Will the Tundra brake upgrade reduce 60-0 distance?

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BigDummy

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I am running a nearly stock 4runner. Biggest change my 16" stock wheels with crappy Toyo AT's for 18" off a (Tacoma or 4Runner? I can't remember) Premium with 265 wide Michelin LTX, remains at stock height.

With my bad Toyo's my 60 - 0 averaged ~145' and the ABS would kick on repeatedly during those runs every time. I haven't measured my 60-0 with the Michelin LTX, but the ABS doesn't kick on now. It definitely feels more controlled, not sure it is any shorter, though.

So curious if anyone with a Tundra brake upgrade bothered to measure their 60-0 before and after.
 
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BigDummy said:
I am running a nearly stock 4runner. Biggest change my 16" stock wheels with crappy Toyo AT's for 18" off a (Tacoma or 4Runner? I can't remember) Premium with 265 wide Michelin LTX, remains at stock height.

With my bad Toyo's my 60 - 0 averaged ~145' and the ABS would kick on repeatedly during those runs every time. I haven't measured my 60-0 with the Michelin LTX, but the ABS doesn't kick on now. It definitely feels more controlled, not sure it is any shorter, though.

So curious if anyone with a Tundra brake upgrade bothered to measure their 60-0 before and after.
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The answer is, it depends. A perfectly functioning OEM system will engage the ABS on Dry Pavement at almost any speed. This tells me the tires are your limit until you start outfitting super soft racing tires. Big brakes can theoretically slow the wheels down faster, but it doesn't matter if the tires are garbage and cant grab the road.

So I would say no. The benefit of the Tundra brakes is that the larger rotors/pad area allows the heat to spread out and prevents the rotors from overheating during harder braking. You may notice a descreased stopping distance after Multiple hard braking events, as the brakes would be cooler, and thus more effective at slowing the vehicle down.
 
Just to clarify, old tires (Toyo AT's) could easily break traction, either on acceleration or braking, but especially on braking. New tires (all-season highway Michelin LTX) I have never had break traction on pavement. Because of that, I was thinking the Tundra upgrade may help me at this point.
 
I thought about the Tundra upgrade myself but have opted out. As you know, here in Washington, the roads tend to be a little slick at this time of the year and [MENTION=80102]shadow247[/MENTION] made a super valid point about the age of the tires being a big factor.

I'd recommend siping if anything to increase traction.

The ABS on our 3rd gen would go off if a mouse farted near it so to increase my control I did the "blue wire mod" to disable the ABS on the fly. I believe that the Tundra upgrade would only make the chance of breaking traction greater.

Look at WRC cars, they do not run big brakes (unless on tarmac) specifically so that they don't unnecessarily lose traction.
 
I can't specifically comment on 60-0 times as I have not measured them nor do I know how to do it accurately. But I agree completely about the age, tread style and tread compound comments. When I got my 4Runner it had a set of Cooper's on there that were garbage and I would go skidding into intersections in the rain on a frequent basis because the tires would slip and ABS kick in, not allowing me to stop. New H/T changed all that and it's rock solid on dry pavement and great in wet. ABS has never kicked in unless I hit a big pothole or speedbump.

After I did the TBU ABS has never kicked in either. Stopping power is increased as the bigger pads apply more pressure to the brakes with less brake fluid pressure. The ABS system is a balance of fluid pressure and ABS sensor input (tire slip). While I can't say for certain it would decrease 60-0 times or in my case, 100-0 times (tire choice really does matter much more here) in my real-world experience the brakes are stronger will less force needed on the pedal.
 
Nobody has ever tested this. The cases where people say the TBU decreased stopping distance may have gotten the benefit from the friction material in their new pads and new rotors. The 231's MIGHT, but that caliper also messes with fluid displacement, so people might be claiming wild results from that due to a pedal that only grabs at the very bottom combined with a higher friction pad. Another determining factor is the size of your rear wheel cylinder.

Also 01-02 uses 4 channel ABS vs the 3 channel in 96-00.

With the 199 upgrade, my guess is no, it does not decrease stopping distance when compared side by side to stock larger brakes with the same type of pad and rotor.
 
Honestly most vehicles should have e ought power to lock the wheels, aka abs kicks in, so more braking power won't help.
 
