2004 Limited Edition 4Runner 4X4 - Head Gasket

[20034RunnerV84x2]

08T4R, It was a very interesting situation today with my stealership. I anonymously called the Toyo service department today and asked them how much does it cost to rebuild the cylinder heads on a 2004 4runner. The person told me its around $200 per head and it includes everything for a rebuild, machining flat, re-seating the valves and replacing the valve seats. And then I asked for the manager and he confirms the cost... Then I told the manager that I have my truck in his dealership for a head gasket repair! And I asked why is your services adviser as asking for $1300 on top of the $500 machine cost for the head, then the manager was very apologetic but insist they do mark up on the machining cost by 40 percent, so I told him how they still come up to $1800 for rebuilding the head with a 40 percent mark up. The manager says he does not know why and he will talk to the service adviser. I told him that my adviser already talked to you about it and you were willing to knock off $200 from it. Again more apologies, and said maybe I got the wrong information..... Finally, I told the manager, put my truck back together and it better be running the same way as I brought it in and it better not have leaky gasket.

The dishonesty of these dealers and Toyo to back these dealership is beyond me.

I am actually thinking of trading it in and it wont be for a Toyota. My truck is worth $10k by KBB but with $3k less for the repair. Taking advantage of people in these hard times is really not helping. I had a Honda, Mitsubishi, Jeep and BMW and they never pulled anything like this.

Dealers are independently owned. Toyota does not own them. The dealer buys the vehicles (invoice) marks them up for a profit, and sells them. It's how it works. Now if they have a terrible dishonest service department, that's on them and not Toyota.

 

[vicrc]

I knew that, I just want to show my story of how dishonesty of this dealership.

 

[bme75]

I have an 05 V6 4Runner with 150K. I've been told my head gasket is leaking as well. Although the only signs have been the lights coming on the dash. The toyota dealership is telling me a new head gasket would run me $3800. But, based on what they feel I really should have a rebuilt engine put in. They want to charge me $5500 for that. And the engine only has a 90 day warranty. Obviously, I'm very disappointed that my 4runner only made it 150k when I've taken such good care of it. Do these prices seem outlandish? I've been told that if they do the head gasket job and in the process, they find I have bigger issues I'll be on the hook for part of the cost of that job + the engine rebuild job. I don't want to completely trade-in my truck because other than this it's in great shape. But, the options seem bleak here. Any sites online people recommend to buy an engine from?

 

[vicrc]

The numbers of these HG problems will grow as more trucks reach that 150k mark.

 

[08T4R]

I have an 05 V6 4Runner with 150K. I've been told my head gasket is leaking as well. Although the only signs have been the lights coming on the dash. The toyota dealership is telling me a new head gasket would run me $3800. But, based on what they feel I really should have a rebuilt engine put in. They want to charge me $5500 for that. And the engine only has a 90 day warranty. Obviously, I'm very disappointed that my 4runner only made it 150k when I've taken such good care of it. Do these prices seem outlandish? I've been told that if they do the head gasket job and in the process, they find I have bigger issues I'll be on the hook for part of the cost of that job + the engine rebuild job. I don't want to completely trade-in my truck because other than this it's in great shape. But, the options seem bleak here. Any sites online people recommend to buy an engine from?

Try a good independent shop with good references. They should know a good machine shop as well in the area. I would certainly use Toyota parts, but I would try to find better, more honest labor. Anytime you guys get an estimate from a shop, ask for a breakdown of the charges so you can see what you're paying for what. If its not already included.

As far as 'bigger issues', not quite sure how it could get bigger, other than a cracked cylinder head. That shouldn't happen unless you run it pretty hot so keep an eye on the coolant level.

What all is included with your 3800 estimate? Did they say? Or just generally say a hg replacement will cost this..

 

[bme75]

Thanks for the info 08T4R. The $3800 quote was really just a guesstimate from Toyota. Their concern was that it may be better to replace the engine because the heads could be porous now and I'd waste more money going between replacing the HG vs. the engine. Like I've said, other than the lights coming on the dash, I've had no other symptoms so I'm not sure if anything else is warranted other than a HG replacement. I've found some online places that have 1yr or 3yr engine guarantees. I don't know what I'm getting into with that but it seems better than the 90 day toyota is offering. Oh, and I didn't mention - Toyota also offered me an option for them to get a short block directly from Toyota and replace my engine using that. It comes with a 1yr warranty but they want $8300 for it!

