Run it til it dies or replace it?

[99Runnr]

I made a thread before about a vibration my truck experiences from ~62 mph and up to 75. Never taken it past 75, just cause I don't spin it that high and I want to be able to cruise at 65. I'm very OCD with my truck, I chose to make it my daily driver. So knowing something isn't right, bothers me and has been a focal point for awhile now.

It vibrates at ~62, I feel ZERO in the steering wheel. Minimal vibration's in the shifter handle/t-case handle. However, the cabin gets a shimmy, like I'm going over compacted gravel or similar. It increases minimally in neutral. All vibrations subside below 60 mph, in gear/neutral.

Replaced control arms, u-joints and driveshaft balancing is good, shocks new, wheels/tires new, t-case and transmission did this before replacement, alignment is good, ITRE/OTRE new, rack is tight, no leaks anywhere, no clunks/noises anywhere at any rpm or below 60. Everything that has ever been replaced on this truck was still good, like the OTRE had a boot tear but still tight. Timing belt and all components came out in perfect shape.

I can't afford to keep throwing cash at stuff that turns out to be a waste. This axle rebuild or whatever I could feasibly do next, is too much $$ and down time for a "peace of mind" replacement. I haven't been able to have anyone diagnose anything wrong. So wtf do I replace?

I have google searched multriple time's over the course of chasing this. Lots of posts seem somewhat similar, but they all turn out to be u-joint related or they are never replied to. So my question, if this has happened or similar to you, did you run it until something got worse? Should I find a low mile non-elocker rear axle and swap them straight across and save myself the rebuild fiasco?

I am NOT a halfass rebuild kinda guy. Everything I've done has been OEM/quality stuff done right. So if I go into the axle, I can see it being a $600+ bill to freshen it all up, even doing it myself. At that cost, I can buy another e-locker and say F it.

 

[GangsterOfLove]

The first thing I would do would be to take the tires off of the back and put them on the front.

See if the problem moves.

 

[99Runnr]

The first thing I would do would be to take the tires off of the back and put them on the front.

See if the problem moves.

Did that. With my last set of tires. Problem remained. Then I went to Discount and they showed me an "out of round" tire. So I bought new BFG AT's. I wanted them anyways, however, problem continues.

Done this with 2 sets of wheels and tires now. Both roadforce balanced, with the proper hub adapter. It's been thoroughly trial and error tested. I even sound deadened the entire cab recently. So now the vibration is slightly reduced but still very evident to me.

 

[GangsterOfLove]

On mine the same problem was solved when I had the u joints changed and balanced the driveshaft, but you have already done that.

Seems to me that if you don't get any shake in the steering wheel the problem has to be in the driveline or somewhere in the back. It might be useful to see if you can reproduce the vibration with the truck on a dyno or some such, or even up on jack stands if you have some way to do that safely.

 

[99Runnr]

On mine, the same sort problem was solved when I had the u joints changed and balanced the driveshaft, but you have already done that.

It might be useful to see if you can reproduce the vibration with the truck on a dyno or some such, or even up on jack stands if you have a way to do that safely.

I hear you man, I'm not trying to sound like a prick. I've just heard a lot of suggestions (valid ones, for sure) and I have gone under my truck more time's then I've cared to and poked, prodded, inspected, removed, greased, tested all this shit.

Driven to a couple places and had them drive it. Everyone says it must be a u-joint, or tires. I had the driveshaft inspected by 2 different businesses. No movement in the u-joints, no clunking, it was within spec for balancing.

I have simulated the speed at home with a friend wrenches for a living. Everything looked and sounded great, lol. It's like chasing a ghost man. Even my track bar is tight. Front and rear sway bar bushings are good and new.

 

[gamefreakgc]

Go buy a used driveshaft off another 4Runner at a junk yard and put it on. They are not hard to remove. If it's still there... well learn to live with it!

Won't cost nearly as much as the other things you've done.

 

[99Runnr]

Go buy a used driveshaft off another 4Runner at a junk yard and put it on. They are not hard to remove. If it's still there... well learn to live with it!

Won't cost nearly as much as the other things you've done.

I have pulled mine, replaced transmission/clutch since I got it. I know how to remove one, lol. Mine was tested by 2 businesses as I just mentioned. Going to a junkyard to spend $100+ for a driveshaft at this point is not gonna help. Thans for the suggestion though.

