Wow! Expedition Overland

[Jetboy]

Watched the overlander 1.


So cringe worthy. Just everything. Sitting around a table with a map discussing what our next camping trip is going to be. The packing. Shooting with sunglasses on. You name it. It's hilariously phony. It's almost a spoof of what people who go camping and shooting actually do.

If you've never done this before - the videos are nothing at all like what real people do when they live in Montana and go camping/shooting.

I think the key here is that the audience is not people who actually do this stuff. We're all laughing at it. The audience is someone who's never done it and doesn't know the difference. For that group it probably seems legit. And that group is a lot bigger. So I guess the idea is shoot for the larger audience.

 

[cruiseroutfit]

yeah. ouch, is that really the only kind of videos they have planned?

Please make more like the original north american videos, the morrison jeep trail was great
https://www.xoverland.com/videos/north-american/

No, we will be doing more trips around the western US as the weather warms up.

 

[cruiseroutfit]

Finally figured out what to do with the YouTube thingy on my TV so watched the entire South America series. I didn’t think it was possible but I actually learned absolutely nothing useful in the event I would ever make a similar trip – which in itself is an amazing feat. I was also left wondering how much faster the trip would have been had they not spent soooo much time setting up for the visual shots, which were brilliantly done.

The metaphysical pronouncements on the Zen nature of the experience were annoying at the start but ended up to being quite amusing when all was said and done. But at least they had the women do the cooking and cleaning so not all was lost.

I have added the channel to my list and I do look forward to watching some other episodes. But I do have a soft spot for over the top branding by people driving vastly over-equipped vehicles while taking themselves waaaay too seriously.

Keep up the good work, guys. Fan for life here! :bravo:

Lol

What other continents do you already know everything about, I'll hit you up for trip suggestions

 

[cruiseroutfit]

Watched the overlander 1.

So cringe worthy. Just everything. Sitting around a table with a map discussing what our next camping trip is going to be. The packing. Shooting with sunglasses on. You name it. It's hilariously phony. It's almost a spoof of what people who go camping and shooting actually do.

If you've never done this before - the videos are nothing at all like what real people do when they live in Montana and go camping/shooting.

I think the key here is that the audience is not people who actually do this stuff. We're all laughing at it. The audience is someone who's never done it and doesn't know the difference. For that group it probably seems legit. And that group is a lot bigger. So I guess the idea is shoot for the larger audience.

I shoot a few hundred rounds on a given month with my sunglasses on, am I doing it wrong?

 

[cruiseroutfit]

Hardly a broken record. And I’ve provided professional feedback.

However if the tone of every response is going to just be you guys being defensive then it’s pretty clear the only comments that matter are glowing praise.

Kurt I think you’re the smartest of the bunch and nothing but respect for you. You’re right I don’t care much for the show and it’s totally lost what I originally liked about it. I’ve said as much. But as a professional I respond to criticism on a daily basis and get better as a result.

I wish you guys the best. I just feel a lot has been lost along the way.

Forgive me as I don't actually know what you do for a living but I'm assuming it's something in the YouTube content creation realm? Graphics? Just curious really, you're certainly far more connected to the production industry than I am.

Look, as I've said ad naseum I get that there is a segment of old school viewers that prefer the original seasons or trips like McKenzie Trail, but those seasons were/are simply not financially viable. They offered less/little ROI for sponsors on the level we are dealing with now. Outside of a pure indulgence, there would be no incentive to go back to that style of trip. Does that mean we/they make some decisions based on sponsor feedback or desire? Of course... that is exactly how business of all variety work and this is no different. Fortunately we have a ton of fun when we are on these trips and I am humbled and thankful to have that opportunity and make a little scratch in the meantime.

