Whats in your medical kit.

[boodabill]

Wow.. $4250 to $4950 is hardly going to make it into my med kit any time soon. Saw nothing really on the site (quick glance) about what it does and how it's supposed to work? Any 6th grade explanation [MENTION=105154]boodabill[/MENTION] ???

Okki

You can get various low level lasers for under $2000, used on ebay. But it is a pro device used by chiropractors, vets, and sport therapists. It could be a life saver if you're bleeding, have a heart attack, or got severely burned.

LLLT is a light therapy that improves tissue repair (skin wounds, muscle, tendon, bone, nerves), reduces inflammation and reduces pain wherever the beam is applied. LLLT works predominately on a protein in mitochondria to increase ATP and reduce oxidative stress. A cascade of mitochondrial and intracellular downstream effects lead to improved tissue repair and reduced inflammation. Tons of Pubmed refs.

Here's a good link:
21st Century Medicine Chest - Soft Laser

Big pharma does not want us to know about soft lasers since it would put many pain killers and other meds out of biz.

I was denied health insurance due to a history of asthma and chronic fatigue. I have cured the "incurable" chronic fatigue with the laser, and have gotten into great shape and with a sense of well-being, with the laser. If you're tired but have to do a dangerous drive it will perk you up, you won't get sick so easily.

 

[Yotta]

Maybe it's best someone not pretent to be a medical professional

Wise words.

 

[Yotta]

LLLT works predominately on a protein in mitochondria to increase ATP and reduce oxidative stress. A cascade of mitochondrial and intracellular downstream effects lead to improved tissue repair and reduced inflammation.

Y'know, I actually know what all these words mean. And the way you're using them triggers my BS detector.

Tons of Pubmed refs.

Please provide some.

Here's a good link:
21st Century Medicine Chest - Soft Laser

And that just says "scam" to me.

 

[Lenny33]

We do live in a litigious society and many people trying to do the right thing have been penalized. I agree with you - sad, but true.
Don't confuse somebody with first responder training with somebody trained and qualified to provide epi. First responders get trained to recognize anaphylaxis and assist somebody with a prescribed pen. Doctors, nurses, medics get trained on how the drug works, when it can be dangerous and how to deal with the complications that could arise. Just because people get these pens prescribed, doesn't mean they are harmless. The people that carry these have a medical history free of anything that the epi would aggravate and it can obviously save their life. These people are very different than somebody that you run into on a trail that is THOUGHT to be having an anaphylactic reaction.

While we are mentioning it, don't think that you couldn't get the holy $hit sued out of you for attempting to set a humerus and causing somebody to bleed out because you didn't know what you were doing. Again, sad but true. Good Samaritan laws cover you if you are doing something a sane and logical person would attempt doing in the same conditions. We are talking some iffy areas here.
OK, off the soapbox, I sound like my dad. :deadhorse:

Cheers!

 

[KCcarguy]

We do live in a litigious society and many people trying to do the right thing have been penalized. I agree with you - sad, but true.
Don't confuse somebody with first responder training with somebody trained and qualified to provide epi. First responders get trained to recognize anaphylaxis and assist somebody with a prescribed pen. Doctors, nurses, medics get trained on how the drug works, when it can be dangerous and how to deal with the complications that could arise. Just because people get these pens prescribed, doesn't mean they are harmless. The people that carry these have a medical history free of anything that the epi would aggravate and it can obviously save their life. These people are very different than somebody that you run into on a trail that is THOUGHT to be having an anaphylactic reaction.

While we are mentioning it, don't think that you couldn't get the holy $hit sued out of you for attempting to set a humerus and causing somebody to bleed out because you didn't know what you were doing. Again, sad but true. Good Samaritan laws cover you if you are doing something a sane and logical person would attempt doing in the same conditions. We are talking some iffy areas here.
OK, off the soapbox, I sound like my dad. :deadhorse:

Cheers!

Ok......Good talk. :cheers:

 

[bernardmwrangle]

@kcarguy, just to be clear about the Wilderness First Aid Training, the skills it provides are very limited, basically getting consent, evaluating someone's condition, looking for spinal injuries, stopping major bleeding, trying to prevent shock, and taking good notes so that with a serious injury when the real medical people show up you can communicate to them what is up with the person. My main motivation for doing it was because I lead friends and family into the backcountry, and I want to know the basics of what to do. Regarding the good samaritan laws, as I understand it, once you get involved, if you do something that makes it worse because you exceeded your training and knowledge, you can indeed be on the hook for liability in our over-litigious world. For that reason I would not mess with blood clotting agents or epi pens.

