To switch or not to switch...

"...I bet that correcting that situation is why you are no longer experiencing the christmas light dash symptoms. It was probably a small enough voltage trigger that caused the lights to come on and not be significant enough to actually damage your ECU..."

I don't know what I actually corrected, but you may be right about 'the minimal voltage triggering' w/o damage, and something getting changed while fooling around inside the dash!

"...In my situation, I've had a constant 2 amp draw on my accy battery..."

WOW! A 2A draw is HUGE! But the bigger it is, the easier it ...'should be'... to isolate! I assume you've already begun partitioning the accessories for process of elimination purposes; both stock and aftermarket? Any progress in doing that?
 
Bobby, My alternator won't keep my 27 group dual purpose battery fully charged either- especially when I run my ARB fridge 24/7. Even after a long trip it won't be 100%. I never have a problem starting the truck, just bothers me that it can't top off the battery fully. I know it's not designed to do this so no surprise really.
I picked up a small battery maintainer with a harness/plug that stays attached to the battery. I just plug it up about once per month and it brings the battery up to 100% overnight. Kind of a pain but it works...

BTW- Constant draw shouldn't be an issue for those deep cycles if they are maintained. I regularly discharge my trolling motor battery on my boat (same deep cycle 27 group) to below 50% and it has been going strong for 6 years now. I have an onboard charger that keeps it healthy between weekly fishing trips.

Just my experiences!

Yeah, that was my problem. I had no idea the constant draw was happening for over 2 years. I just assumed both batteries had been charging since I had no starting issues. And of course, why would I? The constant draw was on the aux battery. There finally came a time where I let the kids sit in the truck for over 2 hours watching a movie and even had to "restart" the truck to the accy position. The "restart" is in quotes because on the LE, the truck shuts off thinking you left the key in the accy position (push button start). So you just have to push the button again so that its in the accy position again. Needless to say, I killed the starting battery and low and behold, the aux battery didn't have enough voltage to start the truck. That's when I started to do some research because I was pretty :smashputer: when my dual battery set up didn't work when I needed it to.

I don't know what I actually corrected, but you may be right about 'the minimal voltage triggering' w/o damage, and something getting changed while fooling around inside the dash!



WOW! A 2A draw is HUGE! But the bigger it is, the easier it ...'should be'... to isolate! I assume you've already begun partitioning the accessories for process of elimination purposes; both stock and aftermarket? Any progress in doing that?

Yeah, I wired the accy lead to constant so that I could turn any accy on while the key was out. I had no idea it would energize the relays (two of them) all the time. What's interesting is I've had the Painless fuse box installed since almost new and I had the dual battery set up installed just before a week long snowboarding trip. I just happened to have that particular fuse box wired into my starting battery. I came back after letting it sit at the airport and I had a dead battery. Of course, I switched to the aux battery and she fired right up. Never crossed my mind that this was because the fuse box was hot all the time until a couple years later.
 
"...Never crossed my mind that this was because the fuse box was hot all the time until a couple years later."

So as she stands now... Do you know if the constant current draw is 'internally inherent' of that particular battery (shorting between the cell's partitioning), or is it external 'as in' ...something is constantly on... "Just curious".
 
So as she stands now... Do you know if the constant current draw is 'internally inherent' of that particular battery (shorting between the cell's partitioning), or is it external 'as in' ...something is constantly on... "Just curious".

The Painless Wiring fuse box was the culprit. I'm sure I killed the battery because of the long term draw and lack of properly charging. All batteries, regardless of internal makeup, need to be properly maintained. I'm a bit of a battery nerd because of my other hobby (RC cars). So I'm familiar with most of the types and styles of batteries. It doesn't matter if you're using a li-po, li-ion, nicad, nimh, cr123s, wet, gel, or dry cells, etc. They all need proper maintenance.
 
"...I'm a bit of a battery nerd because of my other hobby (RC cars). So I'm familiar with most of the types and styles of batteries. It doesn't matter if you're using a li-po, li-ion, nicad, nimh, cr123s, wet, gel, or dry cells, etc. They all need proper maintenance."


