power diff out on the inside tire.

I let my then girlfriend drive it through every major snowstorm to work with no issues. She had zero real knowledge of what was special about the locker if that says anything.

 

[TheeMikeB]

I agree with Snowy21, pulling the 3rd to put in a gasket is not that difficult or time consuming. As for your locker question, it really depends on how you plan to use the rig. Autolockers are the budget/quick way to do it and work well. ARB is the strongest option and it's selectable so better for a DD, but it's going to take lots of money and a professional install.

If you go that far then you might as well do gears, if you do gears... you need to do the front too. It's a can of worms you are opening and you need to be prepared to do it and do it right while you are doing it. Be prepared to spend some $$. Since you said you are planning on doing it in the future... I'd wait and save my $$ do my research and plan accordingly. It's a big expense and not something to rush into.

You can get a lube locker gasket for about $30 and a few qts of decent gear oil for another $30. A few hours in the driveway and you are good to go.
LubeLocker - Axles

 

[BrandonF]

I agree with Snowy21, pulling the 3rd to put in a gasket is not that difficult or time consuming. As for your locker question, it really depends on how you plan to use the rig. Autolockers are the budget/quick way to do it and work well. ARB is the strongest option and it's selectable so better for a DD, but it's going to take lots of money and a professional install.

If you go that far then you might as well do gears, if you do gears... you need to do the front too. It's a can of worms you are opening and you need to be prepared to do it and do it right while you are doing it. Be prepared to spend some $$. Since you said you are planning on doing it in the future... I'd wait and save my $$ do my research and plan accordingly. It's a big expense and not something to rush into.

You can get a lube locker gasket for about $30 and a few qts of decent gear oil for another $30. A few hours in the driveway and you are good to go.
LubeLocker - Axles

Yeah, I see it more as an excuse to put a locker in than anything else.

And again, since I don't see myself regearing for a while, an auto locker or easy e-locker swap is looking like a good option. Here in Canada, it'd be well over $3000 to regear and install dual arb's.

I talked to a local shop that specializes in Landcruisers today. If I bring them a 4.10 elocker 3rd, they will modify my axle housing and install the 3rd for 2-3 hours of shop time. That is looking like a very good option right now.

 

[tyr0981]

I was on the fence about a 'lunch-box locker' for several years, i've talked with at least 5 people on the website that have them installed (one in BC somewhere) and everyone that HAS ONE INSTALLED, loves them, particularly the 'ausie-locker' brand one. They said that the wheels don't start to fully lock until after ~30% throttle, under towing conditions it works even better.

Long story short, i'm installing one (in the rear only, to lessen the odds of snapping a front CV axle) when i change the dif fluid next. speaking of that, i still need to figure out my gear ratio....

as has been said, best bang for the buck, and minimal loss in "streetability" mine is a Daily Driver, so that was a big concern of mine, took along time to be convinced. best of luck sir!

:beer:

 

[Doc2012]

Throwing this out there....

You don't need a gasket on the 3rd. Use some FPIG. The paper gasket that's on the 3rd is covered in FPIG anyway.

 

[Doc2012]

But, if you're gonna regear, I would say 4.88s and an ARB.

Rather be strong, than not strong enough.

 

[AZ_Trails]

I decided that I didn't want to go with an auto-locker, and that an E-Locker retrofit was my best option. For some reason, a lot of people seem to think that 4.10 E-Locked axles in 4Runners are either non-existent or impossible to find...but I found mine in mint condition within a couple weeks of actively searching. Swapped the entire axle in a weekend, and haven't looked back since. To me, the difference between 4.30s and 4.10s wasn't worth the hassle of swapping the front diff.

I'm running 4.10s/5-Speed/265s, and have no complaints. If I ever decide I need to lock the front, I'll re-gear, put in ARBs, and run 35s. But until then, I'm a happy guy.