You're assuming that just because your comments are not being 100% heeded that only "glowing" reviews are being noted, hardly the case. We originally planned another international season this year but massive user feedback wanted more stateside adventure and interaction, thus we'll be at more US events this season than any other. We'll be doing 3-5 trips around the west with and without sponsors along. I go to many of the same events anyway so it's not much of a change for me other than we don't get to go somewhere out of the country for a bit but I'll survive




To all, I'm making notes from input/comments on this thread just as I've done for the other XO threads here on this forum and the half dozen others I'm fairly active in. I'll be honest that I've spent many hours browsing back through older XO threads here and elsewhere. When one is often stuck in a car for hundreds of hours at a time it makes for entertaining and informative reading. I'm a fairly thick-skinned fellow and am happy to converse about the highlights and lowlights of the series for you. I'm not interested in having the same dialogue with the same person over and over but if you are or were a regular viewer or new to the show, my ears are open.

 

[TexasTJ]

Kind of like you're saying, I think it would be cool to see the other countries that I will never see, but even cooler to be like "Hey I've been there, or hey I will go there some day." Running trails like Black Bear/Imogene, and other trails in CO, or the Rubicon Trail, etc.

 

[phillyd2]

Lol

What other continents do you already know everything about, I'll hit you up for trip suggestions

Been to all but Antarctica so feel free to ask. Unlike the Vid series I would even share some useful bits of information. But my pictures won’t be as pretty so pick your poison.

 

[cruiseroutfit]

Been to all but Antarctica so feel free to ask. Unlike the Vid series I would even share some useful bits of information. But my pictures won’t be as pretty so pick your poison.

You've driven across all? Blog or website on your travels? I'd love to read more. Antarctica is the final continent I aspire to cross, ironically it is also the most expensive Looking at ways to work my way across in the next year or two. Perhaps Arctic Trucks needs a w/s washer on their polar expeditions?

 

[Xhado]

I shoot a few hundred rounds on a given month with my sunglasses on, am I doing it wrong?

Serious shooters do not. The extra lens between the eye and the scope can become problematic.

Most average shooters won't notice the difference however.

 

[phillyd2]

You've driven across all? Blog or website on your travels? I'd love to read more. Antarctica is the final continent I aspire to cross, ironically it is also the most expensive Looking at ways to work my way across in the next year or two. Perhaps Arctic Trucks needs a w/s washer on their polar expeditions?

No blog. But don't wear a skirt either so that would explain why.

The point, which you seem to take great efforts to avoid, is that you guys have the trucks. The gear. Lots of gear. And are actually making the journey. So, why not dial down the self important egos and offer some practical and useful information about that journey?

In all honesty, I was really looking forward to watching it. No joke. I took the effort, well not that much effort, to get through all of the episodes only to find a vanity fluff series narrated by what I guess is a frustrated wannabe writer trying to be oh so profound in every sentence. I have friends working on cures for cancer who don't take themselves half as seriously.

Edit. Which one are you?

 

[cruiseroutfit]

Serious shooters do not. The extra lens between the eye and the scope can become problematic.

Most average shooters won't notice the difference however.

Average shooter would be a compliment for me, I don't aspire to change that anytime soon.

When it's a crazy bright reflective snow day, how in the hell does the serious crowd stare down range for so long? I'd rather tack weld with my eyes open

 

[LawnDart]

Forgive me as I don't actually know what you do for a living but I'm assuming it's something in the YouTube content creation realm? Graphics? Just curious really, you're certainly far more connected to the production industry than I am.

Kurt, I wear a couple of hats, but I'd be happy to give some background on what I do for a living. And please know that a lot of what I work on involves NDAs, so the cheekiness is purely because I can't outright say "I work on this thing."

But I'm a freelance commercial/narrative editor (starting a big netflix documentary this summer), so I have cut a metric ton of big national commercials. I have a background in editing, and animation, so I typically am called in on jobs that involve a marriage of the two on post-production (mostly TV). I have recently worked on a show involving cowboys for a network that "Isn't TV it's something something something." But since 2004 I'm either behind the edit bay, or when I'm lucky I get to heft a camera around.

