Recurring Axle Seal Leak

[Track34]

Hey guys,

I'm trying to get to the bottom of a recurring axle seal leak I've been having. I've done the job 3 times now, once with aftermarket parts, once with changing to OEM seals and moving and flipping the inboard retainer and the most recent time with new OEM seals, retainers and bearings. I have also changed out and extended the diff breather to no avail.

At this point, the leak is the worst its ever been, and I'm not really sure why. Do I just start looking towards finding replacement axles, presuming that mine are bent and causing the leak?

I've done a fair amount of research on here and think I've exhausted my options beyond replacement axles or housing.

If anyone has had a similar issue or has any insight, it would be greatly appreciated!

Here is a link to a couple photos from each side. While it's obviously tough to assess just from photos, I think everything looks pretty good!

4Runner - Google Photos

 

[Huey.Raine]

If you are 100% positive you installed the seal properly without damaging it the next step would be to check the diff housing vent. If it’s clogged it will cause pressure to build, and that’s probably the biggest culprit for causing axle seal leaks on 3rd Gens.

 

[Track34]

If you are 100% positive you installed the seal properly without damaging it the next step would be to check the diff housing vent. If it’s clogged it will cause pressure to build, and that’s probably the biggest culprit for causing axle seal leaks on 3rd Gens.

I just recently replaced and extended the breather up to the filler neck

 

[fourwd1]

It's been a long time, but IIRC this was a fairly common problem on the 3rd gens. I doubt the axle is bent, I think it just has a bit of a groove worn into it.
And again, IIRC, there is some sort of aftermarket repair collar (for lack of the correct term) that can be put on to repair it.
I'm sure other will speak up.

 

[twitchee2]

typically there are 2 ways they leak. The breather gets clogged, which pushes oil out of the seal and wipes the bearing out and just continues to leak. Or the bearing goes bad and it leaks.

It appears you have fixed those root causes so I would double check the installation was done correct, I know there are some critical dimensions for the bearing/ abs ring dimensions (i dont remember what they actually are). Then make sure the bearing is still good and then look at the axle housing itself.

good luck!

 

[Brian.]

Hey guys,

I'm trying to get to the bottom of a recurring axle seal leak I've been having.

Are you Absolutely Certain that the lip of the seal is riding in the center of the mating surface? Timmy calls it the Grease Test:

Toyota Rear Axle Seal/Bearing Replacement (ABS Rearend) - YouTube


So long as nothing is being damaged during install, this is the most likely cause of the leaks IMHO.

 

[Track34]

Are you Absolutely Certain that the lip of the seal is riding in the center of the mating surface? Timmy calls it the Grease Test:

Toyota Rear Axle Seal/Bearing Replacement (ABS Rearend) - YouTube


So long as nothing is being damaged during install, this is the most likely cause of the leaks IMHO.

Check out the photos I linked on my first post. I did the same test with a sharpie (I find its cleaner and easier) and they both appear to be riding just inside of center.

 

[brillo_76]

Any possibility of a bad wheel bearing ? As if they move enough your axle seals will leak as well.

Sent from my SM-A505U using Tapatalk

 

[T4topher]

Did you replace all 4 of the ‘tone’ rings? If you re used any of them I would start with replacing those, its possibly leaking from between the axle shaft/tone ring and not between the tone ring/seal. Timmy also recommends flipping the tone ring that makes the seal.

 

[Bad Luck]

Could be leaking between retainer and axle shaft or axle seal and axle housing. I’ve had both and used gear oil rtv where the two meet during assembly

 

[D'arce]

I noticed my recently replaced axle seal started leaking again. Pulled apart and rtv'd between housing and seal. Hope that does it...

 

[Hopeless Diamond]

I noticed my recently replaced axle seal started leaking again. Pulled apart and rtv'd between housing and seal. Hope that does it...

Yeah, I also put FIPG (RTV) around the axle shaft before I pressed the inner retainer on. I used new retainers too. No problems since. The original owners had Toyota Service change that seal at least 3 times

 

[Track34]

Any possibility of a bad wheel bearing ? As if they move enough your axle seals will leak as well.

Sent from my SM-A505U using Tapatalk

With the most recent attempt I used new OEM bearings on both sides.

Did you replace all 4 of the ‘tone’ rings? If you re used any of them I would start with replacing those, its possibly leaking from between the axle shaft/tone ring and not between the tone ring/seal. Timmy also recommends flipping the tone ring that makes the seal.

I replaced the most inner tone rings where the seal sits and they were also flipped.

From the replies on here, I think I'll go with getting some FIPG underneath the tone ring where the seal sits and between the seal and housing. I will report back with the results when done!

 

[MrPiBB]

With the most recent attempt I used new OEM bearings on both sides.



I replaced the most inner tone rings where the seal sits and they were also flipped.

From the replies on here, I think I'll go with getting some FIPG underneath the tone ring where the seal sits and between the seal and housing. I will report back with the results when done!

