Toyota reliability?? > or < Honda??

[Toffees]

The Honda is a trucklet in my view. It's the crossover of midsize trucks. And it's not a very good truck. For starters it has a doughnut spare - so you can't really be serious about going either offroad or towing or hauling. If you get a flat you have to first unload everything from the bed just to get the spare. And then you can't haul anything or tow anything once the spare is put on. So you're basically limited to short distance use for anything "truck" related.

The second issue is that it's a transaxle front wheel drive front end. So you can't do anything with it other than keep stock suspension and tire size. No gears are available. No lockers. You can't really lift it either. So you can't do much toward offroad use.

And the third issue is that it's not a very good unibody either. It weights MORE than a Tacoma. So all the compromises of unibody don't offer any of the benefits of weight savings.

It's a car with a bed. And for some people that's all they need. But it's not a serious attempt at a truck for the things that most truck users either want or need. It's kinda like calling a Honda Cub a motorcoss bike. It's a fine commuter bike. And yeah, you could probably make your way around a course - but it's not really the same thing.

I actually think the Ridgeline is a great truck, very specialized (i.e., limited) and intended for a certain type of user. It's a midsize truck in the Honda mold--swiss army knife--it does a little of everything well but nothing excellently. It drives smoothly (i.e., feels like an SUV), has lots of function (the trunk is fabulous, if you've never used such, and the folding rear seat is a great touch), and the AWD is all most users ever need. It won't tow heavy stuff, but it will take your furniture across town or carry your two jet skis to the lake, and it will take your camper to the woods 2 or 3 times a year.

Honda knows exactly what they're targeting with the Ridgeline, and although I really dislike the new design (and was partial to the first gen), it's really a super-SUV, built for people who want SUV comfort but a little bit of truck utility.

Who knows if it will sell--trucks are getting bigger at such a rate it makes you wonder if the American male penis is shrinking--most buyer seem to want something else, but if they can tap into the mid-size, "I live in the city/suburbs" market it will sell, because it does very well everything that almost all drivers need to do almost all of the time.

 

[p nut]

...Honda knows exactly what they're targeting with the Ridgeline, and although I really dislike the new design (and was partial to the first gen),....

I liked the 1st Gen looks as well. If they could combine the front end of the 1st Gen with the bed of the 2nd Gen, it'd look so much better.

 

[Jetboy]

I actually think the Ridgeline is a great truck, very specialized (i.e., limited) and intended for a certain type of user. It's a midsize truck in the Honda mold--swiss army knife--it does a little of everything well but nothing excellently. It drives smoothly (i.e., feels like an SUV), has lots of function (the trunk is fabulous, if you've never used such, and the folding rear seat is a great touch), and the AWD is all most users ever need. It won't tow heavy stuff, but it will take your furniture across town or carry your two jet skis to the lake, and it will take your camper to the woods 2 or 3 times a year.

Honda knows exactly what they're targeting with the Ridgeline, and although I really dislike the new design (and was partial to the first gen), it's really a super-SUV, built for people who want SUV comfort but a little bit of truck utility.

Who knows if it will sell--trucks are getting bigger at such a rate it makes you wonder if the American male penis is shrinking--most buyer seem to want something else, but if they can tap into the mid-size, "I live in the city/suburbs" market it will sell, because it does very well everything that almost all drivers need to do almost all of the time.

I know if it will sell. The answer is no. It won't. There are basically two categories of truck buyers. The first are the people who need a truck to do truck things - towing and hauling. The second are the category of people who want a truck for the image that they do truck things. The ridgeline does neither. It doesn't do truck things so it doesn't have the image of doing truck things. There are a few faithful Honda buyers who want a truck from Honda - but those are few and far between. Honda doesn't make a base model to compete where it would excel - deliver drivers, and it doesn't get good enough mileage to seriously compete with the diesel options from Dodge or GM.

2017 will presumably be it's best selling full model year and sales were about 34,000. That's bad. Significantly worse than the first generation. And even 2017 saw declining month by month sales through the end of the year. December 2017 sold 2854, Dec 2016 sold 4085. Basically, the 50,000 or so sliver of the market who want one bought it already. I'd bet 2018 won't break 20k. 2019 sales will be more like 10-15k. And by about 2022 it'll be discontinued.

It was a swing and a miss. Honda builds great stuff. I have owned many of their cars. I'd buy an accord over a camry without second thought. But the ridgeline is a product very few people want.

 

[p nut]

I know if it will sell. The answer is no. It won't. There are basically two categories of truck buyers. The first are the people who need a truck to do truck things - towing and hauling. The second are the category of people who want a truck for the image that they do truck things. The ridgeline does neither. It doesn't do truck things so it doesn't have the image of doing truck things. There are a few faithful Honda buyers who want a truck from Honda - but those are few and far between. Honda doesn't make a base model to compete where it would excel - deliver drivers, and it doesn't get good enough mileage to seriously compete with the diesel options from Dodge or GM.

