What makes the 2nd gen. so offroad capable?

[2003Can4runner]

Ever since I could remember my Dad has always driven 4runners (hence why I've had a 3rd gen, and now a 4th), but I'm curious. Why is the 2nd gen. so capable? I believe it didn't have the option for a rear diff lock (or did it?). Did it have an LSD in the rear? It couldn't have just had open diffs could it?

 

[ovrrdrive]

In stock form it's light and I believe those early years it had the most ground clearance in it's class from the factory. Those alone give it an edge over a few other popular offroad vehicles. That said, I never really considered my truck to be really good offroad until I locked the back and put some mud tires on it. I used to get stuck in small mud puddles but now it will go through anything.

The important thing is to have confidence in what you're wheeling in. If toyota makes you feel all warm and fuzzy inside then that's what you need to be in.

 

[Ulfr]

LSD in the rear was the standard.

The reason I think is the strongly built frame, great height and lightweight.
Easily modified for larger tires (at least us Icelanders think so!) Can be fitted on 35" with no lift and 38" with minimum lift.

Easy to SAS and easy to fix... Great in maintainance!

Well, when I think 'bout it.
I don't really know why the 2nd gen is so capable... Prolly's just a legend!

But from my heart's view... because it's a toyota 4runner!

A truck with 4runner as a name can't be other than good off-roader right?

 

[Justinlhc]

LSD in the rear was the standard.

The reason I think is the strongly built frame, great height and lightweight.
Easily modified for larger tires (at least us Icelanders think so!) Can be fitted on 35" with no lift and 38" with minimum lift.

Easy to SAS and easy to fix... Great in maintainance!

Well, when I think 'bout it.
I don't really know why the 2nd gen is so capable... Prolly's just a legend!

But from my heart's view... because it's a toyota 4runner!

A truck with 4runner as a name can't be other than good off-roader right?

Wow, ummm....you must have a completely different 2gen 4Runner in your country than we have in the U.S. I have NEVER heard of a 2Gen coming with any type of LSD or locked differential from the factory. I've never seen one or heard of one. Also, lightweight?? My 93 4Runner weighs right around 4000lbs which is NOT something I would consider to be "lightweight". 35" tires and no lift will require some pretty serious trimming/hammering/cutting of the fenderwells, even with stock offset. 38" tires with minimal lift??? Huh?? A 38" tire on an IFS front end is a time bomb, not to mention would require a pretty serious suspension AND body lift to clear. Where do you find these magical 2gen 4Runners at???

 

[ovrrdrive]

If you don't think a 4runner or toyota truck is light, go put a chevy on a scale and get back to me.

It's all relative. These trucks are light for what they are.

As for 38's, ever see pictures of a truck in Iceland?

They do amazing things over there and definitely aren't afraid to cut body panels. And if you know the limitations of your truck and don't exceed them, 38's are possible on IFS. I'm running 36's on mine and haven't even repacked the wheel bearings in over 2 years.

 

[Justinlhc]

You're comparing a mini-truck with either a 4cyl or a V6 to a full size truck with a V8. Apples to oranges. Anything is possible. 38's on an IFS truck is possible. Practical? Reliable? Functional? Eh.....


Do you do much off-roading with those 36's? Are your diff's open? In your sig it says you have an 8.5" lift to fit a 36" tire? I hardly qualify that as a "minimal lift".

 

[ovrrdrive]

You're comparing a mini-truck with either a 4cyl or a V6 to a full size truck with a V8. Apples to oranges. Anything is possible. 38's on an IFS truck is possible. Practical? Reliable? Functional? Eh.....


Do you do much off-roading with those 36's? Are your diff's open? In your sig it says you have an 8.5" lift to fit a 36" tire? I hardly qualify that as a "minimal lift".

When the hell did I say anything about "minimal lift"?

