Brake upgrades on the 5th Gen

iwishiwasbigger

iwishiwasbigger

New member
I only have 8000 miles on my hog right now. However one of the main things I’ve been thinking about now that the suspension is nearing complete is brake upgrades. I’ll preface this with: I’ve always run cross drilled and slotted rotors for the obvious benefits of well what the slots and drilled patterns are designed to do. Has anyone done a big brake kit, replaced rotors / Calipers / better Pads.

Thanks.
 
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Icantdrive55 said:
I mean honestly a set of quality pads will do more for the truck than boutique rotors. Unless you're heating the brakes up in an autocross/"racing" environment then slotted/dimpled/drilled rotors wont be doing much of anything to improve braking. I'm not versed on Toyota brake systems, but for something like the 4Runner and being driven in a way 99% of us drive, quality/performance pads and a good brake fluid, and maaaaaybe braided/reinforced lines will do more than anything else. A lighter rotor may offset the unsprung weight increases of different tires and wheels, but for the most part that lighter weight comes at a cost of strength and longevity.

On that note, I absolutely abhor rotors that werent designed to be drilled/modified. Its snake oil to the highest degree. They will also cause issues with debris getting in there off road, and these are heavy trucks, making that bad bad juju
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You responsed with a bunch of very good points. I think the only reason I was even considering any sort of heat dissipating designed rotor would be for the larger tire, stoping distances, wet braking, and overall wear life etc. With the cons you listed I think the stopping distance and wet braking performance would be the only pros. Not sure if that outweighs the cons... hmmm
 
iwishiwasbigger said:
You responsed with a bunch of very good points. I think the only reason I was even considering any sort of heat dissipating designed rotor would be for the larger tire, stoping distances, wet braking, and overall wear life etc. With the cons you listed I think the stopping distance and wet braking performance would be the only pros. Not sure if that outweighs the cons... hmmm
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Anecdotally, the braking performance of a 5th gen on 33's is considerably better than my old Jeep JK on 35's. I think the big brake kits for JK's are relatively common for a reason. If I had kept mine I would have likely done the swap. On this platform I really think the negatives outweigh any improvements you may get, for reasonable driving conditions. Have you experienced panic stop brake-assist kick in before?
 
JSparky said:
Anecdotally, the braking performance of a 5th gen on 33's is considerably better than my old Jeep JK on 35's. I think the big brake kits for JK's are relatively common for a reason. If I had kept mine I would have likely done the swap. On this platform I really think the negatives outweigh any improvements you may get, for reasonable driving conditions. Have you experienced panic stop brake-assist kick in before?
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Extremely true. I had a JKU with about 500 pounds of stuff on it riding on E-rated 33s. I ended up putting in a Dynatrac big brake kit since the stopping distances were horrible stock and got down right scary once you added the weight and bigger tires on the Unlimited.

The 4Runner's brakes are honestly pretty decent, the biggest issue honestly is getting used to the nose dive in a panic stop situation and I think a shock upgrade would probably take care of that better than any brake kit I've come across.

Something like the Dynatrac JK kit which increased the rear rotor size would be pretty neat on the 4Runner, but honestly I think the brakes are already pretty well matched in terms of stopping distance to the truck...
 
A forum search will be your friend, as there are a bunch of posts asking the same or similar questions. The consensus in most of them indicates stock rotors and pads are the best bet.
 
A 5th gen will easily lock up (well, activate the ABS) the wheels stock so nothing you do to the brakes will decrease stopping distance. So instead you need to look at suspension. A 5th gen is pretty high up in the air so lowering it will help. Especially lowering the rear to keep weight over the rear axle when braking hard. Then stiffer springs, uprated dampers, wide sticky tires, etc. In short, do everything you can to make it more of a car. Certainly having it lifted on AT tires and heavy wheels is your biggest impediment. Get the weight down, get more rubber on the ground, control weight transfer - that's how you decrease stopping distance. Once you get to a point that teh stock system won't lock them then look to upgrading the braking system.

If it's heat tolerance you're after, again that's a hard one. Drilled rotors don't do sh*t except reduce mass which hurts heat tolerance. Odds are you'll get cracks around the holes that will require replacement of the rotors. You won't find drilled rotors on many race cars. Slots can help wipe away glazing, vent gasses, etc. in really hard track use but won't do anything at all for single stops. Step one here is a high temperature fluid (I use ATE Type 200 in sports cars) and a high temperature fast street/race pad. I use Ferodo DS2500 on my sports cars - not sure if they have the right fitment for our trucks.

Best bet if you want to improve braking? Get rid of your heavy SUV and get a light weight sports car.
 
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Are you really having any issues with your stock brakes? One of the many reasons I chose the 4runner over the competition and even the Tacoma is the stock brakes. 5th gens have the largest brakes offered in a 4runner (even though it is the heaviest as well). We also have larger brakes up front (and vented disks in the rear) than the Tacomas, which are rated to haul and tow more weight...

I've had cross drilled and slotted rotors on cars in the past. No noticeable difference in performance, just increased noise and cracking between the holes. That's with cheap rotors. All of my motorcycles run drilled rotors, but that's for the weight savings and to look cool...

Coming from an 80 series and 2 JKs (the second had 35s and I installed the Mopar BBK up front, which helped quite a bit), the 4runner has excellent brakes right out of the box.
 
Best way to improve the brakes for the vehicle IMO, change the tires.
During heavy braking the stock Bridgestones will slide on any surface.

Also, slotted/drilled brake rotors will not improve braking distance for this type of vehicle.
They will cause the pads to wear faster and create noise.

