TRD Pro spacer lift vs

[DatYoda]

Want a 2-3" lift. Already got 2" spacers not installed yet. I'm still new to all this lifting stuff. Been reading on spacer lift on how it's bad for the suspension but at the same time there are a lot of people running it. I do off-roading but not extreme off-roading. TRD Pro vehicle btw.

Is the 2" spacer safe to run for daily driven truck ?

What's the pros and cons of Stock TRD Pro suspension with 2" spacer lift vs 2" lift on stage 1 Icon ?

Is stage 1 Icon and stage 2 Icon the same but stage 2 Icon comes with UCA ? Will I need UCA for 3" lift.

My main concern is damaging anything if going with spacer lift.

Will be reading up more but wanted to try get some straight forward answers at the same time. Thanks!

 

[PapaRappa]

Subscribed.
Hope you get the answers you’re looking for as I’m looking for them too. Not sure if you’re looking at the same one, I’ve seen the toytec 2” lift for the TRD Pro specifically.
Like the price due to the fact that it’ll use the TRD Pro suspension I paid for and I find suitable for my current needs. (I also do mild to med off-road, 1-5s in the California Trails series for anyone familiar with that)
Like that it’s a mild 2” lift, was looking for a lift option no more that 3”.
Shared concerns:
I’ve searched threads and found many have done it without new UCAs but I see that it’s recommended and would like to see more feedback on that.
Finally, I do hope folks elaborate more about the downsides of the spacer lift. Both in terms of potential damage/reliability issues and does it reduce suspension performance/effectiveness.

Suspension newb here appreciative of any insights given on this thread.

 

[TEujunga]

I feel like I'm enabling lazy behavior to address questions that have already been asked and answered hundreds of times in multiple threads which I was able to find simply by typing "spacer lift" into the search bar, but ... it's Sunday and I have nothing better to do.

If you do any off-roading at all, any front spacer lift is a bad idea, and a spacer lift of over 2" is a really bad idea. Spacer lifts decrease the available suspension travel in the downward direction ("droop") and cause the shock to become the limiting factor. This can result in eventual catastrophic failure of the shock.

If you could afford $45K-plus for a TRD Pro, you can probably afford a few hundred more for a proper front suspension lift.

Any lift over 2.5" reduces front wheel caster to the point that aftermarket UCAs become a good idea. Reduced caster doesn't technically hurt anything, but it's up to you whether driving around in a vehicle that wants to wander all over the road is acceptable. I have about a 2.5" front lift and stock UCAs allowing me a max of about 2.5º of caster. It's not great -- I especially notice it in crosswinds or on tilted roads -- but I decided I can live with it.

3" is about the practical limit for any lift without doing other major modifications, and even at 3", the design of the IFS suspension is about maxed out.

If you read through the numerous existing spacer lift threads, I don't think you'll find many off-roading owners who are happy with the spacer lift in the long term -- most say they wish they had gotten a "real" suspension lift from the outset.

There, that just saved you precious seconds of search time!

 

[r1verf3nix]

I did the Toytec TRD Pro lift on my 2017 Pro. Love it, I went with the 1.5" Rear Saw option still ended up at about 2" of lift but it should settle out lower than the standard 2" spring of the kit. The TRD Pro lift is great because it maintains the Pro shocks (that we paid for) and only adds spacers to the front and swaps the stock (the same spring used by all trims of the 4R) with more robust lifted rear springs. I combined it with spidertrax 1.25" wheel spacers to push the stock pro wheels slightly out. I am happy with it, it retains all the stock Pro components and the factory ride feel. If you buy the Pro why immediately go and buy an ICON lift that takes out everything that makes it a Pro.

 

[nb rob]

The requirement for new UCAs is very dependant on who's doing your alignments.

A great tech can likely get your caster in spec with a small lift. When I say 'in spec', I mean +2.5. The built-in caster geometry of aftermarket UCAs will make it easier for your alignment tech to give you an ideal alignment. The tradeoff is the upfront cost and maintenance of those UCAs, along with a potential for more noise from those parts.

The 4runner likes to dart around the highway, requiring constant steering corrections. If you can get your alignment guru to get you closer to 4.0 degrees for caster, this darting goes away, and the vehicle will track nice and straight. I recall when I had mine changed from 2.5 ish to 4.0ish, the difference was very obvious on the 1 hour drive home on the highway from my preferred toyota shop.

When you lift your vehicle, this window of opportunity for caster starts to close. When the best your alignment tech can do is UNDER the 2.5 degrees, then you are dealing with a compromise in ride quality. This is when aftermarket UCAs comes in to the picture.
Some folks will say that their vehicle drives fine, but this enters the realm of personal experience, and maybe they're used to the constant steering correction and don't find it uncomfortable at all. For me, once I experienced 4.0 caster, there's no going back.