WOW! You are one of those 'Science professors'! I was getting involved with those RC cars when I was a kid; of course that was a long time ago... like in the 60's. And RC didn't stand for 'Radio Control'... it stood for 'Remote Control' cuz it had a cord! I think they were made by Aurora or Mattel. I spent a lot of time with those cars! yeah, I get it! Rgds
 
wow after reading these posts i think i might just pay to have my lights installed professionally. Not any good with electrical and don't want to start pulling my new truck apart to attempt this only to find i messed something up
 
wow after reading these posts i think i might just pay to have my lights installed professionally. Not any good with electrical and don't want to start pulling my new truck apart to attempt this only to find i messed something up

Starting to think about this option as well. Even after reading all of the posts slowly and multiple times it still sounds Greek to me. I wired up 4 KC Hilites to my 3rd gen no problem but this sounds like a different animal.

I have an OPT 7 bar and AOB switch ready to install but I'm a little terrified now to do the wiring.
 
I wired up 4 KC Hilites to my 3rd gen no problem but this sounds like a different animal.

Hi pbcolt,

If you installed a KC kit on your 3rd gen 4Runner, you won't encounter anything different with the 5th gen. The battery works the same way, the wiring is (for the most part) the very same.

I have an OPT 7 bar and AOB switch ready to install but I'm a little terrified now to do the wiring.

Well... don't be! The reason that I started this thread wasn't to discourage folks from rolling up their sleeves and getting in there, but to advise them to check that the wiring diagram is accurate and coincides with the switch that you're installing. When I installed my AOB dash switch it didn't come with any paperwork, so I got my AOB switch's wiring diagram off of the internet and being in a rush, I failed to double/triple check the data sheet and so, caused trouble.

This won't happen to you because you're going to double/triple check your wiring diagram... BEFORE you tie it in Right? lol! And don't forget that you don't have to wire in the switch's 'Etched backlight'; which glows when the parking/headlights are on. You can just wire up the 'ON/OFF' switch portion which is a little simpler and less intrusive to the vehicle's electrical system!

...My opinion... I say go for it! The worst that can happen is you run into a blind spot at which time you chime in here and one of us will bring you back to safety! :surfer: ...problem solved!

rigtec, cheers
 
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I apologize up front because I didn't read every post in this thread, but if I understand this correctly, the issue is tying in the backlight of the switch to the dimmer circuit, is that correct?

I don't know how bright those switches are, but if they aren't that bright, I'd just tie them into the parking light circuit! Use either my thread or Antman's thread on the foglight rewire mod for the green wire (IIRC, that's the color) as the trigger for the switch. This will turn the backlight on whenever the parking lights are turned on, they just won't be dimmable with the rest of the dash.

Just throwin' out another option!
 
I apologize up front because I didn't read every post in this thread, but if I understand this correctly, the issue is tying in the backlight of the switch to the dimmer circuit, is that correct?

Hi fh,

You need to be accurate regarding ALL wiring tie-ins. But yes, there is an inherent risk of attempting to ground the 'Illumination circuit' to the 'DIMMER DIAL' circuit and accidentally hitting it with a 12v HOT (POS) line and taking out the main body ECU Multiplex Net. But this job is no more dangerous than doing any other auto electrical task.

The risk is heightened only because the MB ECU manages a host of other ecu's in the cabin e.g., power windows, power door-locks, Instrument cluster, security system, courtesy lighting, heated seats.... etc! I actually purchased a new MB ECU when my instrument cluster lit up like a Chinese new year celebration, and stayed that way for about six months!

I never did get to install it because it snowed so much here in NJ last yr... and you have to basically be on your knees on the outside of the vehicle to access it e.g., remove driver-side fusebox, disconnect sub-harness 1-8, unhinge main body ecu compu module from Aux junction...etc! But before all the snow melted, the problem just... disappeared (poof!); just as mysteriously as it began and that was nine months ago! So I still have the module on a shelf, I think it was like $600 bucks.

I don't know how bright those switches are, but if they aren't that bright, I'd just tie them into the parking light circuit! Use either my thread or Antman's thread on the foglight rewire mod for the green wire (IIRC, that's the color) as the trigger for the switch. This will turn the backlight on whenever the parking lights are turned on, they just won't be dimmable with the rest of the dash. Just throwin' out another option!