Stock pads and rotors are your best bet.
 
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Drilled are nice for initial bite in heavy rain. Slotted are good for diverting gasses from the pad during repeated hard stops with heating up the components. I have run a few different sets on other vehicles. I have also been considering brake upgrades for better initial bite

My plan is slightly more aggressive pads, drilled rotors and maybe stainless lines. Stoptech and a few other mfgs, likely have some kits that will fit.
 
If you need better stopping distances or less fade in a very high heat environment, go for pads that are designed for higher heat applications. Pair that with a nice set of blank rotors and you will be about as good as you can get. The reality is that drilling and slotting rotors does basically nothing for us today with pads that do not off gas like the old days. Manufacturers started putting these types of rotors on their vehicles to give the appearance of sport and be able to sell their rotors at 2x the price. I drove test cars for many years both with blank and drilled/slotted rotors. The drilled/slotted rotors didn't stop any better (in high heat environments such as riding the brakes down mountain passes), but I did see multiple cracked rotors and one total failure. The blank rotors never had an issue. These were both OEM parts. After my experiences, and doing a bunch of research, I realized that I could easily get away with running a nice set of blanks (OEM or your favorite high quality aftermarket manufacturer) and save my self a bunch of money while returning the same performance. Another thing to think about is if you get a caliper that is any bigger than the current one, you will have to run larger wheels, which can be a detriment off road, and generally have higher tire costs.
 
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For marginally better stopping but massively better brake feel I'd recommend looking into upgrading the brake fluid and brake lines to braided stainless steel. I'm pretty sure I saw a kit offered for the 4Runner from Goodridge or StopTech not that long ago. I've done this on previous cars and it made a big difference.
 
Icantdrive55 said:
...Unless you're heating the brakes up in an autocross/"racing" environment then slotted/dimpled/drilled rotors wont be doing much of anything to improve braking.
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Correct, I have run slotted rotor on race cars and the do make a difference for a few reasons on a race car.

However, the slots and holes do allow for dirt and gasses to escape the rotor surface. So they can make a difference off road or in heavy towing applications.

When it's all said and done, 90% of braking problems on street vehicles can be solved with quality pads, brake fluid, and rotors. i.e. don't buy junk.
 
I read that someone on here swapped out the rubber brake lines with braided stainless steel lines. The said the pedal felt less squishy, but don't recall if it helped anything else.

The brakes on my '17 TRDORP are way better than my '08 Wrangler Rubicon.

At the end of the day you'll still have a vehicle that weighs almost 5000lbs. Its not a super car that will stop on a dime. Just drive accordantly.
 
gundrted+t4r said:
I read that someone on here swapped out the rubber brake lines with braided stainless steel lines. The said the pedal felt less squishy, but don't recall if it helped anything else.

The brakes on my '17 TRDORP are way better than my '08 Wrangler Rubicon.

At the end of the day you'll still have a vehicle that weighs almost 5000lbs. Its not a super car that will stop on a dime. Just drive accordantly.
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I'm one of those people. I had to extend my rear hoses for the different rear coils I've been running and went ahead and replaced both front a rear hoses to keep things consistent. There's a possibility of long travel front later on down the line as well. All-Pro carries them, made by Crown Performance who hold a pretty good reputation in the business.

It did firm up the pedal feel and eliminated that space-ship compressed air type sound the pedal used to make. I'm not sure I'd reccomend it as a stand alone type of upgrade for the average person, I consider it more of a nice perk. I know some people can be really bothered by the sound/feel though so it's up to the individual. I know some debate the effectiveness of ss braided hoses over Kevlar reinforced rubber. From my experience in multiple lifted vehicles, the ss braided hoses do influence pedal feel, especially when the hoses get in the 14+ inch length range (I've run extended length hoses in both standard and ss braided). But unless you're going long travel there isn't really a need for super long hoses in a 4Runner.
 
Lots of good info here but not a lot of direct responses to your questions, so allow me...

My stock setup finally quit at 90,000 miles and only after one of the rotors warped. The pads easily had another 10,000 on them. That is purely insane for original equipment.

With a warped rotor, I was faced with either staying with OEM replacements (no complaints in the quality) or trying something a little beefier for towing as I periodically do. So I went with StopTech drilled and slotted rotors and StopTech carbon fiber/ceramic tow pads.

The stopping power is slightly improved over the worn OEM setup, but something I can in fact notice. One thing I really noticed is just how impressive Toyota is in their design. The stock brakes are more than adequate and while I don't regret my decision in the least bit, the stock system is just so well done that most upgrades you would do is like adding an air intake to the Runner...it's for the sake of tweaking stuff but Toyota just did things right.

So, OP, I wouldn't mess with upgrading sizes or anything like that. If you want a more aggressive pad, I'd go that route. Otherwise, like others have touched on, I'd work to improve the stock suspension to reduce nose dive and improve stability. Then, enjoy driving 90,000 miles without spending money on brake components (your experience may vary).


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I only have an issue with the feel......mushy initially then seem to grab right before you come to a stop making backing off the pedal to smooth the stop needed. Just not progressive and easily modulated. I am tempted to try a pair of braided lines up front. Next, try an aggressive pad if needed.
 
83Mule said:
I only have an issue with the feel......mushy initially then seem to grab right before you come to a stop making backing off the pedal to smooth the stop needed. Just not progressive and easily modulated.

I am tempted to try a pair of braided lines up front.

Next, try an aggressive pad if needed.
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Did you ever try out braided lines?
 
I’ve had great experiences with cryogenic rotors and think it’s worth the premium. Not slotted or drilled though, just vented.
 
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