LDForget
New member
It really depends on the vehicle. 08ish avalanches for example are so restricted in the exhaust manifolds its re****ed. Good headers with a tune can net you over 20 hp in most of the range! Stupid GM...
wow, TRD Headers are hard to find!!
- Thread starter jblazy18
- Start date
It really depends on the vehicle. 08ish avalanches for example are so restricted in the exhaust manifolds its re****ed. Good headers with a tune can net you over 20 hp in most of the range! Stupid GM...
RonMAIDEN
Super Moderator
Look at the dyno,those gains are barely 4-5whp by 3000rpm and the bigger gains aren't till over 4000rpm and even if you took it to the strip and drag raced it those headers will not make a noticeable diff but some people like dyno sheets but those don't net real world gains you'd see. Now if you are SC'D then it's going to be a little different but with a 3.4 NA motor I'd find it hard to justfy the high cost of headers plus the exhaust cost becomes one of the worst bang for the buck mods.
IMO you really need to analyze if you are truly going to benefit from a set of headers unless you got money to blow and feel the need to have headers to show off otherwise there's better ways to spend your money.
IMO you really need to analyze if you are truly going to benefit from a set of headers unless you got money to blow and feel the need to have headers to show off otherwise there's better ways to spend your money.
Dous
New member
I dunno pair the headers with a nice throttle body spacer and the thing would be like a race car :banana:
THEREALTOR1
New member
vroom-vrooooom....
j/kGood luck to the OP, hope he finds what he's looking for and please do keep this thread alive if you would. Whoever said that its difficult to get info, is kind of onto something, I mean its there just requires some looking, but it would be nice to have more threads 40 - 50 posts deep with some solid info, rather than 5 or 10 threads with 1 questions, 1 decent answer, and 13 OT's, or wisecracks, or something completely not what your looking for. So yeah, good luck and keep us up to date on how its going, would love to see a write up on something if you get the time and can take some pics.
BrianSD_42
New member
I have downey headers. I only added them because everything was already dissassembled due to my cracked head issues.
the great him
Elite Member
heres my point of view, our motors are so lacking on the power from the start that any little bit helps. its a one time mod that will last, and doesnt require other mods to make it work(ie premium fuel, fuel upgrades ect) now yes you will really see a more noticeable gain with an SC, but i think you will be able to feel the difference in the power personally. i know when redid my exhaust a couple weeks back, i have now noticed a power increase, from about 35pmh on up i have better throttle response and much faster and easier acceleration. freeway passing is now much easier and mileage has significantly increased. putting a set of headers on will net around 8hp(max) per that chart, and 3-5hp of that will be useable most of the time, that along with increased tq. the mod is worth doing if you ask me. i put a set of headers on one of my 22re's and i noticed a power gain. our motors need all the help they can get if you ask me. yes an SC would be ideal but its a big chunk of change, and its gonna be addictive. once you get the boost you will want more, and more boost = fuel upgrades, electronics ect, and then the cost really starts to climb and for some of us that can be a big factor. but doing things like a full exhaust and a higher flow air filter, making the engine breath better all around will do wonders for any vehicle.
-back in the late 60s GM along with holley took a 327 corvette and worked with it only doing intake and exhaust, the car ended up making almost 600hp on pump gas, and no internal modifications. all they did was get the car to breath right
-back in the late 60s GM along with holley took a 327 corvette and worked with it only doing intake and exhaust, the car ended up making almost 600hp on pump gas, and no internal modifications. all they did was get the car to breath right
RonMAIDEN
Super Moderator
Ok,if you're going to throw a crazy HP number on a Vette you gotta provide a link since I bet there's more to it then an exhaust and intake.
You say your truck is "much faster and easier acceleration" well define faster,is it truly quicker or is your exhaust sound louder? Unless you're unleashing 20whp by replacing your exhaust it simply can't be quicker with just a 3-5whp gain.
"mileage has significantly increased" - by how much? 1-2mpg? That's not significant and if it's more you'd it would be in the minority.