Now-- If I could keep my stock UCAs, I would. why?
simply because they're silent. They use rubber bushings, and a sealed balljoint that will never creak or groan unless the balljoint is in disrepair.

That being said, I have dirtking UCAs with poly bushings and a stainless uniball.
I'm a bit of a maintenance whore, so greasing the bushings and keeping the uniball squeaky clean is not a problem for me. Unfortunately, the salt and slush on the roads here for a big part of the year isn't great for the open uniballs. (I've already replaced my uniballs once using an excellent writeup from Jono.ful)

So if you're not the type of person that enjoys spending extra time maintaining suspension parts--- maybe you will have a little more patience for a lower-caster condition with stock UCAs. Likewise, if your alignment tech graduated at the bottom of his class, you might wind up with completely unacceptable caster with a mild lift and stock UCAs.

 

[TEujunga]

The requirement for new UCAs is very dependant on who's doing your alignments.

A great tech can likely get your caster in spec with a small lift. When I say 'in spec', I mean +2.5. The built-in caster geometry of aftermarket UCAs will make it easier for your alignment tech to give you an ideal alignment. The tradeoff is the upfront cost and maintenance of those UCAs, along with a potential for more noise from those parts.

The 4runner likes to dart around the highway, requiring constant steering corrections. If you can get your alignment guru to get you closer to 4.0 degrees for caster, this darting goes away, and the vehicle will track nice and straight. I recall when I had mine changed from 2.5 ish to 4.0ish, the difference was very obvious on the 1 hour drive home on the highway from my preferred toyota shop.

When you lift your vehicle, this window of opportunity for caster starts to close. When the best your alignment tech can do is UNDER the 2.5 degrees, then you are dealing with a compromise in ride quality. This is when aftermarket UCAs comes in to the picture.
Some folks will say that their vehicle drives fine, but this enters the realm of personal experience, and maybe they're used to the constant steering correction and don't find it uncomfortable at all. For me, once I experienced 4.0 caster, there's no going back.

Now-- If I could keep my stock UCAs, I would. why?
simply because they're silent. They use rubber bushings, and a sealed balljoint that will never creak or groan unless the balljoint is in disrepair.

That being said, I have dirtking UCAs with poly bushings and a stainless uniball.
I'm a bit of a maintenance whore, so greasing the bushings and keeping the uniball squeaky clean is not a problem for me. Unfortunately, the salt and slush on the roads here for a big part of the year isn't great for the open uniballs. (I've already replaced my uniballs once using an excellent writeup from Jono.ful)

So if you're not the type of person that enjoys spending extra time maintaining suspension parts--- maybe you will have a little more patience for a lower-caster condition with stock UCAs. Likewise, if your alignment tech graduated at the bottom of his class, you might wind up with completely unacceptable caster with a mild lift and stock UCAs.

That's about the best write-up on the caster/UCA issue I've seen. Nice!

 

[MrJux]

I have about a 2.5" front lift and stock UCAs allowing me a max of about 2.5º of caster. It's not great -- I especially notice it in crosswinds or on tilted roads -- but I decided I can live with it.

Since you're bored ... why did you decide to live with it as opposed to getting different UCAs? What are the pro/cons in that scenario, other than the cost?

 

[TEujunga]

Since you're bored ... why did you decide to live with it as opposed to getting different UCAs? What are the pro/cons in that scenario, other than the cost?

nb_rob said it perfectly -- aside from the initial cost, most aftermarket UCAs require additional maintenance and/or aren't as reliable as the stock ones. If I had it to do over again I might look at the JBAs: JBA STD High Caster Upper A-arms for 2005-14 Toyota Tacoma, 4Runner, FJ Cruiser

 

[delloro]

Spacer lifts decrease the available suspension travel in the downward direction ("droop") and cause the shock to become the limiting factor.

??? How does a longer shock assembly extend less?

This can result in eventual catastrophic failure of the shock.

This is the first I have heard of this. Out of the many hundreds of spacer lifts that must be on 4runners, I have yet to have read somebody post of such a thing.

 

[HeartGuy]

??? How does a longer shock assembly extend less?



This is the first I have heard of this. Out of the many hundreds of spacer lifts that must be on 4runners, I have yet to have read somebody post of such a thing.

Most spacers mount between the spring and top hat or below the spring, which extends the shock and therefore limits down travel. A top mount spacer (on top of the tophat) extends down travel because it is not changing the resting length of the shock.

 

[DatYoda]

What about a Icon Stage 1. How does that compare to the stock TRD Pro suspension. Can I get away with Stage 1 with stock UCA and 285/70/17 tires if lifting 3". Does that void warranty ?

Since TRD Pro suspesion has remote reservoirs and Icon stage 1 doesn't.

 

[HeartGuy]

What about a Icon Stage 1. How does that compare to the stock TRD Pro suspension. Can I get away with Stage 1 with stock UCA and 285/70/17 tires if lifting 3". Does that void warranty ?