 

[08T4R]

Thanks for the info 08T4R. The $3800 quote was really just a guesstimate from Toyota. Their concern was that it may be better to replace the engine because the heads could be porous now and I'd waste more money going between replacing the HG vs. the engine. Like I've said, other than the lights coming on the dash, I've had no other symptoms so I'm not sure if anything else is warranted other than a HG replacement. I've found some online places that have 1yr or 3yr engine guarantees. I don't know what I'm getting into with that but it seems better than the 90 day toyota is offering. Oh, and I didn't mention - Toyota also offered me an option for them to get a short block directly from Toyota and replace my engine using that. It comes with a 1yr warranty but they want $8300 for it!

Ha! Yeah, I'd tell em nope. That's more than half the value of the vehicle. If the bottom end is fine, either resurface and pressure check your heads for cracks, or buy a set of heads already remanned. That's gonna be your cheapest option and there's nothing wrong with just replacing the gaskets if everything else checks out ok. Have seen it done hundreds of times when I worked at the shop. The name of the company I used to work for is called Allied Motor Parts in east point Georgia. Give em a call and ask what it would cost for a set of remanufactured heads, and or, what it would cost to have yours pressure checked and resurfaced. That'll give you an idea of what the machine work will cost.

 

[Neil]

Just wondering if you needed to rebuild the heads on your v6? Don't forget to call Toyo Corp and let them know you had the HG issue.

I am wondering if anyone has gone to 200k miles without needing new HG?

I'm not trying to be a jerk here but this conversation is still pretty one sided and I feel bad that any of you had this problem. However, therre are many examples of 4runners that have over 200k. In fact the highest mileage 4th gen is a v6 and he/she (8007M) has over 433K. Here are some others:

Here is another with close to 200k at 189k from oct 12
http://www.toyota-4runner.org/4th-gen-t4rs/37419-highest-mileage-4th-gen-22.html


These are the one's that I have found just via a quick search. There are more posted on my original high mileage thread.
There are a bunch of others but they don't say what engine they have so I guess they don't count.

Overall, people need to realize that as a vehicle goes over 100k there are probably going to be problems. Whether it is a transmission or hg or something else you just have to hope you have a vehicle that only has one of these issues instead of multiple. I ve already told my wife there is no way we are going to find another vehicle that has this few of issues in our future, it has just been too good and I don't expect that of any vehicle.

I know that I have about 183k on my 04 v6 and I haven't had this problem so I will just close with a link to my original post that details how I feel about this situation. I have changed my opinion about the fact the v8 is probably more reliable but I would still take the v6 for the better gas mileage, no timing belt changes, easier access to oil filter, lower cost of entry (at the time of purchase when new) and ability to run into 2wd because the fact is anything could break regardless of how well maintained it is or how good the reputation is. The fact is this is still a rare issue, not common or widespread at all.

Completely disagree. This is not a "common problem". I keep coming back to the fact the the majority of 4runners sold are v6's and if you add in tacoma's, FJ's and the base model tundra's there have to be at least 600,000 of these engines produced between 2003 and 2010. We are hearing of a few reports of head gasket issues and we don't have any idea what the maintenace history is for most of these, nor do we know if people are actually telling the truth about their maintenence history. I can only speak for my 4runner but I suck at doing pm and didn't change my radiator fluid until 150k and I only did a drain and fill about 8 times and I have no signs of these issues at 170k. So I'm calling BS on most of these complaints. Disagree if you want but I need to see more like a 1% failure rate to say this is a common problem. __________________

 

[vicrc]

I'm not trying to be a jerk here but this conversation is still pretty one sided and I feel bad that any of you had this problem. However, therre are many examples of 4runners that have over 200k. In fact the highest mileage 4th gen is a v6 and he/she (8007M) has over 433K. Here are some others:

Here is another with close to 200k at 189k from oct 12
http://www.toyota-4runner.org/4th-gen-t4rs/37419-highest-mileage-4th-gen-22.html


These are the one's that I have found just via a quick search. There are more posted on my original high mileage thread.
There are a bunch of others but they don't say what engine they have so I guess they don't count.