I'm locked in the rear and open in front. I don't go offroad as much I used to but I still go every chance I get. Btw, since I made the sig I actually dropped the truck by the bj spacers in front and the 4" blocks in back. The truck is a lot less tipsy and clears the tires just fine. Now it's lifted 7" in front and 6.5" in back counting the body lift.

Also, if you didn't click the links in our Icelandic friends sig, it's well worth the read. His truck is awesome.

Seems like you're trying to pick a fight in here for some reason. Relax man, it's all good.

 

[Justinlhc]

Picking a fight? Uh, no. I'm correcting information that I believe is incorrect.

"Minimal lift" is what was said about fitting 38" tires in the post I replied to, that you defended, comparing your 8.5" lift with 36" tires to my reply about fitting 38" tires with "minimal lift". I just don't want people reading that thinking they can buy a 4" lift and cram some 38" tires on their 4Runner, because it's not possible unless you cut half of your vehicle off around the tires. :nono:

 

[ovrrdrive]

Did you click the link in his sig and see his truck?

And I never compared my lift/tire combo to his even in the slightest manner. I mentioned my tire size in reference to your comment that IFS couldn't handle big tires.

Btw, there is at least one person on Yotatech running 35's on a runner with no lift, and probably a hundred with very minimal lift. I only jacked up my truck because I wanted to.

 

[Justinlhc]

Don't forget to mention the hammering, cutting and trimming they had to do to clear those 35" tires with no lift. You only jacked up your truck because you wanted to? So uh, how were you planning on clearing those tires?

I suppose if you don't go off-road and don't turn much it would be ok.

The truck I seen in his sig had a SAS which obviously isn't stock so I'm not even sure what that has to do with anything?

 

[Justinlhc]

Here is my 93 4Runner with 1.5" lift and 32x11.50 with 15x8 4"bs:

Keep in mind this is AFTER some serious trimming/hammering/cutting (as you can see)

Even rubbed in the rear and I have no stock rear bumper/mudflaps so there would be no chance in hell if it were stock:

 

[gizmopt2002]

Wow, ummm....you must have a completely different 2gen 4Runner in your country than we have in the U.S. I have NEVER heard of a 2Gen coming with any type of LSD or locked differential from the factory. I've never seen one or heard of one. Also, lightweight?? My 93 4Runner weighs right around 4000lbs which is NOT something I would consider to be "lightweight". 35" tires and no lift will require some pretty serious trimming/hammering/cutting of the fenderwells, even with stock offset. 38" tires with minimal lift??? Huh?? A 38" tire on an IFS front end is a time bomb, not to mention would require a pretty serious suspension AND body lift to clear. Where do you find these magical 2gen 4Runners at???

Plenty of people have fit 35's in thier 2nd gen with little to no modification or lift.

 

[gizmopt2002]

Here is my 93 4Runner with 1.5" lift and 32x11.50 with 15x8 4"bs:

Keep in mind this is AFTER some serious trimming/hammering/cutting (as you can see)

Even rubbed in the rear and I have no stock rear bumper/mudflaps so there would be no chance in hell if it were stock:

Are you sure those are 32's? Those look like 35s....

My 31's (which is a mere .5 inch larger in diameter) aren't nearly that stuffed in the wheel wells... Granted the tread lugs could make it like 33's....

 

[Justinlhc]

Are you sure those are 32's? Those look like 35s....

My 31's (which is a mere .5 inch larger in diameter) aren't nearly that stuffed in the wheel wells... Granted the tread lugs could make it like 33's....

lol yes I'm pretty sure they are 32's unless they were stamped with a 32x11.50x15 by accident at BFG. :happens:

I never said you can't fit 35's with no lift. It will require STOCK offset and a good amount of hammering/trimming/cutting. Everybody wants to act like you can just slap 35's on and like magic it's just going to work.