I realize it's a 16 year old truck, but it's just a mechanical issue. Old or new, you find the problem and replace it. I shouldn't have anything wrong if I put forth the initiative to fix it, this thing will be flawless to drive, I don't leave thing's sketchy when I own them.

 

[StreetCreeper]

Anyone notice that no matter the source, all 3rd gens that shimmy/shake always seem to be between 60 and 70? Never hear of a 50mph shimmy...

My shimmy was always between 60-70 as well and turned out to just be tires.

Just seems odd that if they are going to shake — its in a very specific speed window.

 

[gamefreakgc]

I have pulled mine, replaced transmission/clutch since I got it. I know how to remove one, lol. Mine was tested by 2 businesses as I just mentioned. Going to a junkyard to spend $100+ for a driveshaft at this point is not gonna help. Thans for the suggestion though.

I realize it's a 16 year old truck, but it's just a mechanical issue. Old or new, you find the problem and replace it. I shouldn't have anything wrong if I put forth the initiative to fix it, this thing will be flawless to drive, I don't leave thing's sketchy when I own them.

Not saying it's sketchy to drive, but vibrations and such will come up as the vehicle ages and accumulates miles. Every high mileage Toyota 4x4 I've owned has had some sort of vibration, squeal or shimmy/shake. I guess I've just come to expect it. You've fixed anything that could cause any sort of failure so there's nothing that will fail in a dangerous manner.

If it's not the driveline vibration then the panels will start to wiggle loose and rattle, or a brake will wear out and start squeaking, etc. I'm just not sure if it's worth trying to keep up with, if you catch my drift. If you are looking for a smooth, quiet ride then maybe a newer 4Runner with less miles would be a good fit? Just thinking out loud.

 

[99Runnr]

Not saying it's sketchy to drive, but vibrations and such will come up as the vehicle ages and accumulates miles. Every high mileage Toyota 4x4 I've owned has had some sort of vibration, squeal or shimmy/shake. I guess I've just come to expect it. You've fixed anything that could cause any sort of failure so there's nothing that will fail in a dangerous manner.

If it's not the driveline vibration then the panels will start to wiggle loose and rattle, or a brake will wear out and start squeaking, etc. I'm just not sure if it's worth trying to keep up with, if you catch my drift. If you are looking for a smooth, quiet ride then maybe a newer 4Runner with less miles would be a good fit? Just thinking out loud.

I hear you, I don't expect a Mercedes from a Toyota.

It's just severe enough (to me and a few others) that it should be fixed. Could be one of those things that is best to run until it dies or makes itself more apparent. However, I'm OCD and I like perfect functioning vehicles.

If I dig into the axle and it's not gone; I will give it a rest. Just kinda trying to gauge which route to tackle that at this point.

 

[JBurt]

My driveline seemed good. No play in the joints, however I ran it without the rear driveline and the vibration was gone. Smooth as butter. Easy enough to pull a shaft and drive it if you have 4wd.

 

[D Farms]

could be a bent axle shaft, pretty easy to check and free excluding a bit of gear oil. basically put the rear on jack stands undo the e brake cables undo the brake lines and plug them undo the 4 bolts behind each drum then pop em out. should be easy to inspect the straightenss of the axle shafts.

 

[St Runner]

I agree that to check the ujoints you should mark and pull the shaft. Control arms were my first thought. Did you replace both the upper and lower with OEM? Also pull the boot on the steering rack and check the inner tie rod for play.

 

[99Runnr]

Gonna pull the rear driveshaft. Kind of an obvious but stupidly missed method of testing.

My upper arms look brand new. Again, the inner and outer rod ends are brand new and it was just aligned AND there is zero movement or play in the wheel.

I shall spend the 10 min to pull the ds and see how it runs down the freeway. THanks for that lol.

 

[IBallEngineer]

Gonna pull the rear driveshaft. Kind of an obvious but stupidly missed method of testing.

My upper arms look brand new. Again, the inner and outer rod ends are brand new and it was just aligned AND there is zero movement or play in the wheel.

I shall spend the 10 min to pull the ds and see how it runs down the freeway. THanks for that lol.

