Your Daily Reminder to Get a DashCam

[absalom]

Sounds like the myriad stupid preemptive laws passed by governments the world over. Apparently, no one taught legislators in the civics classes about the whole concept of the proper role of government being limited to the protection of individual rights. To put it succinctly, if no one's natural, negative rights are infringed upon, no "crime" has occurred.

So you're ok with drunk driving then?

 

[Mark_BC]

Sounds like the myriad stupid preemptive laws passed by governments the world over. Apparently, no one taught legislators in the civics classes about the whole concept of the proper role of government being limited to the protection of individual rights. To put it succinctly, if no one's natural, negative rights are infringed upon, no "crime" has occurred.

I agree with this law, it is way too dangerous using your phone at all while driving. I agree with you though in general that many government laws are too intrusive but this one I am totally behind. People belly ached when it came in but now pretty much everyone accepts it.

 

[Sean K.]

So you're ok with drunk driving then?

Yep....by that standard.

Look....MILLIONS of people drive drunk every year. About half to 60% of traffic fatalities are caused by drunk or impaired drivers....and that figure is about 35K per year....so approximately 21K could be attributed to drunk/impaired driving.

Obviously, people drive drunk regularly and make it home just fine. Having a law that says it's "illegal" hasn't stopped it, now has it?

Know what would be a better "deterrent" (but more importantly would provide recompense to victims or their families) and NOT contribute to a policing for profit model (or violations of the 4A with unconstitutional "DUI checkpoints")? HARSH sentences once one violates someone else's natural negative rights with their gross negligence (by driving drunk in the first place). Harsh, as in.....you kill or seriously injure someone....you may NEVER get out of prison, but you will definitely do something like 20 years.

No victim, no crime has a lot of merit....but Amerikans are preconditioned to not be able to think out of the box.

 

[Sean K.]

I agree with this law, it is way too dangerous using your phone at all while driving. I agree with you though in general that many government laws are too intrusive but this one I am totally behind. People belly ached when it came in but now pretty much everyone accepts it.

Are you also in favor of making all occupants of a vehicle (if there are more than one) wear gag balls? Laugh, but "distracted" driving caused by people not paying attention to the road while talking to one another can still result in a traffic fatality. A wreck is a wreck whether it be caused by fiddling with a radio, falling asleep at the wheel, texting or being on drugs/alcohol. Generally, someone was negligent or it wouldn't have happened.

By the way....I agree 100%. Driving while using a phone is incredibly stupid (I used to own a cell phone for work, but I haven't had service in about 4 years now....never once used it while driving for obvious reasons)....but the answer is to severely penalize the violation of another's natural, negative rights....not to engage in trying to sculpt behavior through punitive fines and "pre-crime" initiatives.

 

[Mark_BC]

Are you also in favor of making all occupants of a vehicle (if there are more than one) wear gag balls? Laugh, but "distracted" driving caused by people not paying attention to the road while talking to one another can still result in a traffic fatality. A wreck is a wreck whether it be caused by fiddling with a radio, falling asleep at the wheel, texting or being on drugs/alcohol. Generally, someone was negligent or it wouldn't have happened.

By the way....I agree 100%. Driving while using a phone is incredibly stupid (I used to own a cell phone for work, but I haven't had service in about 4 years now....never once used it while driving for obvious reasons)....but the answer is to severely penalize the violation of another's natural, negative rights....not to engage in trying to sculpt behavior through punitive fines and "pre-crime" initiatives.

The point is that when using your phone you are by definition looking away from the road and shifting your concentration, and using up at least one hand. That is totally different than talking to someone beside you. Unless you are on a deserted straight country road going 20, it is dangerous.

I don't want to go out on the roads if people are allowed to use their phones while driving because I know that not everyone is smart like you and every idiot will take advantage of this freedom and drive while distracted. You are allowed to use hands-free talking or you can pull over to the side of the road to talk. Sometimes if I'm in the 4runner and I get a call I put the phone on speaker on my lap which I guess is technically illegal but no one will see and it's no different than talking to a real passenger. If I'm in my Leaf the car automatically handles the call through its speaker system.

This law does not sculpt anyone's behavior, it simply says that engaging in dangerous activities while operating a car will get you a ticket because it endangers other drivers on the road, since any use of a phone while driving IS dangerous, much like running a red light. You might get away with it a few times but eventually you are going to cause an accident.

In BC they do also have severe penalties for drunk driving. If you injure another person you are in deep trouble and if it kills someone basically your free life is over, even if you get out of prison in 10 years you will have that following you around for life and it will severely hamper your ability to succeed. It is much stricter than in the US.

 

[Sean K.]

The point is that when using your phone you are by definition looking away from the road and shifting your concentration, and using up at least one hand. That is totally different than talking to someone beside you. Unless you are on a deserted straight country road going 20, it is dangerous.

No, they are EXACTLY the same if an accident results from either situation.

I don't want to go out on the roads if people are allowed to use their phones while driving because I know that not everyone is smart like you and every idiot will take advantage of this freedom and drive while distracted.