 

[Ulfr]

Wow, ummm....you must have a completely different 2gen 4Runner in your country than we have in the U.S. I have NEVER heard of a 2Gen coming with any type of LSD or locked differential from the factory. I've never seen one or heard of one. Also, lightweight?? My 93 4Runner weighs right around 4000lbs which is NOT something I would consider to be "lightweight". 35" tires and no lift will require some pretty serious trimming/hammering/cutting of the fenderwells, even with stock offset. 38" tires with minimal lift??? Huh?? A 38" tire on an IFS front end is a time bomb, not to mention would require a pretty serious suspension AND body lift to clear. Where do you find these magical 2gen 4Runners at???

Maybe the LSD wasnt standard everywhere. I don't know, but at least in Iceland *all* 4runners have LSD in the rear.

Lightweight yes. 4000lbs isn't alot compared to how "big" the 4runner is. But maybe you've got other standards. IIRC my friend's bronco II was 1600kg and it was way smaller than my 'runner...
Of course, if you really want it light. Go for a 1st gen with fiber bodyparts or an CJ5 with fiber body parts...

I have 44s on with 3" bodylift and IIRC 3 or 4" on coils, my 38" 4runner has 2" bodylift and 1" on coils on rear axle, with no lift in the front. It does awesome job in my terrain, which is mainly snow and gravel roads (with abit of rocks in it tho'). Maybe not the strongest for rock crawling, but does good job at snow. edit: I forgot to mention, 12-15" wide wheels hasn't been a problem either, with the 38"
I have my 44s on 18" wide wheels, no problem there either. Mainly my steering that's gettin' messed up frequently. But that one is used for breaking through icy rivers so, I'd consider it under alot of stress.

We cut abit of the fenderwall, not that much really, and move the 2nd body mount up 2" (the same as the body lift...) and a little bit reverse. I don't find that much of a problem. There are few hundred 4runners modified for 38s this way. Hasn't been a problem for the last 19 years.

Edit: Found some useful pics of the progress when I modified my first 4runner.
body mount moved.

In "action"

Three good ones...

On a tour with LMI GPS measuring tracks in the highlands of Iceland. And yes, it's snowin, in July...

 

[Justinlhc]

Wow, a few things to point out though...relocating body mounts is something I'd consider to be more than minimal lol. I understand it works for you and your off-roading, but that truck wouldn't make it very far out here where you actually need the wheels to articulate and turn. From the looks of it you don't have more than a couple inches of wheel travel until it digs into your rear quarter, but it could just be the picture as I'm sure the fender flares and the hacking of the body panels helps alot.....unless that comes standard on 4Runners in your country also?

I guess some people have different views on what is considered "minimal modifications" to fit larger tires. From the picture I can see quite a bit of serious work that went into fitting those tires.

Anyways, what gears are you running with those 44's? Are both of your axles locked? Just curious what other modifications you did to be running 44's? My turd of a 3.0 has a hard time moving 32's with 4.30 gears. :sobbing:

Out here we have to stuff tires and extend to get around:

I used to rub my 31x10.50's all over the place. I couldn'timagine a 38 or a 44:lmao:

 

[Ulfr]

Wow, a few things to point out though...relocating body mounts is something I'd consider to be more than minimal lol. I understand it works for you and your off-roading, but that truck wouldn't make it very far out here where you actually need the wheels to articulate and turn. From the looks of it you don't have more than a couple inches of wheel travel until it digs into your rear quarter, but it could just be the picture as I'm sure the fender flares and the hacking of the body panels helps alot.....unless that comes standard on 4Runners in your country also?

I guess some people have different views on what is considered "minimal modifications" to fit larger tires. From the picture I can see quite a bit of serious work that went into fitting those tires.

Anyways, what gears are you running with those 44's? Are both of your axles locked? Just curious what other modifications you did to be running 44's? My turd of a 3.0 has a hard time moving 32's with 4.30 gears. :sobbing:

Out here we have to stuff tires and extend to get around:

I used to rub my 31x10.50's all over the place. I couldn'timagine a 38 or a 44:lmao:

I find it minimal, as it lengthens the time of the body lift 'bout one hour, 10mins with a grinder, move it up and weld.. not much of a problem... You do realise that we burn the IFS off on the new hilux/tacomas/prados/100 series/ etc toyotas... and move it down, change the camber and caster... and weld it under again to fit 38s and 44s on them... The older style hilux/4runner was way easier..