Generally speaking I'm the guy who provides feedback to others on projects, INCLUDING the stuff *I* make, no one is spared. I'm my toughest critic. There's a reason why people in my industry, myself included, drink heavily and deal with high functioning depression. So please know that my comments are generally* laced with actionable feedback. If I didn't think the show could be improved I wouldn't have even commented. Trust me I run off a mixture of coffee, apathy, and obsessive detail orientation.

So without writing a tome here, I think what people are trying to articulate (to varying degrees of success) is a bridging the gap between big season long trips that for MOST people are just way outside of what they could either afford in time or cost, and the tiny episodes of the early series. Look, I have a 4Runner that makes Rufio/Apollo look positively tame, and yet even I'm wincing when I see some of these rigs stuffed with so much stuff it's absurd. And I totally understand that appeals to the 'gear porn' part of why people love the outdoor industry. I totally get that. But I'd love to see you guys actually capitalize on that, and make episodes where you strip the vehicles way down, and do trips like the Mojave Road, Utah Traverse, San Juans, etc, from the perspective of "Here's all this gear we normally bring, but here's the basics, and here's the minimum of what you need to explore what is in your backyard" so to speak.

As an example, Top Gear was great when it was hooning supercars, but also bringing that same level of storytelling to a Reliant Robin or Ford Fiesta. You guys are obviously influencers for a lot of people, I've said it before the XO 4Runners were a big inspiration before I went nuts and slingshotted past those builds. And using that influence to show people what's close to them is in many ways a reaffirmation about all the incredible trails we have here in the united states. And as a result could help spur on people to fight to preserve those trails in the face of groups trying to shut them down.

I understand the push/pull of corporate gigs, especially automotive. I guess my point being is that there's a line to walk. I totally get that. I'm also not the dude who's on the youtube comment section hammering out "YOU GUYZ SUK." And I'll be happy to try to post articulate feedback. I'm an A-hole, but I'm an articulate A-hole.

*ratio not guaranteed.

 

[cruiseroutfit]

No blog. But don't wear a skirt either so that would explain why.

Then certainly a guy that's driven across 6 continents has a website? Magazine articles? Hell a photo album I can admire? All too mainstream for you I'm sure?

The point, which you seem to take great efforts to avoid, is that you guys have the trucks. The gear. Lots of gear. And are actually making the journey. So, why not dial down the self important egos and offer some practical and useful information about that journey?

Self important? I'm sorry you didn't find any useful info but I've heard from many that have. A handful of groups followed our tracks across the McKenzie Trail using our info as a beta source. Are you too self-important to share the info you've learned traversing 6 continents? That is a feat very very few can say they've accomplished, myself included and we all should be learning from your experiences.

In all honesty, I was really looking forward to watching it. No joke. I took the effort, well not that much effort, to get through all of the episodes only to find a vanity fluff series narrated by what I guess is a frustrated wannabe writer trying to be oh so profound in every sentence. I have friends working on cures for cancer who don't take themselves half as seriously.

Edit. Which one are you?

Ouch! Well fortunately not Clay given your critique lol

I'm Kurt. I'm the only non-Montanite in the group. Show comments will yield the fact I talk too much, am obese, suck at Spanish, am a know-it-all, need a haircut, know nothing about spotting, know nothing about recovery, know nothing about Mayan ruins and know nothing about chainsaws. They're right

 

[cruiseroutfit]

Kurt, I wear a couple of hats, but I'd be happy to give some background on what I do for a living. And please know that a lot of what I work on involves NDAs, so the cheekiness is purely because I can't outright say "I work on this thing."

But I'm a freelance commercial/narrative editor (starting a big netflix documentary this summer), so I have cut a metric ton of big national commercials. I have a background in editing, and animation, so I typically am called in on jobs that involve a marriage of the two on post-production (mostly TV). I have recently worked on a show involving cowboys for a network that "Isn't TV it's something something something." But since 2004 I'm either behind the edit bay, or when I'm lucky I get to heft a camera around...

Awesome, that provides a great deal of clarity... the more you know.