I spent alot of time at the dragstrip with people that did these upgrades on headers and exhaust on various cars and unless the engine is really restricted or forced induction simple exhaust mods net very minimal gains and I've seen it over and over with my two eyes.
If money is a factor then save $3k for a proper SC setup (it can be done for under $2k) and gain 60whp (headers not needed) right off the bat vs spending $1000-1300 on headers,intake and exhaust and netting 10-15whp;the math still adds up in favor of the SC but some people are impatient with modding and like multiple cheap mods vs the better in the long run mods.
I would love to have around 230-240whp in my truck as it would transform everything from a power standpoint but I realize what my truck is and what I use it for and can't justify adding a few grand into it at this stage and exhaust mods aren't going to change my truck except how it would sound more than power I'd feel.
Not trying to be an ass so hopefully my tone doesn't come off that way and am just enjoying a friendly debate.
Evilmunkey
New member
the Thorley's weren't too bad on price when I found 'em. . looks like I'm putting them on my list to get along w/ my TRD Cat-Back
BrianSD_42
New member
If you already have the truck disassembled and can find the headers for $400 (like I did) then it is great value and the extra torque is noticeable.
the great him
Elite Member
Ok,if you're going to throw a crazy HP number on a Vette you gotta provide a link since I bet there's more to it then an exhaust and intake.
You say your truck is "much faster and easier acceleration" well define faster,is it truly quicker or is your exhaust sound louder? Unless you're unleashing 20whp by replacing your exhaust it simply can't be quicker with just a 3-5whp gain.
"mileage has significantly increased" - by how much? 1-2mpg? That's not significant and if it's more you'd it would be in the minority.
I spent alot of time at the dragstrip with people that did these upgrades on headers and exhaust on various cars and unless the engine is really restricted or forced induction simple exhaust mods net very minimal gains and I've seen it over and over with my two eyes.
If money is a factor then save $3k for a proper SC setup (it can be done for under $2k) and gain 60whp (headers not needed) right off the bat vs spending $1000-1300 on headers,intake and exhaust and netting 10-15whp;the math still adds up in favor of the SC but some people are impatient with modding and like multiple cheap mods vs the better in the long run mods.
I would love to have around 230-240whp in my truck as it would transform everything from a power standpoint but I realize what my truck is and what I use it for and can't justify adding a few grand into it at this stage and exhaust mods aren't going to change my truck except how it would sound more than power I'd feel.
Not trying to be an ass so hopefully my tone doesn't come off that way and am just enjoying a friendly debate.
dude im not gonna start an argument here with you, i will simply say this and leave it at that. i know my vehicle and know when things change. yes its a little louder(i dont like that, and most of the time i have the windows up and radio on, so blaaa to your its just louder coment/question, i have gained 2-3mpg if im easy with it like i normally am, and about 1-2 if i get in it a little now and then, and do like 70 on the freeway(normally do like 60). it acclerates much quicker on the freeway with less effort. and while i dont have any times to back that up with, i think i know better than you how my truck runs and drives. i dont know where you are pulling out the number of $1000-1300 for headers and exhaust. i just redid my exhaust for like $60(yes i did all the work myself so that saved a lot), but headers are only like $400-500 for high end ones
i can not argue that the SC will not make more power, but that will start to add up fast in the cost factor no matter how you look at it.
i dont have a link to what GM and Holley did, cause it was back in the late 60's... no internet back then, and i read this in an old super chevy magazine about ten years ago, so i dont know where to find it now sorry.
you say you have spent time with guys at the drag strip... do you even own a drag car or race car of any type? i do, while right now it sitting on the side of my house because i blew the motor, and so i have not touched it in a couple years, im not idiot when it comes to finding ways to make power in a car and making it competitive... my malibu was running low 12s on street tires with a motor i built for under $3500, and it was 100% street legal and a daily driver for me. simply getting a motor to "breath" right will do wonders for any car. if you dont start there everything else is a waste and not able to be used to its fullest, and in some cased not even affective at all.
all you guys who continually bash headers and exhausts, and keep saying how much CAI do ect are simply showing how much you dont know. you have probably never actually worked with them or done side by side(or any type of actually in person for that mater) comparisons yourself.
doing headers and free flowing exhaust will give you power and will be done for far less than an SC. when it comes time to SC the rig(if you chose too) you are already set up and in place to get more bang for you buck, and if you do that with the addition of the 7th injector and URD kit ect you will see the greatest results.
bottom line headers will yield a noticeable power/efficiency gain across the board, and are much cheaper than an SC.
