Transfer Case Question
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I hope this isn’t the case, I like the multi mode feature knowing that I could go to 4wd in most driving conditions for me.
I guess if I wanted greater traction for on road/ street conditions I will have to shell out more to get the limited (fulltime 4wd atrac and locking center diff).
I guess if I wanted greater traction for on road/ street conditions I will have to shell out more to get the limited (fulltime 4wd atrac and locking center diff).
sandcrawler
Senior Member
i feel your pain. the 4WD reality may actually prevent me from buying a new 4runner... i overwhelmingly prefer the Trail Edition styling & options (only thing i'd like from the Limited are the heated leather seats) but i don't know if i can really do without the multi-mode 4WD. what was toyota thinking? or is this just more cost-cutting of the worst kind?
Uneek
Super Moderator
Back to its roots.
sandcrawler
Senior Member
you know, you're absolutely right, Uneek. when i got my current '06 V8 SE, i reluctantly let go of my 1993 4runner... i loved that thing — and it was rear-wheel drive, with part-time 4WD and manual locking hubs!!
maybe the 4G has spoiled me since then and i'm being a bit unreasonable now. i really wanted the new 4runner to lose a bit of its, um, urbanity. and the Trail Edition at least seems to have done exactly that. perhaps i need to reset my expectations and redefine my "needs" such as they are...
but it'd really burn me up to drop the coin on a '10 TE only to have Toyota bring back the center diff and multi-mode 4WD in the next year or two...
sandcrawler
Senior Member
perhaps, but it's already been established that for the Canadian market the Limited and SR5 and Trail Edition all have the torsen center diff setup... so it's not unreasonable to posit that this may also be adopted in the U.S. market (on the sooner side)...
i personally feel a loaded 2010 Trail Edition is pretty spendy if you consider that current 4G owners would be giving up a significant bit of functionality in the trade. just my 2¢.
fjrjim
New member
Huh? A locking rear differential and KDSS for increase suspension articulation are an increase in off-road capability. Cost difference aside, depends on the intended vehicle use really. Occasional 4WD: SR5. Serious off-roading: Trail Edition. On-road 4WD (i.e., snow): Limited or other Toyota model.
People who live in the Northeast drive in the snow whether they want to or not. Some of those people even go offroad. But without a Torsen center diff, the SR5 and Trail Edition are far less suitable for winter driving.
As someone who owns a 4Runner and lives in the Northeast, I have to say that really SUCKS. Particularly since the SR5 and Trail Edition have a Torsen in Canada.
Uneek
Super Moderator
Unless things change, but I see no 5th gen in my future. What was nice about the 4th gen was the drivetrain was the same across the board for different trims. You can pick the trim that suit you best and still have the same underpinnings.
What has happened with the 5th gen is I have to prioritize on drivetrain or features. So I have to ask myself what I'm willing to scrafice (good looks is already given up) and for now it's the 4Runner altogether.
What has happened with the 5th gen is I have to prioritize on drivetrain or features. So I have to ask myself what I'm willing to scrafice (good looks is already given up) and for now it's the 4Runner altogether.
Agree completely.
I don't consider 4runner 5th gen as my future car until they return multi-mode 4wd to sr5. Luckily I'm going to own 4th gen first which is a perfect vehicle for my needs.
I think that trail edition does not need multimode because it's a special purpose vehicle that'll spend most of its time conquering punishing terrain but sr5 that's targeted to most people and which should become the top selling model should be available with multi-mode. Nobody will shell out 42k for limited with its enormous 20 inch wheels. I don't event want to think about what will happen to the car's suspension when you'll be driving with it on bad roads.
I hope market will show that and they'll re-introduce sport edition which will be between sr5 and limited. Anyways it's just a start for the 5th gen and after 3 years they'll facelift it so I'll wait and see. Hopefully they'll choose wisely.
sandcrawler
Senior Member
sorry, i just don't see it this way. and you do realize that the KDSS is only available on the Trail Edition coupled with the navi, yes? add a conservative $2500 and your "specialty vehicle" Trail Edition is almost $39K. for me, that seems kinda ridiculous. but, as they say, different strokes...
