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DanSt4R

DanSt4R

New member
Well.. Long story short, My trusty 3rd Gen is basically taking a dump on me. I guarantee what you are about to see, you have never seen before. My family friend who has been a mechanic and working on cars and Toyotas for over 20yrs has never seen anything like this on a running motor. The previous owner must have ran the same oil for the life of the car or something. We are baffled how this even happened and how it still runs fine.



I bought the truck a year ago with 143,000 miles. 2002 4Runner SR5. The guy bought it used from a dealership and had it a for a number of years and i bought it from him off craigslist.. The car runs great. Literally never had a problem with it, Never broke down on me or anything. Ive done all Full synthetic oil changes myself every 6k depending how much I've been driving. Kept up all maintenance, and taken great care of it. Its my first car and my baby/money trap. Im hitting 154k and figured it was time to do the water pump, timing belt, seals and other stuff too. and i would start smoking sometimes when i would first fire it up (burning oil not head gasket) Well as the picture shows. Its a lot worse. i was leaking oil out of my intake. The vacuum lines weren't working because everything was so clogged. Causing oil to blow through my intake. The car runs fine though.. which is very odd. So I'm in quite the oicle as of now and need some advice from all you intelligent 4runner enthusiasts. My mechanic friend who is doing all the work on it says he won't start cleaning that gunk out because if he does with the motor in, all that will fall down into the bottom of the motor and clog that up, and ill lose oil pressure and blow my motor by the time i get it home. So i have a few shitty options.
1. Have him Pull the motor out completely so he can tilt it over and clean all that out without worrying about it falling down into the motor. Put it back together and call it that. Mind you, everything else is in the motor is good and we would replace a couple parts in there too. But both sides of the valves are like that and chances are the entire motor is Gunked up the same. And longevity are in question
2. Just throw a new motor in it.. Maybe v8 or just a newer better v6
3. Just cut ties with the truck. and get a new car. Tough because I've put a lot of money into it and love the car.

Anyways sorry for the long post, Just in a tough spot with making a decision. All are pretty pricy which sucks because I'm about to be moving and transferring to Cal Poly in December. Need some help!
 
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I feel for ya. One of the best investments I have ever made due to only buying used cars for myself is a borescope to look under the filler cap or through the PCV hole. I have seem worse.

The 5vz-fe is one damn good engine.

My ex wife before I met her bought a 98 Civic with the 1.6L in it. I started dating her at about 40,000 miles. It still had the factory fill in it. When I went to change the oil, about 3/4 of a quart came out.

Here are a link and then another link buried in the thread:
http://www.toyota-4runner.org/3rd-gen-t4rs/149446-crap-oil-sludge.html
 
Start using a diesel oil like Rotella T5 or their T6 and change oil every 2000 to 3000 miles. The diesel should help brake it down slowly. And a good filter.
 
Price out your options. Personally, with nothing more than my gut instinct I would probably have the motor pulled, and cleaned, top and bottom.
 
Plug all holes in head , start scraping crap off, with a shop vac running suck crap out as best you can. Then run it! Do not use any type of motor flush then do regular oil changes. It may run for years, it might not address issues as they happen then spend your $$$$$
 
Since you already have to pull the intake and timing set, I would think you could pull the heads pretty easily from there. Go have them hot tanked and put it back together. It's really a simple solution. Shortblock can stay put and you'll have a fresh top end.
 
I'd try the atf fluid trick if it still runs fine. Usually atf will work wonders on a sludged up motor but it is by no means a miracle worker for something as hoebagged as that looks. I'd still give it a shot. If it works then you won't have to tear it down any further than it is currently. If it doesn't you are out a few filters and QTS of oil/atf to try and save $$...

Edit: you don't run the atf in the oil for 1k miles... wow, too many barley pops this evening...lmao run it for half an hour or so at idle and pop the gas pedal a few times every few minutes to get the oil pressure up, then drain it as soon as you shut it off. Refillnwith good oil/change filter, drive 1k miles and drain hot, leave old filter on, 3qts cheap oil to 1qt atf and idle for 30 minutes, ect..
 