Overall, people need to realize that as a vehicle goes over 100k there are probably going to be problems. Whether it is a transmission or hg or something else you just have to hope you have a vehicle that only has one of these issues instead of multiple. I ve already told my wife there is no way we are going to find another vehicle that has this few of issues in our future, it has just been too good and I don't expect that of any vehicle.

I know that I have about 183k on my 04 v6 and I haven't had this problem so I will just close with a link to my original post that details how I feel about this situation. I have changed my opinion about the fact the v8 is probably more reliable but I would still take the v6 for the better gas mileage, no timing belt changes, easier access to oil filter, lower cost of entry (at the time of purchase when new) and ability to run into 2wd because the fact is anything could break regardless of how well maintained it is or how good the reputation is. The fact is this is still a rare issue, not common or widespread at all.

Completely disagree. This is not a "common problem". I keep coming back to the fact the the majority of 4runners sold are v6's and if you add in tacoma's, FJ's and the base model tundra's there have to be at least 600,000 of these engines produced between 2003 and 2010. We are hearing of a few reports of head gasket issues and we don't have any idea what the maintenace history is for most of these, nor do we know if people are actually telling the truth about their maintenence history. I can only speak for my 4runner but I suck at doing pm and didn't change my radiator fluid until 150k and I only did a drain and fill about 8 times and I have no signs of these issues at 170k. So I'm calling BS on most of these complaints. Disagree if you want but I need to see more like a 1% failure rate to say this is a common problem. __________________

You do have to understand that not all 600,000 of these vehicles are anywhere near 150k miles, so we really wont know how many will make it to 200k without HG issue. From what I have been reading its cylinder 6 area of the gasket that is having problems and we don't know when Toyo discovered the problem and applied the new gasket version.

I would not think 2007-2010 are anywhere near 150k miles unless someone has been putting 30,000+ miles a year.

 

[oljedi11950]

Head gaskets

Here's another ? that I've been having w/blackworksinc about preventative maint. Does it behoove us to replace gaskets before problems @ the cost of 1700$ plus or wait & dbl that figure ? I have 97 thou on my 4r no issues . I bought mine used & got lucky that previous owner was anal , and did all his service @ dealership where I bought it , he traded up for 012 4r . Just some food for thought , because I hear voices that say No. 6 is leaking !! No other probs yet !!

 

[08T4R]

If it were me and my 4r, I'd do nothing until there was a sign something was up. Then I'd check the heads for straightness, pull vacuum on the valve seats and check for any cracks. Resurface if needed and apply the new gaskets and drive another 100k or until trade in time..

 

[Rob J.]

New here.

Thanks to all the posters for the great info.

I bought my '04 4.0 (1GR-FE) Runner a couple years ago with 91K miles at the time and have since put on around 40K more, so it's at 132K now.

For the past couple weeks I've been having similar misfire problems as the posters upthread.

At cold startup in the morning, the engine runs rough for a maybe a couple minutes, the CEL lights up (along w/VSC), then after another 30 seconds or so the engine settles right down to a normal idle of about 600 rpms.

Take it to my indie mechanic, scanner shows P0306 code. They replace the plugs (which had around 50K miles on them) and also replace #6 cylinder coil.

Engine runs fine for a few days, then one morning the rough idle returns at startup, CEL lights up... Autozone scanner shows P0306 again as well as the random misfire code.

I clean the MAF sensor, check the air filter, clean the PVC, run some Sea Foam through the PVC vacuum line, put some Sea Foam in the gas tank (hoping to clean out any gummed up injectors), do some other basic maintenance.

None of that works.

I open the coolant overflow and notice a fuel smell.

My mechanic does some more tests, including compression test, and decides it's a leaky head gasket.

Looks like it will cost around $2K, since I'm going to do both heads.

I did call the Toyota 1-800 line and they did register my engine problem and they gave me a case # but they said there are no recalls in effect, so I'm on my own.

