Russell Speed Bleeder vs Earls Solo Bleed?

[fatherohenry]

I was looking for speed bleeders for my 199 TBU. Local place can get Russell 639560s for $12/pair but has this Earl's Plumbing bleeder in stock. Looks like a different design with more moving parts at twice the price. I'm leaning toward Russells as that's what I've read about here. Plan was to do the TBU tomorrow but I'd have to wait for Russells. I've already put this off way too long!

Forum search turns up nothing about Earl bleeders. Anyone have any experience with them?

 

[phattyduck]

The Russel bleeders will have the check ball and spring internal to the body - it has the same number of total parts. Either one should work just fine. Make sure you have some thread sealant on the threads so that when you are bleeding, it goes out the nipple at the top instead of around the threads.

-Charlie

 

[fatherohenry]

The Russel bleeders will have the check ball and spring internal to the body - it has the same number of total parts. Either one should work just fine. Make sure you have some thread sealant on the threads so that when you are bleeding, it goes out the nipple at the top instead of around the threads.

-Charlie

Thanks, Charlie!

The guy at the parts store suggested coating them with Loctite Blue 242 and letting them set for a few minutes before installing. He sounded legit but I figured it wouldn't hurt to mention that here, see if anyone screams BS.

Mark

 

[brillo_76]

These are the only speed bleeders I worked with. I went with these because they make then in stainless steel. As per my environment. These were my best option. Even come with tread locker on them with the check ball bleeder cover too.

Sent from my SM-J337V using Tapatalk

 

[3bears]

ive never heard of the "earls".
not good to mess with brakes on a unknown name....at least for me anway

 

[rdruss]

ive never heard of the "earls".
not good to mess with brakes on a unknown name....at least for me anway

Earls been around for a long time, I think with specialty lubrication systems for racing.

 

[NRath]

Thanks, Charlie!

The guy at the parts store suggested coating them with Loctite Blue 242 and letting them set for a few minutes before installing. He sounded legit but I figured it wouldn't hurt to mention that here, see if anyone screams BS.

Mark

Strike 1 against the parts guy.

LocTite is an anaerobic material which means that it cures in absence of air. Leaving it disassembled may allow a little evaporation (probably not noticeably in 5-10 mins), but it def won't start to firm up because it's curing.

 

[phattyduck]

ive never heard of the "earls".
not good to mess with brakes on a unknown name....at least for me anway

You haven't heard of basically the oldest automotive performance plumbing company? They were basically the company that brought AN fittings to the automotive world...

-Charlie

 

[fatherohenry]

Make sure you have some thread sealant on the threads so that when you are bleeding, it goes out the nipple at the top instead of around the threads.

-Charlie

Would lack of thread sealant cause problems bleeding? What's the best type of sealant to use. Better yet, can I use blue 242 or the yellow (petroleum) teflon tape? I jumped the gun and didn't use anything. Now I'm not able to bleed and I'm thinking that must be the problem. I had a wheel off when I remembered and didn't want to put it back on to drive to Autozone. I know I shouldn't admit that but it's the truth.

 

[jkeith.w]

Would lack of thread sealant cause problems bleeding? What's the best type of sealant to use. Better yet, can I use blue 242 or the yellow (petroleum) teflon tape? I jumped the gun and didn't use anything. Now I'm not able to bleed and I'm thinking that must be the problem. I had a wheel off when I remembered and didn't want to put it back on to drive to Autozone. I know I shouldn't admit that but it's the truth.

bleed screws/nipples seal against the tapered bottom of the bore (the cone-shaped area) - not the threads.

 

[fatherohenry]

bleed screws/nipples seal against the tapered bottom of the bore (the cone-shaped area) - not the threads.

I understand that. I'm wondering if the sealant is needed when bleeding to maintain an airtight seal on the threads after loosening the valve. Just trying to figure out why it's not bleeding.

 

[jkeith.w]

I understand that. I'm wondering if the sealant is needed when bleeding to maintain an airtight seal on the threads after loosening the valve. Just trying to figure out why it's not bleeding.

shouldn't have anything to do the issue you're having - perhaps the valve isn't loosened enough? (I've never used speed bleeders, personally)

or do you have the ball & spring type? sounds like the ball is stuck?

 

[fatherohenry]

...perhaps the valve isn't loosened enough?

I loosened it up a fair amount and it wasn't leaking but I did get some fluid out after that.

I (slowly) went through 32oz of brake fluid between all four corners, thought I was good to go. Pedal felt almost too firm but I figured between new brakes and steel lines there had to be a difference. As soon as I fired it up and stepped on the brake to put 'er in gear the pedal sank right to the floor.