2017 will presumably be it's best selling full model year and sales were about 34,000. That's bad. Significantly worse than the first generation. And even 2017 saw declining month by month sales through the end of the year. December 2017 sold 2854, Dec 2016 sold 4085. Basically, the 50,000 or so sliver of the market who want one bought it already. I'd bet 2018 won't break 20k. 2019 sales will be more like 10-15k. And by about 2022 it'll be discontinued.

It was a swing and a miss. Honda builds great stuff. I have owned many of their cars. I'd buy an accord over a camry without second thought. But the ridgeline is a product very few people want.

Tacoma's definitely lead the mid-size market and really no chance for others to catch up. I mean, 198k sales compared to 74k and 34k for Nissan and Honda? Paltry.

But still, 34k is a lot of units. Over 11% market share. That's not that bad. Honda knew it couldn't go right up against the Tacoma. So it's hitting buyers that want a truck, but don't want to DRIVE a truck. It's obviously hitting accord drum with some buyers. Maybe that's all they expected and they're exactly where they want to be. I remember when CUV's came out with unibody frames and more road-friendly features, people boo'ed. Then Nissan went IRS and unibody. Ford. And others followed. I'm not saying that's what their goal is here. But they're presenting an idea, far removed from traditional thinking. If it catches on, then great. They'll sell cars. If not, they'll still sell a ton of cars.

I really don't get the distain for these trucks. I think they're great for regular Joe's that want to get away once in a while. If I didn't have San Rafael Swells, Cap Reef, etc. so close to me, I would buy one. Back up to a lake, cast a line from the tailgate and plop that fish right into the bed cooler.

 

[Hitman]

.... How could FCA not build in a limp-mode? It's that type of corner cutting that I avoid by avoiding those products....

Trust me, they do have a limp mode. All modern vehicles do. Not every failure works in a way that limp home mode will be an option. The idea of limp home mode is to bypass a failed sensor or sensors to allow the engine to run. Or take data from other sensors to calculate an approximate value from the failed sensor. Or very worst case scenario is to run off a base map, similar to how the vehicle runs when it's still in open loop. Still though, not all failures will allow the engine to run in limp mode.

 

[Toffees]

I know if it will sell. The answer is no. It won't. There are basically two categories of truck buyers. The first are the people who need a truck to do truck things - towing and hauling. The second are the category of people who want a truck for the image that they do truck things. The ridgeline does neither. It doesn't do truck things so it doesn't have the image of doing truck things. There are a few faithful Honda buyers who want a truck from Honda - but those are few and far between. Honda doesn't make a base model to compete where it would excel - deliver drivers, and it doesn't get good enough mileage to seriously compete with the diesel options from Dodge or GM.

2017 will presumably be it's best selling full model year and sales were about 34,000. That's bad. Significantly worse than the first generation. And even 2017 saw declining month by month sales through the end of the year. December 2017 sold 2854, Dec 2016 sold 4085. Basically, the 50,000 or so sliver of the market who want one bought it already. I'd bet 2018 won't break 20k. 2019 sales will be more like 10-15k. And by about 2022 it'll be discontinued.

It was a swing and a miss. Honda builds great stuff. I have owned many of their cars. I'd buy an accord over a camry without second thought. But the ridgeline is a product very few people want.

That's certainly possible. Having owned a Ridgeline for 9 years, it's more than enough truck for what most drivers need, but whether it satisfies what they want is absolutely different. I agree with the other (p-nut?) on this: the Ridgeline fits a demographic that needs to be better served. Whether Honda can market effectively to this demo and whether the current iteration of Ridgeline is the appropriate truck for that demo are two worthy questions.

 

[Captsolo]

From what I've read Honda Pilot transmissions don't last. I haven't seen one with over 140,000 miles. Lots of failures at 70,000 to 100,000 miles.

Honda owner writes: "The mechanic that fixed my transmission said that he has seen quite a few Pilots come in at nearly 140,000 miles with the same kind of damage- that it almost always involves the 3rd gear, and this subsequently leads to failure of the transmission. He even went as far as to say that he believes that Honda has a problem with these transmissions."

Another owner of Pilot writes: I have a Honda Pilot 2004, with approximately 60 K miles and it has a transmission problem." olice:

https://forums.edmunds.com/discussion/6944/honda/pilot/honda-pilot-transmission-problems

 

[Captsolo]

http://www.toyota-4runner.org/5th-gen-t4rs/249289-20-most-reliable-cars-decade.html

Toyota tops them all.

20 Most Reliable Cars of the Decade According to Consumer Reports :hatsoff:

Guess which car/truck was given #1?

https://www.cheatsheet.com/money-ca...ding-consumer-reports.html/?ref=YF&yptr=yahoo

 

[creativeRunner]

You are correct: modern vehicles don't break down as much as their predecessors did.

Amen to that!
Modern vehicles are amazingly well engineered and built.

Of course, it drives me nuts when they make parts super difficult to remove, just because Mr. Engineer has never gotten his hands dirty.
Sure, it looks good in the computer screen.... yet a pair of human hands will have a heck of a time removing/servicing some of the designs they come up with.