Going back to a 4WD part-time system that I had on my 1993 V6 Toyota pickup from a 4WD system on the 4th Gen. V6 that appeared to be ideal... is purely a cheap-skate method of Toyota to save money.
The part-time 4WD system offers absolutely no advantage and it's a step-backwards... not forward, especially for a near $40K vehicle.
This is an absolute deal-breaker for me. :nono:
sandcrawler
Senior Member
with you all the way. i'll be writing letters to Toyota expressing my dissatisfaction.
please excuse my ignorance on the matter, but I don't see why this is a big deal? why would you want all time 4wd? I was assuming that the 4wd in the 5th gen TE would be similar to the 4wd in my 2000 Limited (button 4hi up to 60mph, 4hi/lo with gear shift)... am I mistaken?for all purposes but city driving I wouldn't want a torsen diff. because if two wheels loose traction (f/r), the other two recieve no torque whatsoever.
please fill me in on what toyota is doing wrong here? thanks!
Uneek
Super Moderator
for all purposes but city driving I wouldn't want a torsen diff. because if two wheels loose traction (f/r), the other two recieve no torque whatsoever.
please fill me in on what toyota is doing wrong here? thanks!
With multi-mode or full time 4WD drive, it can be driven on dry pavement or any type of road surfaces without binding, or excessive wear on the drivetrain components or tires.
For me, because I use my 4Runner for snowboarding, I be in 4H and drive around the Sierras whether it's snowing or it's sunny outside. IMO, it would be a PITA for me to switching between 2H and 4H on the drive up because parts of the highway has been plowed while others have not. If there's a storm, the plows can't keep the roads clear fast enough.
Multi-mode (the ability to be in full time 4WD) is why I opted for the 4Runner over a 4x4 Tacoma.
The 4th gen has a lockable center diff. With the center diff locked, my 4R will behave no differently than a part time 4WD system. So the 4th gen had the best of both worlds. The 5th leaves one of the worlds to be desired, depending on which tirm is chosen.
The problem here is the 5th gen SR5 and Trail editions have gone back to a less capable (open to debate) 4wd system, a system where 4wd is strictly for off road.
On my current 4th gen 4runner an 07 SR5 4wd, I have the ability to go between 2wd to 4wd (multi mode) it allows me to run my vehicle practically the same way as the limited’s full time 4wd on and off road at any speed hi or lo. All the benefits of increased traction -on the road may it be dry or wet -snow, rain, sleet etc. It is awesome!
There isnt a lot of vehicles that can do this -look around. -This was the biggest difference between the 4th gen 4runner 4wd multi-mode and other vehicles in any class.
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Here in the Northeast we get snow in the winter. You are often going from dry pavement to wet pavement to partly snow covered to full snow covered in just 1/4 mile or so. You can't drive on dry (or even wet) pavement in part-time 4WD -- you'll bind up the drivetrain. You can drive in a full-time 4WD vehicle in such conditions.
Furthermore, when you are on a snow covered road, a part-time 4WD vehicle with no center diff has the front and rear diffs turning at the same speed, which results in slip when going around corners. A full-time 4WD vehicle with a Torsen center diff allows the front and rear diffs to turn at different speeds, resulting in better traction in the snow.
The Torsen diff is a limited slip differential. That, combined with ATRAC, means it won't send all the torque to a single axle. Furthermore, it is lockable. Once locked, it behaves just like a part-time system with no center diff.
Toyota is reducing the capability of the vehicle. A lockable Torsen center diff gives all the benefits of your 2000's system, plus more.
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jh26
New member
At this point, if I consider a new 4Runner at all, it will be a 2wd. I live in the "rain belt" not the snow belt, and full time 4wd is great in the rain. But my main use of 4wd is pulling large boats up wet ramps and around the storage lot. I use 4-lo/unlocked on my 4th gen and it's the greatest feature you can imagine for this. The Limited still has full-time, but I don't like the 20 inch wheels or the price. And it still doesn't have 4lo/unlocked mode.
I'm actually considering looking for a new 2009 v8 before they are all gone...