Rear of the t4r feels like it slides all over in snow.

[jrkiernan]

Hi All,
I have not been able to get an answer that has explained this so here we are again.
While in Tahoe I had just come from a small trail in the area and used 4wd and the rig felt normal the back would follow the front with no issues. Uphills and down on flat all of the above. The snow was light and there was some ice.
Heading back into town I was in 2wd having no issues and stopped at a light. I did not want to be the guy that slides sideways to get going as now cars were next to me. I put it in 4H and took off and immediately it felt as if the back end wanted to come around and it was at less than 5mph. This is the first time this has ever happened in this 4runner and the first time I did not feel comfortable driving it. Normally this would not bother me but it was bad no matter the speed it just wanted to come around.

I pulled into a parking lot and checked links and bolts thinking something came loose and could find nothing.
Tried 4hi and 4 lo and they felt the same. Luckily I did not need 4wd to head out and drove home in 2wd with no problems. Any thoughts?

I have a 2000 t4r with a 3" lift on 285/75/16 Goodyear Duratracks 4 bikes on a rack on the back and some tools and bags in the back. I don't think the weight or lack of was a problem.

 

[JohnMc]

Different ratios in the front and rear diff?

I (ahem, inadvertently *) drove mine for 5 months or so with a 4.10 in the front and a 4.30 in the rear. It drove totally normal, I don't use 4WD on pavement, and off road if anything it seemed to wheel slightly better (didn't push as much in tight turns in 4WD). But I noticed that I *ALWAYS* had to back up a little to get 4WD to disengage. Eventually, I jacked up one side, put it in neutral and 4WD, and rotated the tires and noticed.... a difference...




* - I was under the impression that 'all' factory e-locker 3rd gen 4Runners were 4.30, but mine was a factory 5-spd e-locker, and they used a 4.10, and I swapped a slightly noisy original diff for a nice 4.30 diff from a much more common auto trans 3rd gen.

 

[jrkiernan]

Thanks for the info.
I know I have 410's and they are open - open. It's auto with the J shift T Case. I have always had to reverse to disengage 4wd in this 2000 but in my 97 I never had to do this.
I do run stock UCA and front wheel spacers not sure if it was that the front line was not the same as the rear.
They are 1" spacers.

I do have 4.88 that I need to put in with a rear locker but I was concerned as I still have to drive it until I can swap out the gears.

 

[the_welfare_wagon]

Dumb question but did it only want to pull while under power? Meaning if you were in 4wd and let off the gas to coast does it still try to pull?


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[19963.4lsr5]

Your green 4wd light was on solid?


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[Pyral]

Are you sure your 4wd is engaging? This is exactly how driving my 4runner in the snow felt when the 4wd failed. From a stop I'd get lots of wheels spin, and going around corners with any throttle would lose the back end. This is because the vehicle is RWD normally.

Not a rare thing, the vacuum actuated system for the 4wd is a common issue. Go into a snowy parking lot and try doing donuts, if snow is getting kicked up by only the rear wheels in 4wd then you have a 4wd problem

 

[jrkiernan]

Dumb question but did it only want to pull while under power? Meaning if you were in 4wd and let off the gas to coast does it still try to pull?


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It would act like I had rear steering under power but was slightly less when not on the gas. I only made it to about 5 - 10mph and that's pushing it.

 

[jrkiernan]

Your green 4wd light was on solid?


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Yes, the light was solid. I went in and out of 4wd 3 or so times thinking I could remedy the issue??? In a parking lot.

 

[jrkiernan]

Are you sure your 4wd is engaging? This is exactly how driving my 4runner in the snow felt when the 4wd failed. From a stop I'd get lots of wheels spin, and going around corners with any throttle would lose the back end. This is because the vehicle is RWD normally.

Not a rare thing, the vacuum actuated system for the 4wd is a common issue. Go into a snowy parking lot and try doing donuts, if snow is getting kicked up by only the rear wheels in 4wd then you have a 4wd problem

Yes, the 4wd was engaged as I would only sit and spin in 2wd at the lights. I was being responsible and put it in 4wd to drive like a normal person and it would take off with no problem then the back end would want to come around.
I did more counter-steering in 4wd at less than 10 mph than in 2wd at 25.

I also checked when I was in the parking lots. Turning and front tires are engaged. Put it back in 2wd and only the back would spin.

 

[19963.4lsr5]

I’ve been in 15 degree temps with that small dry snow with about 1” on the road and I’d spin all four wheels it was that slick. It did fish tail


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[Ghostrider]

Can't remember if 2000's had newer versions of traction control or not. There were a lot of posts in early 2000's about the traction control causing a lot of drivers to wonder what was happening.

 

[jrkiernan]

Can't remember if 2000's had newer versions of traction control or not. There were a lot of posts in early 2000's about the traction control causing a lot of drivers to wonder what was happening.

I have no traction control.

 

[Pyral]

Must be the differentials then. The different ratios will generate different amounts of torque and cause tires to slip.

Even on a normal 3rd gen, starting with no momentum up an incline on a slick surface and no traction control will lead to some slipping. And if it's a hard slick surface and your running MT tires it'll be even worse.

 

[Romeo1]

If you cant determine your 4x4 function by driving feel, put it on jacks and spin it.

If there's any type of traction present, it should be super obvious.

I'm not sure how you can't tell if it's locked or not, but everyones sensory feedback is different.

 

[jrkiernan]

If you cant determine your 4x4 function by driving feel, put it on jacks and spin it.

If there's any type of traction present, it should be super obvious.

I'm not sure how you can't tell if it's locked or not, but everyones sensory feedback is different.

I have never had this issue with this rig before and I have put many 4wd miles on it. Snow mud dirt rocks sand all of the above.
Looks like I will be putting it in the air and seeing if I find anything.

 

[twitchee2]

Any chance something is broken in the front end? its could be in 4x4 but if you have a broken CV or something, the open diff would just spin no power would be applied to the front. edit: Do you have Manual hubs swapped in?

The only time(s) I've had the rear end come around on me in the snow is when I am screwing around in 2wd.

 

[jrkiernan]

Any chance something is broken in the front end? its could be in 4x4 but if you have a broken CV or something, the open diff would just spin no power would be applied to the front. edit: Do you have Manual hubs swapped in?

The only time(s) I've had the rear end come around on me in the snow is when I am screwing around in 2wd.

Nothing is broken as I have changed both front axles just before the trip.
Also I was messing with it in the parking lot. Turning left and right as well as forward and backward. Watching the wheels thinking something had come loose..

I was messing around in 2wd just before but once people were on the road I was trying to not be annoying. The rig would drive normal and not feel loose unless I wanted it to when I was in 2wd.

 

[twitchee2]

Go put it in 4x4 at home on the street/in a parking lot. Let it idle and make a sharp turn, it should stop and bind up. That would confirm 4x4 is truly working and maybe it was as simple as a particularly icy spot on the road.