I understand your fear....freedom can be scary. It means that someone, somewhere WILL do something stupid. If it makes you feel safer to stay home, do so....but it won't change the fact that bad things happen even in tyrannical societies.

You are allowed to use hands-free talking or you can pull over to the side of the road to talk. Sometimes if I'm in the 4runner and I get a call I put the phone on speaker on my lap which I guess is technically illegal but no one will see and it's no different than talking to a real passenger.

This stance is hypocritical in the extreme. Re-examine it if you are going to advocate such infringement upon other's liberty....essentially what you are saying is: "The law doesn't apply to me, but to thee".

This law does not sculpt anyone's behavior, it simply says that engaging in dangerous activities while operating a car will get you a ticket because it endangers other drivers on the road, since any use of a phone while driving IS dangerous, much like running a red light. You might get away with it a few times but eventually you are going to cause an accident.

Again, flawed logic. Yes, it most certainly is an attempt to elicit curbing of cell phone usage while driving....there is no way you can make an argument otherwise. The reasoning seems valid to you....but all one has to do is drive in your locale to see that it doesn't work. Are people still using their cell phones while driving?

Most people "get away" with running a red light dozens of times in their lifetimes. I'm not at all advocating doing dangerous things while driving.....I'm advocating punishing people when they screw up and infringe on another's rights....not preemptively. But it should be noted for the record, it's none of my business how Canada does things as I am not a citizen. If you're happy with it...more power to ya!

In BC they do also have severe penalties for drunk driving. If you injure another person you are in deep trouble and if it kills someone basically your free life is over, even if you get out of prison in 10 years you will have that following you around for life and it will severely hamper your ability to succeed. It is much stricter than in the US.

Our DD laws vary by state....most have gotten very severe in terms of cost but predominantly because they are revenue generators for the states and municipalities...while the government tells us it's for "our safety"...the reality is the justice system profits enormously.

 

[SupaSupra]

I like professional motorcycle riders; have no issue with them at all. Unfortunately, most of the motorcyclist I notice on the road these days are complete idiots and anything but safe, courteous and professional. Always driving too fast for conditions, lane splitting when it's not appropriate, tailgating right before splitting the lane...etc. Really leaves a bad taste in regards to motorcyclist. I'm sure the good ones aren't too happy to have these idiots give all riders a bad rep.

As a former truck driver, I've seen some shit ( as I'm sure you have as well Tim working as a firefighter ) and I personally take safe driving very seriously. My wife tires of me calling out the idiots on the road all the time, but of the three collisions I've been involved in over the past 24 years, all three were the fault of the other driver and all three of those idiots rear-ended me.

Don't get me started on everyone else too. Car/pickup/SUV drivers are always on their goddamn phones these days. I see them in front of me and behind me drifting in & out of their lanes as they try to type and watch the road simultaneously. This is a daily occurence where I live.

Then at the stop lights I probably have to honk at least once every day or two (often multiple times a day even) at some jackass checking their text messages or snapping selfies and not noticing the light has turned green.

It's for these people that I have had to install the Hella Supertone horns and bought the dashcam to install. I use my horn a lot too. I even used it in the drive thru the other day when some dipshit didn't notice the line had moved because he was nose-deep in his damn phone.

I think this stuff is just going to get worse as time goes on. All we can do is pay extra attention to our surroundings and be prepared to show evidence that you weren't at fault — if you survive the collision of course. I fully expect anyone who hits me — to lie about it to the authorities.

The world is changing fast these days and it's definitely not always for the better.

Hella Supertones are one of the best things I've ever put on my truck.

 

[absalom]

Totally my fault for turning this political. Let's steer this back on topic.

 

[Mark_BC]

No, they are EXACTLY the same if an accident results from either situation.

I understand your fear....freedom can be scary. It means that someone, somewhere WILL do something stupid. If it makes you feel safer to stay home, do so....but it won't change the fact that bad things happen even in tyrannical societies.

This stance is hypocritical in the extreme. Re-examine it if you are going to advocate such infringement upon other's liberty....essentially what you are saying is: "The law doesn't apply to me, but to thee".

Again, flawed logic. Yes, it most certainly is an attempt to elicit curbing of cell phone usage while driving....there is no way you can make an argument otherwise. The reasoning seems valid to you....but all one has to do is drive in your locale to see that it doesn't work. Are people still using their cell phones while driving?

Most people "get away" with running a red light dozens of times in their lifetimes. I'm not at all advocating doing dangerous things while driving.....I'm advocating punishing people when they screw up and infringe on another's rights....not preemptively. But it should be noted for the record, it's none of my business how Canada does things as I am not a citizen. If you're happy with it...more power to ya!

They are not exactly the same. Using your phone to text requires you to take your eyes, concentration, and hands off of the task of driving. Talking to someone beside you does none of that. The line has to be drawn somewhere and I agree with where it has been drawn.