There's a bunch of ways to connect the illum circuit. I 'Piggy-backed' mine onto the RSCA button right next to the 'Blank-off' where I installed the AOB switch... but that circuit doesn't dim with the others because it gets it's ground from a straight ground junction connected to the body, and not the dimmer dial! Once again, there's no reason for members here to be timid about wiring their Factory (Style) Foglight Switch- Fits Knock-out (courtesy of Mr [MENTION=81322]barryhiram[/MENTION] )! Just check your schematic before you start splicing, and check your wiring before you power-up! That's it! Rgds

rig
 
There's a bunch of ways to connect the illum circuit. I 'Piggy-backed' mine onto the RSCA button right next to the 'Blank-off' where I installed the AOB switch... but that circuit doesn't dim with the others because it gets it's ground from a straight ground junction connected to the body, and not the dimmer dial!

rig

You might want to confirm that yours don't dim. I wired mine up the RSCA as you suggested and I just checked and they do dim.
 
You might want to confirm that yours don't dim. I wired mine up the RSCA as you suggested and I just checked and they do dim.

Yes but where did you tap your ground from? I used the 'Gray wire' on the RSCA illumination circuit as a GND; which doesn't dim. I could have chosen to use a different ground source e.g., Heated seat on indicator, temp control, instrument cluster... and dimmed it that way.

Just for clarification: The dimmer dial controls the ground-side; not the power source. And some illumination circuit accessories do not utilize this feature!

cheers
 
Yes but where did you tap your ground from? I used the 'Gray wire' on the RSCA illumination circuit as a GND; which doesn't dim. I could have chosen to use a different ground source e.g., Heated seat on indicator, temp control, instrument cluster... and dimmed it that way.

Just for clarification: The dimmer dial controls the ground-side; not the power source. And some illumination circuit accessories do not utilize this feature!

cheers

I tapped both wires going to the RSCA switch. You can see the red connectors in the middle of the pic.

I also just went out and checked again. My RSCA switch dims as well. (maybe I got the SR5 Pro model :confused:

153246d1428829810-stereo-prep-stereo69.jpg
 
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I tapped both wires going to the RSCA switch. You can see the red connectors in the middle of the pic.

I also just went out and checked again. My RSCA switch dims as well. (maybe I got the SR5 Pro model :confused:

"Not you that's confused... it's me!" You are absolutely correct about the RSCA GND being on the dimmer dial! I just remembered that I moved the AOB switch's RSCA illumination circuit GND, over to a body/chassis (junction) GND; where all of my other accessories are grounded! So my apologies for the mix-up on my end, you're are 100% correct! Thanks for the heads up!

Best to you!
 
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To whom this may concern...

Regarding the dashboard Illumination circuit: Your RSCA, Party-mode, Windshield wiper/mirror heater, Hazards, Temperature control and 120V Power inverter switches... these DO connect to the Dimmer dial (Rheostat) on the GND-side; the GREEN HOT (POS) DOES NOT!. The Gray wire behind those switches is the NEG (GND) wire which can be used to connect your illuminated switches (AOB, slee off-road, OTRATTW... etc) to the dimmer circuit.

But please be advised: This circuit is for Pilot duty ONLY i.e., no triggers, no accessory loads or any other high amperage drawing utilities! If more than 'Fractional' amperage is consumed here, you may cause damage to the Main body ECU COMPU or Rheostat 'BEFORE' you even blow the fuse! ...Okay so be careful.

Best to you!
 
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Can a light bar/AOB switch be added WITHOUT splicing into factory wiring? If I decide to sell the vehicle in the future I'd like to be able to remove the light bar/switch and not affect anything factory.
 
Can a light bar/AOB switch be added WITHOUT splicing into factory wiring? If I decide to sell the vehicle in the future I'd like to be able to remove the light bar/switch and not affect anything factory.
If you are okay with the switch light being always on or off you wouldn't need to splice into anything

Sent from my HTC6525LVW using Tapatalk
 
Be especially careful with the OTRATTW switches, they all look the same on the back but the wiring diagram is different. I used an old radio shack 12v power source to figure out my switches before installing.
 