RonMAIDEN
Super Moderator
Boy,some people are poor debaters and can't back anything up with facts and that's all I was asking. I wasn't trying to antagonize you so please chill out a bit and let the debate continue since what you say isn't the last word. I did say I was just having a friendly debate and you must have missed that. Sorry.
Oh yes,I did spend over a decade racing a '93 Eclipse that started out with 195hp and ended up with over 400 crankhorse and never opened up my 122ci engine and it ran 12.9@106 up here at 5800ft and down in Texas it turned low 12s consistently on all seasons thanks in part to my AWD. Dropped about 3 seconds of it's stock 1/4 mile time for a few thousand bucks and most of that was for an ACT 2600 clutch otherwise it was just a bigger turbo fuel pump,more boost and exhaust but that's expected on most forced induction cars and trucks.
Mine was also a daily driver sun,snow or shine and had A/C and power everything,nothing was compromised for the sake of weight.
And now I drive this with 305hp out of the box and the ECU can be reflashed for a little more on higher octane gas. Should see high 13s up here at the same 5800ft my Eclipse saw.
Yes some mods can be done cheap but for the most part headers installed will be about $600 and a new catback will run you $300-500 so yes a $1000 is a realistic price. Doing it yourself is cool and saves a buttload of money but my price guesstimates were for the average 4Runner owner on here and I see what people spend on these mods.
Oh yes,I did spend over a decade racing a '93 Eclipse that started out with 195hp and ended up with over 400 crankhorse and never opened up my 122ci engine and it ran 12.9@106 up here at 5800ft and down in Texas it turned low 12s consistently on all seasons thanks in part to my AWD. Dropped about 3 seconds of it's stock 1/4 mile time for a few thousand bucks and most of that was for an ACT 2600 clutch otherwise it was just a bigger turbo fuel pump,more boost and exhaust but that's expected on most forced induction cars and trucks.
Mine was also a daily driver sun,snow or shine and had A/C and power everything,nothing was compromised for the sake of weight.
And now I drive this with 305hp out of the box and the ECU can be reflashed for a little more on higher octane gas. Should see high 13s up here at the same 5800ft my Eclipse saw.
Yes some mods can be done cheap but for the most part headers installed will be about $600 and a new catback will run you $300-500 so yes a $1000 is a realistic price. Doing it yourself is cool and saves a buttload of money but my price guesstimates were for the average 4Runner owner on here and I see what people spend on these mods.
the great him
Elite Member
if you dont like headers then thats fine, dont F*cking buy them, but dont go around telling people that they are a waste and or worthless... because they are not and you of all people should know better...
-and sorry it was a typo, i ment a 427, not 327. -yes i would agree that 600ho out of a SBC with out internal mods is unrealistic.
-and sorry it was a typo, i ment a 427, not 327. -yes i would agree that 600ho out of a SBC with out internal mods is unrealistic.
wow.. i was just saying how hard it was to find trd headers.. lol.. an it turned into a debate.. anyway i will definitley keep you guys updated as soon as i make the purchases
the kid- im more on your side.. im into late model LS motors as ive worked with LS1's allot.. LS6's LS2's theyre all the same family.. never wanted to dab into the supercharger route cause really getting your full potential out of supercharger adds up really quick.. and as you probably know, whenever you start putting modifications on.. you have to have a goal.. whether it it be a hp goal, mpg goal, torque goal.. whatever....
