Steering wheel vibration question

[IK13]

Sorry to post another thread, but the sticky one seems to be long dead.

I got a 2005 V6 4wd Sport Edition Certified used vehicle last week.

Needless to say I didn't notice the wheel vibration during the 10 minutes test drive.

The truck has brand new set of the infamous Dunflops and after reading here I'm willing to bet that they are (at least a big part of) the problem. Dealer already balanced them once, but I don't see any improvement.

Now, there's the thing that bothers me - it has this vibration, staring around 60-65mph, but it doesn't do it always. I took the truck on a 800 miles trip last weekend - all highway roads in good condition. On some stretches of the road my hands literally got tired holding the steering wheel with all the shaking, yet on others it'll go miles at similar speeds without being noticeable.
It almost feels like the surface of the road sort of triggers it (weird)...and I'd think that if there's a tire balancing issue - it would show up on any road and always.
And of course it's OK on the the freeway in 15 mile radius of the dealer :awais: So my theory is that certain "patterns" on the road bring up more "resonance" with lets say problematic tires.

Am I right? What am I missing?

 

[NCSCOTT]

Ik13

I took my 08 SE 4x4 V-6 in today for the second time for the exact same problem you are describing.

I first took it in at 600 miles for this problem and they changed out 2 of the Dunlops and road force balanced them all under warranty. I currently have 2 tires made in Japan and 2 made in the USA. The vibration did not go away.

I gave it a little time. I rotated the tires at 5k, rears straight forward and the fronts to the opposite rear. USA tires to the back, Japan tires to the front. It was still there. I played with the tire pressures, bumped it to 38 PSI all the way around, no help. Dropped it to 35 PSI, no help. Left it at 35 PSI (hoping for a slight mileage improvement).

I have been dragging my feet on getting it back to the dealership. I took it in with 7229 miles today since new in mid Jan.

I have an 04 SR5 V-6 2x4 86k miles and have never had this problem. My current tires on it have 54k miles on them and have never been rebalanced since they were put on. Granted it is 2wd vs. 4wd.

I will post back with what they tell me today. I hope they just put a new set of Michelins on it and call it good.

I completely agree with you on the Resonance/Harmonic thing. Mine seems to act in the same manner.

 

[IK13]

I'm sorry you have this problem too (though the fact that someone else has it at least tells me that I'm not losing my mind).
Please keep me posted.

I spoke to the dealer today and was told by the service manager that if there's a balancing problem it would show up on any road.
His advice was to keep driving the vehicle and to take notice where and when the vibration occurs (the darn thing simply doesn't happen on the freeway near this dealer so I can't blame him!). Then go back and let'em know. Sounds reasonable, except for the fact that every visit to this dealer makes me miss work..something I can't afford very often...

So I located a tire shop which has the GSP97000 (my dealer supposedly has one too) machine and the Haweka adapter and Thursday will leave the car there to see what they can do about it. Will report after that.

 

[NCSCOTT]

I picked it up last night and went for a ride with the Service tech. He basicly confirmed that the Dunlops are a POS tire without coming right out and saying so. He also said it was a Harmonic/Resonance issue common to the Dunlops.

He Roadforce balanced them again, He stated he got the tires to balance to the following pounds of lateral movement (PLM), 7 & 9 on the fronts and 11 & 12 on the rears. He said 14 was the average for the dunlops and I believe 21 or above was considered excessive.

Please forgive me if I am not correct but I believe the term was "Pounds of lateral movement"

He also said it was not uncommon to get numbers down to 3-4 PLM with the Michelin Cross Terrains,one of the other less common tires from the factory. He has also seen cars with Michelins or other high quality tires balance to 1-2 PLM.

It all boils down to the fact that the AT20s are a POS tire. I might run these for 30k and dump them. The Dunflops on my 04 were wornout at 32K.

If you have not looked at this before check out these survey results on Tirerack.com for Highway All-season tires 265/65/17s.

The Dunlop AT20s are second from the Bottom out of 65 different tires The Michelin Cross Terrains are 7th out of 65.

It is just sad Toyota continues to put a 3rd rate tire on a 1st rate SUV.

http://www.tirerack.com/tires/surve...Z&speed_rating=W&speed_rating=Y&speed_rating=(Y)

 

[IK13]

So is your vibration problem cured now?

I know the DunFlops are POS. I have a Toyota certified vehicle and I bought the total care warranty too, but I'm reasonably sure they won't agree to replace these (I'll pay the difference) with Michelin's, unless I somehow prove to them that my tires are not acceptable safety wise or not within some specification (the pond figures from the roadforce balancing might help here) or something.

On the other hand - I might just bolt out and get me tires anyway - it would take a lot of the joy riding the truck if I'm to curse the tires anytime I get in the car and just wait for them to wear...

 

[NCSCOTT]

I would not say cured. I would say if you rated it 1 to 10, 10 the worst, it was a 4 before the rebalance now it is a 1 or 2. I am sure it will return again.

 

[IK13]

So my local (somewhat trusted) tire shop did a road force balance on brand new DunFlops and what do you know- the dealer hadn't balanced jack sh!t. There are the numbers I was given:
Position - Force Variation
LR - 19lbs
LF - 35lbs
RR - 15lbs
RL - 30lbs

All the numbers are quite ugly, but the 30lbs and 35lbs are plain unacceptable.

Now the car drives better, the shaking is greatly reduced, but not all gone.

I wrote a letter to the service department at my local dealer and I'm yet to hear anything from them. I bet they'll simply ignore it.

Does anybody know if I have the right, based on the fact that I bought a Certified Used Vehicle (plus the extra care warranty) to demand the two tires with excessive road force variation to be replaced free of charge?

Or on the grounds of safety?

 

[nc211]

I would not say cured. I would say if you rated it 1 to 10, 10 the worst, it was a 4 before the rebalance now it is a 1 or 2. I am sure it will return again.

Scott, you're talking Fred Anderson, right? Not Marc Jackass Jacobson?

I've found an awesome little shop that always seems to balance and align my cars PERFECTLY the first time. It's Chapel Hill Tire, in Chapel Hill by University Mall. They have the hunter system, and man I kid you not, they NAIL alignments and balancings to perfection, every time! And, they seem to hold for a long time. My old LS400 use to be a MoFo to align and balance correctly, as it was super sensitive anyway, so any misbalanced or misalignments would show right away. Those guys could align that car to a straight arrow, and balance the wheels so good that I could drive around with a plastic cup full of water, and it wouldn't even wave. The 4runner is much the same now too "after having them correct MJ's horrible job". The wife's Mazda 3, with it's 17 inch low profile tires.....is glass smooth. I can take my hands off the wheel at any speed and both cars will simply track straight down the road, no matter what angle of the pavement "well you know what I mean".

So if you have problems with alignments and balancings, I'd have no problems recommending them. It's well worth the hassle of coming to Chapel Hill. Just hit 40, exit at 54, go about 5 miles to 15-501 and turn right. Go 3 stop lights and turn left. They're in the back corner of the mall.

My boss takes is 02' MB 300 there now too, and swears by them as well. My secretary takes her 07 Solera and 98 Sienna there too, and again swears by them as well.

972-5723
201 S. Estes Drive
Chapel Hill, NC

 

[NCSCOTT]

Yes, Fred Anderson. They are pretty good there. I fell they make an honest effort.