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Whatever you do, DO NOT flush the motor out. You will make it worse. Either keep driving it or do it right and pull motor. You will plug every oil hole in that motor tryin to flush it. Ive seen people lock the motors up several times doing flushes.
 
Back in the day when I worked on consumer cars for a living, I cleaned up probably 10 cars that looked worse than that.

What I would do is pull the valve cover(s), and oil drain plug. Then use regular solvent that you find in most auto shop parts washers, a stiff nylon brush, and just go after it. Once the head(s) were clean I'd make sure the oil drain gallery's were clear, then I'd pull the oil pan and clean the pan, oil pickup, and bottom end. Of course you're catching the solvent and sludge mix in a container below the oil pan drain plug.

Then I'd do a few quick oil changes: 10 minutes of running time then change the oil and filter. Then 50 miles of driving and another oil and filter change, and finally send it on it's way with instructions to change the oil and filter again in no more than 3k miles. Then resume normal oil change intervals, if no further issues appeared.

None of them ever came back for oil related problems.

Only one engine had been neglected so long, that the bearings were shot, and I ended up rebuilding that engine.
 
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I have actually seen one this bad, so bad the cam twisted in half on both sides locking the engine up... It took gallons of Kerosene to clean the inside of that motor top in and lower and replacing the cam after the cleanup was done pulled the pan and it was clean so kinda strange. Believe it or not after the clean up the motor is still running until this day. This person was extremely Lucky and if it was mine the engine would be coming out.
 
02SE said:
Back in the day when I worked on consumer cars for a living, I cleaned up probably 10 cars that looked worse than that.

What I would do is pull the valve cover(s), and oil drain plug. Then use regular solvent that you find in most auto shop parts washers, a stiff nylon brush, and just go after it. Once the head(s) were clean I'd make sure the oil drain gallery's were clear, then I'd pull the oil pan and clean the pan, oil pickup, and bottom end.

Then I'd do a few quick oil changes: 10 minutes of running time, then 50 miles of driving. Another oil change, and send it on it's way.

None of them ever came back for oil related problems.

Only one engine had been neglected so long, that the bearings were shot, and I ended up rebuilding that engine.
Click to expand...

This is exactly what I was going to say, which means that I must be learning something because 02SE knows his shit and I don't. That motor isn't a goner, it just needs some love.

I will say, I'd be leaning towards a rebuild though, just because who knows how long it's been going like that? That motor has seen more wear than the miles would indicate.
 
If it is running ok I would just change out the bad vacuum lines and then increase my oil change frequency to 3k with a good oil and filter. I have seen much worse than this, some engines lasting many thousands of miles some not.

Your mechanic is correct on not cleaning it out as it could go to the oil passages and oil pick up causing oil circulation and pressure problems.

I would also recommend looking in the inside of the pan and oil pick up with a boroscope before going to far into it.
 
02SE said:
Back in the day when I worked on consumer cars for a living, I cleaned up probably 10 cars that looked worse than that.

What I would do is pull the valve cover(s), and oil drain plug. Then use regular solvent that you find in most auto shop parts washers, a stiff nylon brush, and just go after it. Once the head(s) were clean I'd make sure the oil drain gallery's were clear, then I'd pull the oil pan and clean the pan, oil pickup, and bottom end.

Then I'd do a few quick oil changes: 10 minutes of running time, then 50 miles of driving. Another oil change, and send it on it's way.

None of them ever came back for oil related problems.

Only one engine had been neglected so long, that the bearings were shot, and I ended up rebuilding that engine.
Click to expand...

Your method was pretty much the same as mine when I was a tech. I would usually drop the pan and pickup right away and let 'em soak in the parts washer.

the following text will explain why I don't recommend ATF as a "flush"...

We did a lot of them (easily in the hundreds) during my time there,one came back with engine knock a month or so after the repair,luckilly it wasn't one of my jobs. My coworker ran an ATF/motor oil cocktail through the engine during the "running time" and test drive oil changes. The other techs and I think his ATF mixture started to wipe out the bearings. ATF has a lot of harsh detergents,the only time I used it on anything non-transmission is to clean engine parts. I would soak cam caps and lifter buckets in ATF,it would actually dissolve crud better and faster than parts washer solvent.

These were all Toyota V6 engines by the way.
 
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