Ok. Good points. Especially the liability.....It's sad that we live in such a litigious society, because it really could save someone's life if needed. I think the problem here is with a kit that extensive, you are the assuming the role of a trained first aid provider. ( BTW, if I'm within 50 yards of the trailhead and not true backcountry, I'm calling 911 and letting the pros handle it) And while we're on that topic, I would also question how good sumaritan laws might apply to first aid in general. Because a kit like that suggests you plan to provide more care than just BLS. For example, I'd argue that you could likely get yourself into more trouble trying to set/ splint/ manipulate a long-bone fracture (sever a vessel or throw an embolus, permanent nerve damage) with that splint set-up you're carrying than you could with an epi-pen. Maybe it's best someone not pretent to be a medical professional and just keep a more basic setup....or just a carry magic laser. :shrug:

 

[WODWorldWide]

While on the subject of survival in the wilderness: Really Big B**bs Should Fill Both Hands.

Assessing trauma: Responsiveness, breathing, bleeding, shock, fractures, burns, head injury

Order based on how likely it is to kill you.

Read this today and figured I'd share.

 

[boodabill]

Y'know, I actually know what all these words mean. And the way you're using them triggers my BS detector.

Please provide some.

And that just says "scam" to me.

Yea, I hear you, sounds too good to be true? That link is not for professionals, they sell the cheaper ones. Here's a pro link
http://www.erchonia.com/low-level-laser-therapy and http://www.thorlaser.com

I'm not trying to sell them!

I did months of research before i bought into the low level lasers. It's not for most people. As a fellow 4Runner brother I can assure you it works. It's a tech just starting to be adopted in the mainstream medical world in the USA. I think it's a good fit for a mobile lifestyle because it's super lightweight and does so much.

LLLT OR Low level laser therapy OR Photobiomodulation - PubMed - NCBI

LLLT inhibitory effects analgesia - PubMed - NCBI

LLLT ATP OR LLLT reactive oxygen species OR LLLT oxidative stress OR P - PubMed - NCBI

 

[py2o3434]

I would not recommend getting a pre-made kit, they are rarely comprehensive enough to justify the price. As you can see from the pics below I use a Pelican 1400 case. I added drawer dividers I got at the container store to the bottom, and a file folder organizer I got at Office Depot to the lid, which is great for storing bandages and other thin stuff.

How much did your first aid kit cost you to put together?

 

[bernardmwrangle]

How much did your first aid kit cost you to put together?

Man that is a good question. It has taken me a couple of years to get it dialed, so, hard to say. Probably a few hundred bucks including the case though? I am not an expert, I just kind of took the kit on as a project and got some training, but most of the kits i looked at were no so hot, wipes and bandaids basically. I just took a look at that Adventure Medical Kits Grizzly kit for $125, that looks really good, seems to have all of the basics. You could probably match the price with a kit of your own if you took the time. I also had a buddy setting his up at the same time, that saved on shipping and made it easier to get boxes of 10 triangular bandages, etc. since we could split them up.

 

[1engineer]

Training. Before you build a kit you should build it based on your training. If you don't have any training then carry band aids and Tylenol. If you are a surgeon then carry a drill and hammer. I have some training and my kit reflects that. No training? Simple kit. Paramedic cert with ACLS? Suture kit and jumper cables lol.

 

[Lenny33]

Training. Before you build a kit you should build it based on your training. If you don't have any training then carry band aids and Tylenol. If you are a surgeon then carry a drill and hammer. I have some training and my kit reflects that. No training? Simple kit. Paramedic cert with ACLS? Suture kit and jumper cables lol.

Whoa there, buddy, easy on the Paramedic cert stuff. I have been a paramedic and trained back country rescuer for ten years and you better hope to heck you have somebody like me around if $hit goes bad in the woods! We are the ones that are trained to deal with emergencies and used to dealing with emergencies in these conditions and not the bright lights and warm sterile field of the ER.

Just out if curiosity, what is your training that makes you so god-like to bag on paramedics?