There are a ton of things I would change if I had ultimate say, but I don't and the shows continued success (like it or not the analytics that matter are growing ) is a reflection of that. My show would spent 50% of the time focusing on the history of areas, mines, outlaws and ghost towns and would require 2x or more time on the ground for each trip. Thus 2x as much budget so there is that.

Of course if I got to call the shots we'd have hovercrafts, heli refuels, barges and be driving across the Darien Gap right now with a small platoon of FARC Cruiserheads as our security, all while filming on a Samsung Galaxy just to save more time/space If you know anyone looking to fund that I'll do it however you tell me, hell you can be the narrator or we can get Mike Rowe!

 

[dot_tom]

No blog. But don't wear a skirt either so that would explain why.

The point, which you seem to take great efforts to avoid, is that you guys have the trucks. The gear. Lots of gear. And are actually making the journey. So, why not dial down the self important egos and offer some practical and useful information about that journey?

In all honesty, I was really looking forward to watching it. No joke. I took the effort, well not that much effort, to get through all of the episodes only to find a vanity fluff series narrated by what I guess is a frustrated wannabe writer trying to be oh so profound in every sentence. I have friends working on cures for cancer who don't take themselves half as seriously.

Edit. Which one are you?

hahaha I got a good laugh at this. Explains exactly how I feel when clay talks/narrates. Dude is wayyyyyy too serious and full of himself. Lawndart commented one time about this show being self-narrated is a big downfall. Clay and the team pick and choose exactly what needs to be shown and how it is presented takes a bit from the show.

I would like to see trips in the US. I enjoy watching these other places but that will never be me. I want to see XO production on US trips in CO, WA, AZ or anything realistic in the US. It would be awesome to see a trip you guys plan and say "hey, I'm going to do that also." and be able to. Use your video as a way to plan and get excited about a trip I can take.

 

[Jetboy]

Hopefully this is a little more constructive feedback,

As far as shooting goes. Sunglasses are not necessary. You'll never get enough light through a scope unless you're looking directly at the sun. It's just the nature of how a telescope only captures a very small amount of light. My guess is that the filmed shot wasn't actually looking through the scope. Kinda like why you'll never see someone using sun glasses with binoculars.

Also you probably wouldn't shoot off the bed of a truck with another person or two rocking it. Typically you'd be on the ground or on a shooting bench for long range target shooting. You've got enough shit packed in and strapped on those vehicles that there's got to be two or three shooting benches somewhere.

Finally - you've got the wrong gun. A 308 is certainly possible in very capable hands to shoot a target at 750yds. But it's not a good choice for that task. Especially when you're using a $900 magpul stock and probably a $2k scope - why not choose a proper rifle to put between them? The .308 just isn't a good design for long range use. It shoots a bullet that's too short for good ballistics and too slow. A 300 Win Mag would be marginally more expensive but can shoot a much longer profile bullet in the same bore at a faster velocity meaning it has far better long range potential. It would probably drop half or less at that distance. A .308 is going to have somewhere in the range of 100 inches of drop by that distance. So all the other stuff probably doesn't matter anyway because it's going to be so far off that it would be just dumb luck to hit a target. And that's why it looks so phony to anyone who's done it before. Anemometers and big spotting scopes, but shooting a .308. All hat, no cows.

My real guess here is that it was a way to show off some magpul products as an advertisement. So then it ended up being a pretend long range shooting event. When in reality it was more like - bring what you got and lets have fun target shooting. But the video edit takes it seriously. And it's being done all wrong for serious shooting. So it's a mismatch between the editing and the reality of what's probably happening.

As far as the offroad/camping stuff, a few clips that could really help make an episode like that would be an explanation of the weight of the vehicles and why that's hurting them in the snow. It might help to even do a side by side with a stock 4runner to show how difference it makes to have 2000lbs less gear on it. It would be interesting to see some discussion of airing down for deep snow and how 5psi can work wonders - after the random maxtrax pitch of course. Other things like having siped mud tires and how much better they are than unsiped ones. Since the trucks don't have beadlocks - show how to reseat a bead in the field - with a ratchet strap - and why high volume compressors and/or air tanks are really useful for some tasks like that. Show why hitting the throttle is usually the wrong choice in deep snow when you start to dig in.