Sure, I think in my situation, as yours as well, we aren't really goin' in a straight line. That's more like a "quarter of a mile" people who do that.

It's true my wheels only have few inches of travel upwards (4" or so). But that's sufficent. I'd rather sacrifice some uptravel for lower point of gravity. Of course it rubs, but not that much, and nothing in the rear. And FIY, the 2nd gen was not much different here than in your country. Why they didn't have LSD in the rear I don't know. But I do know that few of ours had the cupholder, and I think those how had, had different taillights.

I've rarely seen open diffs in a 4runner, I think the 4cyl version (save the diesel ones) are the only runners in Iceland that have open rear diffs. All the v6 have LSD.

And no, I ain't got lockers yet. But the lockers and the low gear (extra transfer case) is waitin' to be installed... when I have the time. =)
I'm runnin 1:4.56 now. But I might be goin' to 1:4.30 when I install the extra transfer cause it'll have 1:3 in high.

Of course it's lazy. But I'm not really that much in a hurry am I? And besides... all those studs will be stuck anyway when I cruise on low speed way ahead of 'em... lol

edit: By the way, nice 4runner and I like your rear bumper.

Well... the rear, not rubbin' in:

 

[Justinlhc]

You foreigners get cooler vehicles than us here in the U.S for some reason. As far as I know there aren't ANY 2gen with factory lockers in the U.S no matter what engine. I don't know why we get ripped off all the time like that. :cursin:

So did you add the fender flares or do they come from the factory like that? Looks like it clears up quite a bit of room.

My bumper is made by Trail Gear and was around $325 shipped. It made life alot easier without the factory hitch and bumper snagging on everything I drove over.

You guys certainly aren't scared of a torch and welder. I've never heard of someone torching thre IFS unless they were throwing it away for a solid axle replacement. :cheers:

 

[Ulfr]

You foreigners get cooler vehicles than us here in the U.S for some reason. As far as I know there aren't ANY 2gen with factory lockers in the U.S no matter what engine. I don't know why we get ripped off all the time like that. :cursin:

So did you add the fender flares or do they come from the factory like that? Looks like it clears up quite a bit of room.

My bumper is made by Trail Gear and was around $325 shipped. It made life alot easier without the factory hitch and bumper snagging on everything I drove over.

You guys certainly aren't scared of a torch and welder. I've never heard of someone torching thre IFS unless they were throwing it away for a solid axle replacement. :cheers:

Cooler or not... At least you have a cup holder, right?

oh... the fender flares, they're custom made, I think they are 18cm wide, and still not wide enough. Especially if I'm goin' for 46" next winter... ^,^ I got HZJ80 (fits 38-44") fender flares for free, and modified them abit...

Yeah, the factory bumper is only chrome... lol. Doesn't do much other than just gettin dented .. hehe

Scared of the torch or welder? Hell no. These things are meant to be used. Besides, we have history of messing up things straight from the factory... bwahaha.
You should see some of the things Arctic Trucks is doin' over here. Like the 44" polar hilux's. Very nice work even tho' I tell by my self.. ^,^

But then again, I think, it doesn't really matter what type of a car you have. As long as it has strong frame, and a body and interior you like, anything else doesn't matter.
Engines can be replaced, axles relocated and replaced, transmissions... What I like 'bout 'yotas is the interchangeable part and good service in Iceland and how it can continue to go on and on and one even tho' it's bashed and broken...

My next truck surely will be an HZJ80 frame with HJ60 axles (or Unimog 404/volvo c303) with 46" tires, 1HD-T engine, custom built body...

 

[SoundVisionSoul]

That is an AWSOME picture! Love it!