Any update I am having a similar problem

 

[mtbtim]

Any update I am having a similar problem

Like [MENTION=319302]Bad Luck[/MENTION] mentioned there are two other possibilities. When I shot our Part 2 video, I let people know that they could reuse all 4 retainers by swapping their positions on the axle shaft. I since learned this wasn't the best advice. Even though the outside of the retainer surface can be pristine with no seal witness mark, the inside diameter of the retainer could have sustained damage upon removal. Slight grooving on the inner diameter can be present and allow a pathway of gear oil past the seal between the retainer and axle shaft. So, you really should use a new inner retainer. It's absolutely fine to reuse the outer retainers because they are just a place holder for the bearing. Some will also use some Red 1281 FIPG on the inside diameter of the retainer and on the axle shaft before pressing the inner retainer on. I think you could use grease like I show in the videos to make the pressing of the ABS tone ring and inner retainer easier. Once the retainer and ABS tone ring are in place and you've done a sharpie or grease test to confirm you have the retainer in an optimal position, I would clean up the axle shaft and inner retainer with some brake cleaner and then put a bead of the Red 1281 FIPG on the inner side of the retainer. That bead of FIPG should stop any gear oil from getting past that metal to metal connection of the retainer with the axle shaft.

The other way is oil could be getting past the seal and axle housing connection. That is another metal to metal connection. So, to remedy this, you smear some Red 1281 FIPG on the outside of the seal before driving it in place in the axle housing.

I cover these two possibilities in pinned comments (1st comment you see) in the videos below.


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[Track34]

Any update I am having a similar problem

I noticed with the most recent fix or checking of the axles, I damaged the area on the seal where the spring is held for the passenger side and therefore was not holding the spring properly. I installed a new seal on the passenger side and sealed the seals and retainers on both sides with FIPG. At this time the driver side was still slowly leaking.

I'm hoping between a new seal and sealing everything with FIPG, that all leaks will be gone. I've now put enough mileage on the truck to check it out again, but I'm away for a couple weeks. I should be able to check it out not next weekend, but the following and I'm hoping I can return with good news!

 

[Romeo1]

I know that you said you replaced and extended the breather. Did you verify that it actually flows air? Dumb thought, I know, but it can get clogged anywhere in that circuit, even inside the diff.

Absolutely verify that it actually flows end to end. Back flow it into the housing with an air nozzles to make sure.

I have encountered that twice the over the years and various pieces of equipment. The one time, a guy replaced the breather on the axle of a semi, (it was still clogged inside.) He was starting to lose his mind since everything was replaced, and it still leaked. I said, did you verify it flows? He said that’s retarded, I replaced it all.

So I got out my rubber tip their nozzle, set the air regulator down low and no flow for a few seconds then poof…….Talk about causing a lot of angst.

I would say 90% of all axle and transmission seal leaks in the universe are caused by vents.

Sounds stupid, I know. But absolutely verify that it actually flows air.

 

[Track34]

I know that you said you replaced and extended the breather. Did you verify that it actually flows air? Dumb thought, I know, but it can get clogged anywhere in that circuit, even inside the diff.

Absolutely verify that it actually flows end to end. Back flow it into the housing with an air nozzles to make sure.

I have encountered that twice the over the years and various pieces of equipment. The one time, a guy replaced the breather on the axle of a semi, (it was still clogged inside.) He was starting to lose his mind since everything was replaced, and it still leaked. I said, did you verify it flows? He said that’s retarded, I replaced it all.

So I got out my rubber tip their nozzle, set the air regulator down low and no flow for a few seconds then poof…….Talk about causing a lot of angst.

I would say 90% of all axle and transmission seal leaks in the universe are caused by vents.

Sounds stupid, I know. But absolutely verify that it actually flows air.

Thanks for the reply! I have verified that air actually flows. For a while I was actually running it without a breather, and just had it extended to a place where water couldn't get in.

So I checked it out after replacing the P Seal again. As of right now, the driver's side seems not to be leaking or at least very slowly. The passenger side is still leaking, although much slower than before. It's not terrible and not contaminating the shoes, so I'll leave it as is until the spring when I'll probably redo the whole driver's side again.

While not the result I was hoping for, it's slow enough that I can drive it for a while and not worry about running the diff low on fluid.

 

[Toy2play]

Of all the people that have used FIPG (RTV) to seal any chance of it leaking, how many are still experiencing issues? How many of you guys have flipped the retainer and have gone 10k+ miles with the flip and not experiencing a leak? I'm getting sick of this problem. Is it still best to go with updated seals and flip? I havent flipped my retainer yet, but I'm seeing some still have issues with the flip.

 

[TucsonMike]

I flipped the retainer many years ago on both axles and have around 150k using this method and no leaks. Didn't use rtv, so can't comment on that. If I had to do it again, I would still flip the retainer using Toyota seals. Good luck

MikeM