 

[G8RB8_12SR5]

With two hunting dogs we carry a couple of adventure medical kits, the weekender and the SOL something 3 (I know it's not the technical name.for it). The SOL kit also has survival stuff in it, such as a flint, emergency blanket, duct tape, etc. I also carry a couple of tactical tourniquets, SAM splints, and HALO chest patches and am trained to use them before anyone freaks out. Highly recommend the SAM splints. They're a moldable fiberglass I believe and roll up to about the size of your palm and can be made any shape and length.

 

[Lenny33]

Sam splints are great! Also, good point about flint, emergency blanket, and duct tape. These are in my vehicle at all times. If you have access, flares can also be pretty handy - not only as attention getters, but as fire starters.

 

[Kraeken]

I'm not ALS but do have training in auto injectors, but mainly WMD related stuff. If I remember correctly, if you are administered an Epi Pen for any reason, your day is over. You need to get an ER. Epi only buys you time to get to more epi, or deal with any other complications that may arise. I've never had to use an Epi Pen, but the other auto injectors we use require yearly certification. They will f*ck you up if you don't have the proper training to handle them. Some of those needles will penetrate plywood and squirt the meds out the other side! They should be treated like loaded firearms.

My philosophy with carrying first aid stuff is to be able to handle the most immediate life threatening situations first, and prepare for that.

I was a 911 system EMT for 16 years, and am currently a professional firefighter for 15 years. 95% of the time I am within a half hour of higher level medical care. With my level of training and the stuff I carry, I can provide an appropriate level of care to stabilize most of what is thrown my way until an ambulance shows up or until we can get to an ER. So this is what I keep in my very basic, yet versatile, first aid kit-

Pocket mask with backflow valve
AT LEAST 8-10 pairs of nitrile gloves. You can never have too many gloves
Face shield
Trauma shears
Box knife
Needlenose pliers
Rubbing alcohol
Saline
Bleach
Duct tape
Paper towels
A few plastic bags

I believe this stuff can handle most medical emergencies you may come across on a normal day. However we are civilized, and we want our work to look nice. So I also carry-

A bunch of booboo stuff- 4x4's, 8x10's, a trauma dressing, bandaids, tape, and as much roller gauze as I can stuff in my first aid box. Roller gauze has a ton of uses. I also carry a few triangular bandages, a space blanket, some naproxen, benadryl, and lastly a bulb syringe (you never know when you'll deliver a baby!) It isn't fancy but there isn't too much I can't handle with this stuff.

If I'm going to be really away from civilization, I throw in my real medical bags, which contain more of the above, including splints, an itchy wool blanket, a proper OB kit and more trauma dressings, plus a D tank of O2, a BVM, BP cuff, stethoscope, a proper tourniquet, and a full set of oropharangeal airways.

Did I mention gloves? Always carry a lot of gloves! People are nasty, especially the ones you don't know.

 

[jrandom]

Whoa there, buddy, easy on the Paramedic cert stuff. I have been a paramedic and trained back country rescuer for ten years and you better hope to heck you have somebody like me around if $hit goes bad in the woods! We are the ones that are trained to deal with emergencies and used to dealing with emergencies in these conditions and not the bright lights and warm sterile field of the ER.

Just out if curiosity, what is your training that makes you so god-like to bag on paramedics?

Seriously, I don't think he was bagging on Paramedics, at all. ACLS = jumper cables = AED. Your are reading too much into it.

...and yes I prefer having people like you around I have a good dozen+ friends that are full time FD, ski patrol, ER nurses, Wasatch BC rescue. I feel a lot better knowing that they are around when we are out and about.


It was said already, carry what you know, I am a firm believer in that philosophy. I have band-aids and aspirin. well a few other things too.

 

[KCcarguy]

I'm not ALS but do have training in auto injectors, but mainly WMD related stuff. If I remember correctly, if you are administered an Epi Pen for any reason, your day is over. You need to get an ER. Epi only buys you time to get to more epi, or deal with any other complications that may arise. I've never had to use an Epi Pen, but the other auto injectors we use require yearly certification. They will f*ck you up if you don't have the proper training to handle them. Some of those needles will penetrate plywood and squirt the meds out the other side! They should be treated like loaded firearms.

My philosophy with carrying first aid stuff is to be able to handle the most immediate life threatening situations first, and prepare for that.