Guess I missed something. RR, LR, RF, LF. Nothing was leaking after that. I'd tried bleeding with the key on but it didn't make a difference and as I understand it, my '96 shouldn't require that. Times like this I really hate learning new things! Time to read another few dozen posts about bleeding.

 

[Skulking]

I loosened it up a fair amount and it wasn't leaking but I did get some fluid out after that.

I (slowly) went through 32oz of brake fluid between all four corners, thought I was good to go. Pedal felt almost too firm but I figured between new brakes and steel lines there had to be a difference. As soon as I fired it up and stepped on the brake to put 'er in gear the pedal sank right to the floor.

Guess I missed something. RR, LR, RF, LF. Nothing was leaking after that. I'd tried bleeding with the key on but it didn't make a difference and as I understand it, my '96 shouldn't require that. Times like this I really hate learning new things! Time to read another few dozen posts about bleeding.

When you say it isn't bleeding, do you mean you aren't getting fluid out, or your still have air in your brake lines even though you are getting fluid out? Can you walk us through your bleeding procedure?

 

[fatherohenry]

When you say it isn't bleeding, do you mean you aren't getting fluid out, or your still have air in your brake lines even though you are getting fluid out? Can you walk us through your bleeding procedure?

At first I was not getting fluid out.

• After replacing the calipers, rotors, pads and lines between the hard lines I topped off the MC.
• I replaced the RR bleed valve with Earl's Solo Bleed.
• I loosened it maybe 1/2 turn, attached a hose and pumped the brakes a little more than 1/2 way about 30 times. Nothing was coming out.
• I loosened it a couple more turns and it started coming out, very slowly. After another 30+ pumps I had maybe 8oz of some filthy looking fluid, but the drops coming from the hose had become clear:

I repeated the process on the remaining wheels - LR, RF, LF. I'd tighten the valve, pull off the hose and move on to the next wheel.

The pedal felt quite firm. These were slow, deliberate pumps holding for a couple seconds a little over halfway down. After releasing the pedal I'd wait a second for it to fully return before the next pump.

After putting the front tires back on and double checking all my connections it seemed time for a test. I put my foot on the brake, started the engine, and the pedal sank to the floor. I pumped it a few times to see if that would help but it did not. After stopping the engine I could pump a couple times and return to the firm feeling it had while I was trying to bleed.

I hope that helps shine some light on what I've done wrong. I added some photos in case there's something obvious I'm missing.

 

[fatherohenry]

It was also my understanding that with those valves there is no need to keep the hose submerged since no air should be allowed back in due to the spring action. Obviously with the hose dangling like that in the bottle I could not see any bubbles in the line but it was coming out so slowly I’m certain the line was never full to begin with. I could get to the front left before the trickle stopped but that’s all it was - a trickle. Maybe I need to replace the original valves and see if I can hire someone from the Home Depot parking lot to pump the brakes for me.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
1996 4Runner SR5 | Auto | Unlifted | 248K miles

 

[HiluxSurf SSR-G]

when you pumped the brake pedal & bled the brakes, was the engine running? you are supposed to keep the engine running when pumping the brake pedal.

 

[fatherohenry]

when you pumped the brake pedal & bled the brakes, was the engine running? you are supposed to keep the engine running when pumping the brake pedal.

I tried with the key on when I was getting zero fluid but that didn't help. I heard from my Master Toyota Instructor (yes, Tim) that only '01-'02 need the key on to power the booster. Mine's a '96. I'm happy to try it though. Anything to get me out of the driveway!

 

[fatherohenry]

So I went back and re-read a bunch of posts, hiked up my skirt, put it in gear and drove around the block. Turns out it wasn’t actually hitting the floor, but it felt like it. Very long pedal travel and there’s never any bite. Pumping the brakes helped stiffen up the pedal but that quickly disappeared. No way I could stop if a kid ran into the street. I never let the MC get much below the min mark. I believe rears were adjusted properly. I use the e-brake daily. Hope I’m not going to regret the TBU but based on what I’ve read it seems I just haven’t learned anything at all about proper bleeding. Yet. Tomorrow’s another day.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
1996 4Runner SR5 | Auto | Unlifted | 248K miles

 

[HiluxSurf SSR-G]

you need to have the engine running while bleeding because the vacuum will run out and then the brake booster will not work making the pumping of the brake pedal harder and so you will not be able to pump properly. vacuum comes from the engine.