One thing that might help others as far as the 1GR-FE engine maintenance -- on the phone, one of the guys in my local Toyota dealership service department said do not go beyond the recommended mileage for a complete coolant system flush and complete coolant replacement.

(Am I correct in saying that should be done @ 100K miles ( ? ) )

I didn't flush the system, so I may have brought some of this on myself.

The service manager said old coolant that's gone beyond it's expected life can begin to acidify which could possibly degrade some internal parts/components such as head gaskets.

Anyway, I know some of us may not always follow the service schedules to the letter, but it sounds as if the coolant system flush/replacement is pretty much mandatory for the continued health of your engine.

I'm not ducking blame here, but it still sounds to me as if there may be a growing issue with 1GR-FE engines and head gaskets as they reach 120K or so.

Well, I'll be raiding what little savings we have to pony up the $2K for the repairs. :frusty::sobbing:hwell::tsk:

I will say the truck has been solid up 'til now and I expect to get 100K more out of it after this repair.

Peace,

Rob J.

 

[Jeff T]

Rob J - I had to replace my gaskets as well. While mine was in the shop I found out Toyota "redesigned" the head gasket. Turns out they were back ordered as my Runner was in the shop almost a month.

While my truck has been probably the best vehicle I've ever owned I do believe Toyota has some responsibility in all this...

Good Luck with your 4R.

 

[vicrc]

Mine was very close to your mileage 137k. I just got mine back from the stealership it cost me $3100. They wanted another $1300 to rebuild the heads with valve seats. Wish that I could have just grab the heads and had them worked somewhere else. The best thing that I have ever done on this truck was getting it fully detailed as I hate the cleaning part and wow it looked liked a CPO and that made me happy again with my truck cost me $120 and it was every penny worth.

BTW - I never went over any maintenance required from day 1 on my new truck. I hope to get another easy 50k miles on it.

It would be nice if Toyota made some effort, even if they can at least negotiate with the dealers in capping the repair cost because the dealers can really rape you on the costs.

So IMHO I will never purchase a 4Runner with a 90k+ miles as I don't like gambling. However would prefer one that had HG replaced with even more miles on it instead.

 

[Rob J.]

I agree, it would be good if the dealers could at least put a cap on the head gasket repairs.

When I called the dealer for an estimate, the service manager would not give me a quote at all.

I mean, not even... "somewhere between $2,000-$3,000."

That makes me pretty leary. :bolt:

All the bests,

Rob J.

 

[vicrc]

I had one dealer estimate, $1700 for the tear down and that was the only estimate they can provide, however they said it can go up to $4000 and possibly $5800 with newer engine swap. I think if you know your truck has never been over heated, sure enough the heads should be okay and your only trouble is with miss firing on start up. I am starting to think that machining is really not necessary and the only problem is the HG.

Rebuilding the head completely is one way for dealers to make more money as one manager told me they mark up that work by 40 percent and they don't even do the work themselves.

 

[Jeff T]

I consider myself quite frugal (cheap) and I didn't think for a second not to have it all done right. I didn't want to be back in the same spot in a few miles.

Mine never overheated either...

 

[Mark3850]

To All, Thanks for all the great info on this! Just want to add my name to the list of 2005 4 runner, cylinder 6 mis-fire codes. Wish i would have found this site before i changed the plugs and coil pack!! Will be calling Toyota on Monday.

 

[TLC/T4R]

Another T4R with Blown Head gasket Symptoms

Started my T4R this am and found all of the symptoms above. Replaced the coil on no. 6 cylinder and no change. CEL flashing, VCS, rough idle, etc. I have 133k-way too soon to have to replace a head gasket!

Will call Toyota, but based on the other posts it seems tat they are still in denial.

 

[Calimander]

05 v6 bad head gasket

March 2012, misfire in cylinder #6,-----93,000 miles, head gaskets replaced -----$3430.00, at Lancaster Toyota Mazda in PA. Service manager said he's never seen it before(yeah right). Now at 130,000 looks like the sealed for life transmission needs some major repairs----torque converter is bad---This isn't the Toyota feeling that i'm looking for. Toyota needs to stand behind these issues or I'm going to start looking at their competition.