Since TRD Pro suspesion has remote reservoirs and Icon stage 1 doesn't.

You sound like you want someone to tell you what is best for you. There are a TON of threads on suspension setups with very good information. I would do some legwork and educate yourself, it will help direct this and every other project you take on with your Runner.

 

[PapaRappa]

I'm not the OP but I want to thank you all for the insights all the same, especially in regards to the UCA. At least this gives me some direction on looking for what to check for after an alignment.

As for the lift...only wanting a small lift, I think I'm going to see about going for some front and rear lift coils. I'll have to read up on them but it seems that those will do the trick and NOT compromise suspension offroad. It seems that Dobinson's is looking to release one that is tailor made for the TRD Pro so I'll be keeping my eyes open for that.

 

[DatYoda]

Decided to go to go with Icon extended travel front coilover kit with 2" rear spring and remote reservoir rear shocks. But my final question is if I plan on lifting it 3" would I need UCA right away if I'm just doing lift off-roading ? Can I hold off on the UCA till couple months later ? Or will I run into problems.

 

[delloro]

Decided to go to go with Icon extended travel front coilover kit with 2" rear spring and remote reservoir rear shocks. But my final question is if I plan on lifting it 3" would I need UCA right away if I'm just doing lift off-roading ? Can I hold off on the UCA till couple months later ? Or will I run into problems.

Need new UCA to get benefit of extended travel front shocks. Do it at the same time.

 

[transistor]

I did the Toytec TRD Pro lift on my 2017 Pro. Love it, I went with the 1.5" Rear Saw option still ended up at about 2" of lift but it should settle out lower than the standard 2" spring of the kit. The TRD Pro lift is great because it maintains the Pro shocks (that we paid for) and only adds spacers to the front and swaps the stock (the same spring used by all trims of the 4R) with more robust lifted rear springs. I combined it with spidertrax 1.25" wheel spacers to push the stock pro wheels slightly out. I am happy with it, it retains all the stock Pro components and the factory ride feel. If you buy the Pro why immediately go and buy an ICON lift that takes out everything that makes it a Pro.

Can you post some photos? The photobucket images in your other post won't load

 

[mrblah]

I feel like I'm enabling lazy behavior to address questions that have already been asked and answered hundreds of times in multiple threads which I was able to find simply by typing "spacer lift" into the search bar, but ... it's Sunday and I have nothing better to do.

If you do any off-roading at all, any front spacer lift is a bad idea, and a spacer lift of over 2" is a really bad idea. Spacer lifts decrease the available suspension travel in the downward direction ("droop") and cause the shock to become the limiting factor. This can result in eventual catastrophic failure of the shock.

If you could afford $45K-plus for a TRD Pro, you can probably afford a few hundred more for a proper front suspension lift.

Any lift over 2.5" reduces front wheel caster to the point that aftermarket UCAs become a good idea. Reduced caster doesn't technically hurt anything, but it's up to you whether driving around in a vehicle that wants to wander all over the road is acceptable. I have about a 2.5" front lift and stock UCAs allowing me a max of about 2.5º of caster. It's not great -- I especially notice it in crosswinds or on tilted roads -- but I decided I can live with it.

3" is about the practical limit for any lift without doing other major modifications, and even at 3", the design of the IFS suspension is about maxed out.

If you read through the numerous existing spacer lift threads, I don't think you'll find many off-roading owners who are happy with the spacer lift in the long term -- most say they wish they had gotten a "real" suspension lift from the outset.

There, that just saved you precious seconds of search time!

This pretty much sums it up about spacer lifts.

To the OP: In the end of the day, its your money so do what you want, but be weary of people who say they are the best thing since sliced bread. If you are going to do light offroading, you should be okay. If you plan on pushing your rig, look into other options.

 

[b407driver]

I agree with much of the two early (longer) answers posted above, with one caveat regarding TRD front suspension. If you opt only for the Toytec spring seat spacer that adds an additional inch to a stock TRD Pro, you are essentially exactly where someone with a Bilstein 6112 would be, even though changing the c-clip settings on that shock isn't considered a spacer lift.

Regarding the rear, new springs are fairly inexpensive, and it's the right way to do it (compared to spacers).

People have ruined suspension components with poor spacer implementations, but I've heard of no such issues with Toytec's TRD lift, for whatever that's worth.

 

[DatYoda]

Does the Icon 2"rear lift cool springs add 2" height on TRD Pro ? Or is it 2" on other 4Runner modes so just 1" on TRD Pro ?

 

[mrblah]

Does the Icon 2"rear lift cool springs add 2" height on TRD Pro ? Or is it 2" on other 4Runner modes so just 1" on TRD Pro ?

It should be 2 inches of lift to the rear of your Pro.