I was a 911 system EMT for 16 years, and am currently a professional firefighter for 15 years. 95% of the time I am within a half hour of higher level medical care. With my level of training and the stuff I carry, I can provide an appropriate level of care to stabilize most of what is thrown my way until an ambulance shows up or until we can get to an ER. So this is what I keep in my very basic, yet versatile, first aid kit-

Pocket mask with backflow valve
AT LEAST 8-10 pairs of nitrile gloves. You can never have too many gloves
Face shield
Trauma shears
Box knife
Needlenose pliers
Rubbing alcohol
Saline
Bleach
Duct tape
Paper towels
A few plastic bags

I believe this stuff can handle most medical emergencies you may come across on a normal day. However we are civilized, and we want our work to look nice. So I also carry-

A bunch of booboo stuff- 4x4's, 8x10's, a trauma dressing, bandaids, tape, and as much roller gauze as I can stuff in my first aid box. Roller gauze has a ton of uses. I also carry a few triangular bandages, a space blanket, some naproxen, benadryl, and lastly a bulb syringe (you never know when you'll deliver a baby!) It isn't fancy but there isn't too much I can't handle with this stuff.

If I'm going to be really away from civilization, I throw in my real medical bags, which contain more of the above, including splints, an itchy wool blanket, a proper OB kit and more trauma dressings, plus a D tank of O2, a BVM, BP cuff, stethoscope, a proper tourniquet, and a full set of oropharangeal airways.

Did I mention gloves? Always carry a lot of gloves! People are nasty, especially the ones you don't know.

This is probably the best argument not to carry an epi pen. It is only an initial treatment for anaphylaxis, (but it is also the most important) so that the chain-reaction is stopped early, and followed with other treatments like antihistamines, steroids, etc. It is rare for more than one dose to be used. I still maintain that .3mg of epi is pretty harmless to a person of average or better health. But, you guys are probably right about non-certified people carrying them. It would be terrible if something bad did happen because some weekend-warrior gave the wrong guy some epi. For us trained guys, I still think one (or better two) epi-pens along with antihistamines is very good idea. I'm not experienced in delivering care in the field (I'm a CRNA), but in an isolated setting with, let's say, several hours (hopefully not any longer) before the cavalry comes, I would guess that blood loss and anaphylaxis would be the things most likely to kill someone in the wilderness that could actually be treated, anyway....I'm sure trauma is at the top, but lot a whole lot you can do there (anyone have stats on this?) So, going with [MENTION=66316]1engineer[/MENTION] 's advice, my kit would reflect that.

 

[cuilleree]

Just finished my truck's first aid kit.

I used an old laptop bag to store everything, which is shallow enough to fit in the storage bin I built in the back to level out the sleeping area; if I had to grab it and go, I could.

A lot of my supplies are based on my Wilderness First Aid training and also might come in handy if I were the first person at an accident (though I'm not fooling myself to believe I'm the best person to arrive first at a crash!). Mostly these are things I'd want access to if I had just gotten back to my truck after an "eventful" backpacking trip.

Bandage/Bleeding
--Bandaids (dozens, assorted sizes)
--10 4" gauze rollers
--50 4" sterile gauze sheets for wounds
--4 triangle bandages
--2 Ace bandages (compression wraps)
--adhesive tape
--Eye bandage/pad

Medication
--Ibuprofen
--Benadryl
--Anti-diarrheal
--Aspirin (non-enteric coated)
--After Bite

Other Goodies
--Nitrile gloves
--Sterile saline eye wash/wound flush
--Safety pins (assorted sizes)
--safety scissors
--Sam splint
--2 Instant Cold Compresses
--Alcohol prep pads
--Hand sanitizer
--Sharpie pen
--Small Notepad
--4 Space blankets
--Ziploc freezer bags
--Vaseline
--Moleskin

 

[Ezlife45]

So what do you guys recommend for splinter removal?

I found a good set of tweezers and a magnifying glass work well, but sometimes the splinter is just too deep. The nurse at work uses a hypodermic needle to "dig" out a deep embedded splinter. You will be amazed at how well a needle can get in there to remove a splinter.

 

[Matteblack]

Awesome thread! I took a 30 hour first aid class that addressed massive hemorrhage control and came away wanting this particular item:

CAT Tourniquet

I keep one in the center consul and another in the kit. Buy one to train with and keep the new ones for the real deal. These can be applied with one hand with a little bit of practice.

MB

C-A-T - Combat Application Tourniquet