There's a lot of snow driving techniques that I didn't see being used at all. I'm not sure if it's due to lack of experience or because it didn't make the cut. But a lot of those things could be make it more interesting for people who are interested, but have never done it before.

For other episodes - quit pretending that driving around where other people live is really dangerous or difficult. People live in those places and drive the roads every day in old beat to shit vehicles. They seem to do just fine. What would be useful information is things like where to go for good local information. Thorn tree forum for example. Or why having a lonely planet book can be a life saver when you're in the middle of unknown road and need a place to stay. For most American's it's uncomfortable to not have a plan for a place to stay before going on a trip. In most of the world it's normal practice to show up and find a spot to stay the day of. How to read a BLM map and identify legal and illegal roads. Why the Delorme Atlas and Gazetteer is so useful for travel in the remote parts of the USA.

Good luck!

 

[cruiseroutfit]

Great feedback. Fwiw we've covered airing down in several episodes over the years. I've personally covered how we navigate and the books and apps we use to find our destinations and camp a few different times too. Those are all certainly something we can highlight again on the series from time to time and we've had a lot of inquiries about our mapping and planning process at realtime presentations, it deserves a bit more Series coverage imo.

Fwiw: Oh Hey There episodes https://youtu.be/cn_rLbtpCdw

As for rounds to shoot, I'm not going to even enter that realm... I was there shooting 7mm WM as it's the rifle I had, there were 4-5 calibers present. Ty, Ryan and several others do a ton shooting so I'm hardly in a position to tell them what to shoot. Hardly un-authentic however as that is simply what they've chosen to shoot. None of those guns or gear were acquired for that trip, it's all stuff we've taken out to the ranch a dozen times before hunting coyotes or plinking. Can a "gun-guy" find fault in our approach, sure... doesn't make it false or staged, it wasn't.

Fwiw we spent the entire day shooting off the back of the truck with success out to 1000 with a 308, repeatable dumb luck I suppose. With my 7mm I was happy at the 500 mark lol The suspension on that truck doesn't move quite like a Toyota.

 

[Jetboy]

That's the type of info that would make the videos more interesting. But I'd suggest actually showing the difference it makes rather than a discussion in a shop with some clips that don't necessarily relate. (For example in the video you linked about airing down, it shows a Tacoma with tire chains on. Are you airing down with tire chains on? It's one or the other. Chains don't stay on aired down tires very well - if you're aired down to somewhere near the limit of how low you can go.) Airing down for snow is often a lot different than rocks. Typically on the rocks in a 4runner you'd be around 15-18psi. For snow I'd go way lower. Going from 15 to 10psi and again from 10 to 5psi can make huge differences in snow.

And it may be worth noting that it's important to recognize that the bumpers and racks and such all add some utility in one form but also have significant costs in terms of lesser capability in the more difficult off road scenarios. Nowhere is that more important than in deep snow.

 

[greatape]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CaUNDkv-MiA

Very nice job on this Kurt, hope you all make it out to Reeb ranch this fall

 

[c10bonanza]

XO is what first turned me on to 4Runners. I’m a fan because of that.

As most have said, the early episodes were excellent. More recently, meh. Don’t get me wrong, they are still largely enjoyable to watch, but I’m more inclined to fast forward through them now. The guys were hungry for adventure in the early days. Now, it feels like they are at a J-O-B they merely tolerate.

Perhaps there is a happy medium somewhere. Film some spots and please the sponsors, but also throw-back to your roots and satisfy the base now and then. Or, innovate and figure out a new way to do both at the same time. Break the mold! Regardless, I think it’s awesome the XO crew has figured out a way to earn a living doing what most of us dream of while sitting at a desk. Kudos for that!

Oh, and Clay is probably the nicest, most genuine guy in the world. But his narration and on-camera “I’m the expedition leader” persona makes him seem like a real douche. The show, IMO, would improve exponentially if he could dial it down from 11 to an 8 or so.