Similarly, the materials of the vehicles are really good.
I remember 1990's plastics were crap. Things would distort, discolor, they would come apart, unglue, fall apart, break, crack, and turn to sand-dust.

Glad the quality has gone up.

 

[creativeRunner]

20 Most Reliable Cars of the Decade According to Consumer Reports :hatsoff:

Guess which car/truck was given #1?

https://www.cheatsheet.com/money-ca...ding-consumer-reports.html/?ref=YF&yptr=yahoo

Direct link to spot #20: https://www.cheatsheet.com/money-ca...rs-decade-according-consumer-reports.html/20/

It's the 4Runner.

Money quote:

An amazing 13 straight years of top reliability scores make 4Runner the undisputed champion.

It may lack refinement and seem a little dated, but as far as reliability is concerned nothing compares to Toyota 4Runner. The truck-based SUV posted 13 consecutive years of the highest ratings Consumer Reports gives for durability. Since 4Runner has not undergone a redesign since 2010, buyers of any model-year can be confident they’re getting the most bulletproof vehicle in America.

Rankings provided by Consumer Reports.

 

[Rich27]

I have owned 3 Honda's and always had some sort of transmission issue.

I own a Sienna and it's be going good so far.

 

[dreyday]

I have owned 3 Honda's and always had some sort of transmission issue.

I own a Sienna and it's be going good so far.

My cousin had an Odyssey with constant issues with the transmission, sensors, ignition coils, etc. Barely made it to 140k before he just had to get rid of it.

He bought a Sienna with 90k miles on it, and its not well over 200k without any issues. Replaced the timing belt and water pump around 150k and thats about it!

Toyota's all day, everyday !!!

 

[Lester Lugnut]

That said, it makes me chuckle when people focus strictly on reliability. Personally, I'd rather have a vehicle that makes me happy much more than just the most reliable vehicle out there.

The vehicle that makes me the most happy is the one that is the most reliable.

 

[Steamfitter]

I had a honda civic for 9 years before I bought my T4R, and it was excellent, never had a problem. My parents have gone through 2 CRV and 2 Accord. Dad currently has a 2008 accord that has had some electrical problems with, resulting in brand new batteries dying. Something to do with glitches in the infotainment system that the dealership can't seem to figure out. Also I have heard anecdotally that the new honda/acura transmissions aren't as good FWIW.

In sum, they are both great brands, but I would rate Toyota slightly higher, particularly with models like the 4Runner.

 

[J.F. Sebastian]

Worked in the auto industry for almost 15 years with almost every manufacturer on the planet. There are four manufacturers' products I will never consider owning even if they paid me. Honda, Nissan, Mitsubishi and Subaru. I'll take a used Kia or Hyundai any day. Or the bus.

 

[MrGainzz]

Worked in the auto industry for almost 15 years with almost every manufacturer on the planet. There are four manufacturers' products I will never consider owning even if they paid me. Honda, Nissan, Mitsubishi and Subaru. I'll take a used Kia or Hyundai any day. Or the bus.

Not even GM ,Jeep and Ford ?


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[J.F. Sebastian]

Not even GM ,Jeep and Ford ?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Sure! Loved my '95 Sierra 2500 4x, my buddy loves his new diesel F-350. Jeeps are lovely, just not my taste... I'd buy another GM truck in a heartbeat. There is some real crap that comes from Japan, some of the companies' ethics are in the toilet, internals are ludicrous and impossible to deal with in some cases, just saying... The stories I have on a personal basis alone could fill pages...

 

[20184runner]

Toyota better

Honda new transmissions failing

I specifically made sure my Toyota was imported and made from japan

Japan eyed products

 

[2003-4x4runner]

I've owned two Honda Preludes, a 1989 and 1991. They were both great cars and fun to drive. The 1989 air condition compressor had a small leak in it and the back window leaked water in the back seat when it rained. Ended up selling the 89 and getting the 91 used from my sister-in-law's family. The 91 was great but I ended up selling it two years later when I got married. Didn't have any problem with the 91 since I had it.

Currently I only own the 4Runner and I would not purchase another Honda.

From what I've seen from Honda is that they are using cheap components in their parts. I have a co-worker and friends that have Honda vehicles and this is what I've seen. (all older vehichles, not sure of the year).

Honda Element - Bad air conditioning compressor and starter.
Honda Ridge Line - Bad Starter
Honda Civic - Bad air conditioning compressor.

Honda motors are great, don't get me wrong. Its the cheap parts that Honda is using that's sucks.

 

[97t4r81]

Worked in the auto industry for almost 15 years with almost every manufacturer on the planet. There are four manufacturers' products I will never consider owning even if they paid me. Honda, Nissan, Mitsubishi and Subaru. I'll take a used Kia or Hyundai any day. Or the bus.

I'm just curious as why those 4? In Tucson/no rust, those 4 along with Toyota are the most plentiful, beside USA trucks. While far far from scientific, it seems like those brands have lasting products. again I'm just curious to know. "Knowing is half the battle" "go Joe"