Many thanks for this thread. I am finally getting ready to put 4 AOB switches in my 2015 SR5 dash. I had a few more newbie questions

Given the comment 'DO NOT' allow the 12V (HOT) to go ANYWHERE NEAR the "Dimmer dial" ', how should I run the green 12V wire when I put a switch in the blank next to the dimmer dial ? Or may be I am misunderstanding the problem.

I was thinking of moving the AC inverter switch next to the Dimmer switch. So I could put all the three new light switches next to the wiper heater switch. Will that cause any issues with the dimmer circuit etc.?

Also, I have noticed in some installations folks use light switches with 5 wires where there are two separate ground wires - one for the lower LED and one for upper. I am curious why AOB's switches don't need that. Thanks
 
That really blows Greg :bolt:(sorry, couldn’t resist buddy). Unfortunate it was a costly repair, but glad you were able to get the problem resolved. Glad you shared your experience so others could be aware of the potential issues caused by back feeding an ECU, most wouldn’t so kudos to you. Modern vehicle are very sophisticated and complicated, containing multiple computers, modules, Multiplex / Can-Bus wiring, one misstep can prove costly.

I too have received several PM’s asking about illumination interfaces, in my case (2012 SR5) green wire is positive (+) when parking lights/headlights are turned on, gray wire is illumination ground (-). Gray wire controls light dimming function. These wires can be found at any switch that illuminates when you turn on your lights, again in my case, there was an unused harness (with white plug) behind dash panel that I tapped into. Always test wires with a multimeter before interfaced to insure they a correct as different year Runner’s or different trim levels may differ in color.

Both Slee and AOB switches are low amperage switches (3 amp max), meaning you must install a relay to control whatever component you want to turn on/off. Switch is basically a trigger, load is handled through relay (generally rated around 30/40 amps). Illumination portion of switch are LED, which means they only draw milliamps when energized, so they will not overrate the factory system. Keep in mind if you’re adding lots of switches and additional dash lighting, measure draw prior to installation as you may need to add a relay, factory wire is trigger, relay handles load.

To those of you who have limited 12 volt experience might I offer a few suggestions? Have a plan on what you want to add to your vehicle especially when it comes to wiring, fewer connections are better’er. Review all wiring diagrams and/or schematics, if you don’t understand or are confused on what needs to be done, stop, seek help or pay to have it done. Plan how you will run your wires, if routing through the firewall, try to use factory grommets whenever possible, once wire(s) pass through grommet seal with silicone. Don’t push grommet to the side then run wire between edge of grommet and metal firewall, causing wire insulation to rub on metal edge cutting insulation causing a short circuit. If none are available, drill a hole in firewall and add a grommet, rubber or plastic are acceptable. All external wire connections should be waterproof! When installing ground wires, ensure metal to metal contact, remove any paint that may between connector and metal surface, use a nut and bolt whenever possible, then coat with a sealant like undercoating. Most electrical issues are caused by loose or corroded connections. Encase all wires in wire loom to protect them from possible chaffing or cutting on sharp metal edges. Route all wires away from moving components or heat sources. Fuse all power wires to prevent an electrical fire! When cutting wires to length, cut longer then you need, I like to use the analogy “measure twice, cut once”, better too long then too short.

Verify switch wires and factory wires are correct before interfacing. When making wire connections, I prefer to use solder and heat shrink or high quality electrical tape (3M Super 88), butt connectors can also be used, but require cutting of factory wires. T-Tap’s are the worst type of connection, yes they are quick and easy to use, but they cut the wire when crimping and over time will cause intermittent connection issues. Route wires to connection point, make connection, protect connections, and then test for correct operation. Once verified, protect harness with wire loom, nothing worse than opening up a dash only to find wires running everywhere “wire spaghetti”. If done correctly, the only failure should be because the item you added failed, not you’re wiring. Reassemble and enjoy years of operation.

Here are schematics for both switches...................
Slee
View attachment 150413
AOB
View attachment 150412

Which switch do you prefer AOB or Slee ?
 

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