Isolating the driveline from the engine is easy, put the vehicle in neutral, does the vibration go away? If it doesn't, you know it is behind the transmission, or at least the output shaft bearing back.

I know you said you had TWO business check the driveshaft, but that doesn't mean squat to me at this point. Just like a battery or any other part, visual inspections don't always tell the whole story, have it rebalanced or sub a known good shaft. That leaves the rear axle and rotating mass. Again, new wheels and tires don't mean a thing to me, verify verify verify. And the rear axle should be a one day job, anyone needing much longer isn't a rear axle guy or they are too busy for you.

If it makes you feel any better, I have a similar vibration on my L/C, I know it's in the adaptation of the 4L60 to the Toyota transfer case, but I got tired of taking it apart, so my tranfer case shifter rattles at around 60. I just turn up the stereo. You can solve it, I'm sure of it!

:drummer:

OH, I forgot to ask, are we dealing with a 2wd or 4wd??

 

[99Runnr]

Cmon now. It's a 4wd or I wouldn't try this hard

It persists in neutral. I had it put on the balancer to be tested at the second business. I would venture to say it's safe.

Also, I've had 2 sets of wheels and tires. Both did the same thing. I understand verifying but I'm not just eyeballing stuff here. I want it fixed not to tinker with it forever.

Your vibrations don't make me feel any better lol. I will update this once I figure it out. I will find it, just gonna piss me off a little bit first I think. What fun would it be if things were simple though right?

 

[99Runnr]

My friend works with an old Toyota tech (he is at Mercedes Benz).

He figured it out. It was out of phase. Best $20 I spent on this truck.

 

[soupkitchen]

hey man, i Went through this this past summer. I changed rear end/ third member...front axles, new tires, shocks/ springs etc....ended up being the driveshaft causing all my issues.

The vibration was at 55-60...eventually it got lower into 45 mph or so....i read forums etc and was certain it had to be the rear end.....Nope.

Driveshaft the whole time...front cv's took a dump at the same time, i dont know if the driveshaft out of whack caused this or not...could have been just a coincidence.

I'd put money on the driveshaft. I bought a brand new one for about 450.00 shipped....all new joints with it..just swapped out whole unit. Problem instantly went away. Also, my trans seemed to clink/clunk when i put it into park...was probably the u-joints causing that even though they looked good.

 

[99Runnr]

hey man, i Went through this this past summer. I changed rear end/ third member...front axles, new tires, shocks/ springs etc....ended up being the driveshaft causing all my issues.

The vibration was at 55-60...eventually it got lower into 45 mph or so....i read forums etc and was certain it had to be the rear end.....Nope.

Driveshaft the whole time...front cv's took a dump at the same time, i dont know if the driveshaft out of whack caused this or not...could have been just a coincidence.

I'd put money on the driveshaft. I bought a brand new one for about 450.00 shipped....all new joints with it..just swapped out whole unit. Problem instantly went away. Also, my trans seemed to clink/clunk when i put it into park...was probably the u-joints causing that even though they looked good.

Yeah, I mean it doesn't surprise me ultimately. As I said, pretty much EVERYTHING on the intensive list of parts I've replaced on this truck, was still plenty usable for a long time probably. The driveshaft was tested and came back fine as I mentioned.

My issue was knowing where the marks were/identifying them. I threw the trans/t-case in from a donor rig. We never had marks on it or checked for them. So it was bad from the getgo on that. My concern had always been how to fix the out of phase driveshaft if it was indeed out. Well, he found whatever I didn't understand. Drove home at 75 with one finger on the wheel.

 

[soupkitchen]

Yeah, I mean it doesn't surprise me ultimately. As I said, pretty much EVERYTHING on the intensive list of parts I've replaced on this truck, was still plenty usable for a long time probably. The driveshaft was tested and came back fine as I mentioned.

My issue was knowing where the marks were/identifying them. I threw the trans/t-case in from a donor rig. We never had marks on it or checked for them. So it was bad from the getgo on that. My concern had always been how to fix the out of phase driveshaft if it was indeed out. Well, he found whatever I didn't understand. Drove home at 75 with one finger on the wheel.

thats awesome man! I was going nutts, getting pissy all summer with that vibration on mine so I feel your pain! Glad you got it sorted.