Now.. im not looking to make my 4runner fast, its a family suv and a daily driver, while adding headers and an exhaust will give me more hp.. im actually looking to get more mpg's out of this thing.. i know.. why dont i go buy a prius.. plain and simple, because i dont want a prius.. i love my runner so im gunna play around with it by modding it. As far as price.. im gunna try out those OBX headers that come with the y pipe for $300 on ebay, and a 50 series 842450 flowmaster muffler off ebay for $105. and probably a hi-flow cat for around $90.. and ill just have the piping bent at the auto shop down the street from me.. i wont even come close to $1300... everything will be new too...
RonMaiden - i would understand your point IF i was looking to gain some serious HP out of this.. im not.. im completley fine with the little that i am going to gain.. and my thought is if theres something to gain then why not.. to say headers and exhaust are cheap mods is just silly
the kid- im more on your side.. im into late model LS motors as ive worked with LS1's allot.. LS6's LS2's theyre all the same family.. never wanted to dab into the supercharger route cause really getting your full potential out of supercharger adds up really quick.. and as you probably know, whenever you start putting modifications on.. you have to have a goal.. whether it it be a hp goal, mpg goal, torque goal.. whatever....
Now.. im not looking to make my 4runner fast, its a family suv and a daily driver, while adding headers and an exhaust will give me more hp.. im actually looking to get more mpg's out of this thing.. i know.. why dont i go buy a prius.. plain and simple, because i dont want a prius.. i love my runner so im gunna play around with it by modding it. As far as price.. im gunna try out those OBX headers that come with the y pipe for $300 on ebay, and a 50 series 842450 flowmaster muffler off ebay for $105. and probably a hi-flow cat for around $90.. and ill just have the piping bent at the auto shop down the street from me.. i wont even come close to $1300... everything will be new too...
RonMaiden - i would understand your point IF i was looking to gain some serious HP out of this.. im not.. im completley fine with the little that i am going to gain.. and my thought is if theres something to gain then why not.. to say headers and exhaust are cheap mods is just silly
RonMAIDEN
Super Moderator
I'm telling people facts so they can make an educated decision and don't put words in my mouth if you can't quote my posts. I didn't say they were worthless and a waste,I just stated the HP gains weren't that great for the cost (especially on the subject vehicle which is the topic here) and that's a fact compared to an SC and I know these things from experience from working on and racing cars for the last 25 years since my mid teens.
And take a pill since you don't need to be so angry over somebody's opinion since other members can make the choice themselves referencing all of our posts but being butthurt isn't productive.
Now back to your regulary scheduled thread.
And take a pill since you don't need to be so angry over somebody's opinion since other members can make the choice themselves referencing all of our posts but being butthurt isn't productive.
Now back to your regulary scheduled thread.
BrianSD_42
New member
jblazy18, sorry if this has already been asked but do you plan on doing the work yourself or paying for it?
Because I agree that it probably isn't a good investment of $1000 - $1200 to have DT headers installed but if you could get a set cheaper and do the work yourself, you might be pleased with the results.
I also have a K&N CAI and full cat back exhaust.
Because I agree that it probably isn't a good investment of $1000 - $1200 to have DT headers installed but if you could get a set cheaper and do the work yourself, you might be pleased with the results.
I also have a K&N CAI and full cat back exhaust.
RonMAIDEN
Super Moderator
Sorry,my debating side came out and I like facts to be presented so people can make an educated desicion and not based on opinions.
Yes,some headers are cheap but I've seen cheap headers (what do Doug Thorley's cost?) crack easily and installing them on a 3rd gen is quite a job and most shops will charge about $300 to install since it's labor intensive so cheaper headers installed is still going to cost the average owner over $600 when it's all said and done and most exhaust shops charge $300+ for a fabbed up catback when on the cheap side is close to a grand. Once again just stating facts for the average layman who owns a 3rd gen and not those that are do-it-yourselfers or have a bunch of connections since most poeple don't.
matthinnant
New member
I have the OBX headers and there were numerous things I hated about them when I was installing them like fitment and other things but I can honestly say that they do the trick, esp. if you get rid of those horrible gaskets they send you. If you dont have a S/C then save yourself the time,effort, and money but if you do have one then get you some OBX headers you can't go wrong for the money.