It is not an attempt to curb cell phone usage while driving; it is an attempt to make the roads safer for everyone and one important way to do that is to prevent people from using their phones while driving. If you want to use your phone you can pull over to the side, or go stealthy like I rarely do and have it on speaker on your lap.

In Canada we don't typically have such intense right wing sentiments. Of course government goes too far like in all countries but in terms of traffic laws ... that's the least of my concerns in terms of government intrusion into our liberties. Most here feel that pre-emptive laws are justified in addition to post-incident punishment because there is always a significant element of society that is stupid and will not use common sense and not have the foresight of the consequences. Furthermore it sets the tone for young drivers that driving while distracted is not tolerated. The laws don't just apply to using your phone, they also apply to any distraction including driving with your pet on your lap.

Yes, bad things happen in all societies including tyrannical ones; the purpose of the laws is to reduce the number of crashes and injuries related to distracted driving, which these laws effectively do without significantly infringing on people's rights to use their phones; they just infringe on peoples' abilities to be stupid and put other people at risk.

 

[Sean K.]

Totally my fault for turning this political. Let's steer this back on topic.

Actually, I think it was my fault....

And IIRC, don't the TOS on the site make the topic verboten?

If so, my apologies......

 

[Sean K.]

They are not exactly the same. Using your phone to text requires you to take your eyes, concentration, and hands off of the task of driving. Talking to someone beside you does none of that. The line has to be drawn somewhere and I agree with where it has been drawn.

It is not an attempt to curb cell phone usage while driving; it is an attempt to make the roads safer for everyone and one important way to do that is to prevent people from using their phones while driving. If you want to use your phone you can pull over to the side, or go stealthy like I rarely do and have it on speaker on your lap.

In Canada we don't typically have such intense right wing sentiments. Of course government goes too far like in all countries but in terms of traffic laws ... that's the least of my concerns in terms of government intrusion into our liberties. Most here feel that pre-emptive laws are justified in addition to post-incident punishment because there is always a significant element of society that is stupid and will not use common sense and not have the foresight of the consequences. Furthermore it sets the tone for young drivers that driving while distracted is not tolerated. The laws don't just apply to using your phone, they also apply to any distraction including driving with your pet on your lap.

Yes, bad things happen in all societies including tyrannical ones; the purpose of the laws is to reduce the number of crashes and injuries related to distracted driving, which these laws effectively do without significantly infringing on people's rights to use their phones; they just infringe on peoples' abilities to be stupid and put other people at risk.

We can take it to PM if you'd like.....just copy the above and I'll counter each and every point.


***EDIT*** and just for clarification....my viewpoint on the topic could hardly be characterized as "right wing". If anything....it's extremely "liberal" in the classical sense of the word (not the bastardized version that we've come to know). ***

 

[MN4runnerman]

I'll be getting one for each vehicle in time. I have one waiting to go into my sport right now. I mainly bought it so I can post a grainy video of Bigfoot crossing the road in the north woods of MN.

 

[Hepar]

I've been meaning to do this for the longest time. Just keep procrastinating. Maybe this will be the motivation I need to just get it done.

 

[Mark_BC]

Actually, I think it was my fault....

And IIRC, don't the TOS on the site make the topic verboten?

If so, my apologies......

No it was my fault.

 

[Unner]

I've been meaning to do this for the longest time. Just keep procrastinating. Maybe this will be the motivation I need to just get it done.

One of the easiest things I've done to the truck yet. Opened the box, plugged it in and turned it on to see where to position it on the windshield, stuck the mount to the windshield, mounted the camera, ran the cable along the headliner, down the passenger A pillar, through a gap between the dash and the A pillar trim, along the AC tube for the passenger AC vent, then out through a gap at the back of the area for the ash tray, then just plugged it into the cigarette lighter and it's all good to go. The only tool I needed was a screwdriver to take out the glovebox. It took like 30 minutes and I spent most of the time figuring out where the optimal position for it was on the windshield and how to run the cable.

In the end a satisfying cheapish project that could pay off large dividends in the end, but I hope it never has to.

 

[mtbtim]

I borrowed ideas from [MENTION=116387]Unner[/MENTION] and did my dash cam install today. I just have to wait for my memory card to arrive and then I'll be ready to record all sorts crappy driving on our roadways.

Oh, and I made a video of the install of course. Enjoy the show!

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/XcjegeOjCwo" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

 

[MN4runnerman]

[MENTION=120071]mtbtim[/MENTION] deserves a freakin medal

 

[HiLife]

I came across this on youtube. Luckily the other guy had a dashcam.

 

[StreetCreeper]

I came across this on youtube. Luckily the other guy had a dashcam.

Poor 4Runner!

So uh....where'd this happen? I need parts.

 

[shahsmerdis]

Yep. Happen to me. Got hit by a lady that told the police I ran into her lane. Dashcam proved my story. It was easier to put it on Youtube so the office could watch it.
Everyone should have one on their windshield.

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/ipWJawX_7cw" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

so did you end up winning? You mention that her insurance deny your claim. You can always sue.