T4R2014 said:
Nobody has ever tested this. The cases where people say the TBU decreased stopping distance may have gotten the benefit from the friction material in their new pads and new rotors. The 231's MIGHT, but that caliper also messes with fluid displacement, so people might be claiming wild results from that due to a pedal that only grabs at the very bottom combined with a higher friction pad. Another determining factor is the size of your rear wheel cylinder.

Also 01-02 uses 4 channel ABS vs the 3 channel in 96-00.

With the 199 upgrade, my guess is no, it does not decrease stopping distance when compared side by side to stock larger brakes with the same type of pad and rotor.
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I saw no noticeable improvement with just the calipers and rotors. Now, when I did the booster and MC? Holy poop. Combine that with soft AT's and no ABS and I can put your nose on the dash if I'm not paying attention. However, I'll concede I don't have hard data to back it up. But I don't see how it wouldn't be shorter. They grab hard. Like, stupid hard.
 
Cree said:
I saw no noticeable improvement with just the calipers and rotors. Now, when I did the booster and MC? Holy poop. Combine that with soft AT's and no ABS and I can put your nose on the dash if I'm not paying attention. However, I'll concede I don't have hard data to back it up. But I don't see how it wouldn't be shorter. They grab hard. Like, stupid hard.
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Do you mean just a new OEM booster and MC or is there a mod to change to a different booster and MC?
 
Doc3g said:
Do you mean just a new OEM booster and MC or is there a mod to change to a different booster and MC?
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I stepped up to a T100 booster and Master. Bumps you up from a 9 3/4 to a 10.5 booster and a 1 inch bore to 1 1/16.
 
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I would also say that apart from a possibly shorter stopping distance, another benefit of greater swept area is an increase in heat dissipation. Which reduces its chances of overheating. Overheated brakes can cause a spongy brake feel with increased stopping distance.

This is most common when going downhill on a mountain road, esp if you're loaded with gear and armor. You can alleviate that by using engine braking and minimizing the use of your brakes, of course. Or pulling over every now and then to let it cool down if you are riding it.
 
I know this topic goes around and around...

I have been running 2x trucks now one with the TBU and one without it, as soon as the truck with the TBU needs any front brake work the TBU is going in the trash. never again will I waste money on it. the brake pedal feel is way different and I hate the TBU. can't wait to get rid of it.
 
sleepydad said:
I know this topic goes around and around...

I have been running 2x trucks now one with the TBU and one without it, as soon as the truck with the TBU needs any front brake work the TBU is going in the trash. never again will I waste money on it. the brake pedal feel is way different and I hate the TBU. can't wait to get rid of it.
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It's so odd how some users, like me, could not be happier on the upgrade. And then others, like you, do the exact same thing, same bleeding techniques and have a very soft pedal feel and makes it worse. There's a variable here that I am not seeing that's affecting this swap.
 
gamefreakgc said:
It's so odd how some users, like me, could not be happier on the upgrade. And then others, like you, do the exact same thing, same bleeding techniques and have a very soft pedal feel and makes it worse. There's a variable here that I am not seeing that's affecting this swap.
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I wish I knew because I have had the same results on 2x trucks. TBU pedal feels ded to me, it's like a brick with no feedback as if the entire braking system is failing... sinking and the brakes are dying. the harder you press the less braking your getting and your going to hit something.

the same truck with stock caliper/toyota rotor and same Toyota ceramic type of pads brakes feel smooth and responsive with excellent feedback and ample braking with little or no extra effort required.

I don't know I wish I knew what the difference was? I just feel like I have complete control with the stock calipers vs this truck is going to kill me with TBU sinking pedal of death.

I would even say the brakes on my land rover work better than the TBU setup.
 
Bad Luck said:
Did you ABS delete because of the T100 master not working well with the ABS system?
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Yes and no. I bought it with a bad wheel speed sensor. I replaced it with a good sensor and the whole system did weird things. Went from not working at all to picking the most random times to work. It did get worse when I upgraded. It engage almost immediately and then release and work normally, so I just pulled the fuse. I *think* my right rear axle seal leaks a bit and that drum grabs a little harder than the other side. Increased the pressure, increased the problem, but I don't care enough to figure out if that was it. Always hated the ABS on these things anyway. I used ABS compatible parts though.
 
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