Are low mileage used engines readily available for ~$1,500? I just don't know anything about sourcing one of these. I have no way of doing an engine swap by myself, and I imagine the labor/additional costs involved would be at least another $1,000. With these things failing at ~150k miles, I would be hesitant to spend $2,500 on an engine with anything over 50k miles. You can spend $2,500 on a used engine with 100k miles and then have a gasket fail at 125k like some people here. If the gasket replacement is done properly, I would imagine you should be able to get another 75k-100k miles out of it, provided its in good shape and has been well maintained. Or am I being delusional?
2005 V6 Head Gasket
- Thread starter bobdod04
- Start date
Are low mileage used engines readily available for ~$1,500? I just don't know anything about sourcing one of these. I have no way of doing an engine swap by myself, and I imagine the labor/additional costs involved would be at least another $1,000. With these things failing at ~150k miles, I would be hesitant to spend $2,500 on an engine with anything over 50k miles. You can spend $2,500 on a used engine with 100k miles and then have a gasket fail at 125k like some people here. If the gasket replacement is done properly, I would imagine you should be able to get another 75k-100k miles out of it, provided its in good shape and has been well maintained. Or am I being delusional?
CookieRoe
Senior Member
thing is, does that motor (rebuilt/whatever) have the "redesigned" head gasket? If so, any worries of another failure is moot.
that's the risk. you don't know the history of that engine. you might end up spending more. having your headgasket replaced is more the smart thing to do.
Looks like you can fix this on your own. replacing a headgasket is easy. you just have to remove a lot of things and takes away your time. that is way, it is expensive due to the labor charges. if you do it, you know you did it right and is confident.
Well, I can do some stuff myself, but ripping apart an engine is not something I am able to attempt at this point. I don't have a garage or access to one, so multi day projects are out of the question as I am only able to do work out on the street. I've done full brake jobs on this thing and have done CV axles and spark plugs, but that's about as much as I am willing to do.
Anyway, quick update. I pulled the code today and it was P0304... Cylinder 4 misfire. Due to the rough starts slow loss of coolant, I am still pretty sure it's the head gasket. I reset the cel and swapped the spark plug and coil pack from one of the cylinders on the pager l passenger side bank. Figure it's worth a shot just to make sure it's not the plug or coil. I'll cold start it again in the morning to see what it does.
Anyway, quick update. I pulled the code today and it was P0304... Cylinder 4 misfire. Due to the rough starts slow loss of coolant, I am still pretty sure it's the head gasket. I reset the cel and swapped the spark plug and coil pack from one of the cylinders on the pager l passenger side bank. Figure it's worth a shot just to make sure it's not the plug or coil. I'll cold start it again in the morning to see what it does.
BlackWorksInc
New member
I just want to expand a bit on what Chmura was saying in regards to your question flighht2k5. (Strangely enough I can't seem to mention people all the sudden, says my message is too short?)
Timing Chains stretch over time, not only do the chains stretch but the timing chain gears, tensioners, and guides wear out due to metal on metal contact. Typically its good practice to have the timing chain inspected for stretching whenever you have the valve cover off (Toyota says 5yr/60k for valve clearance inspection and adjustment, but you can get away with 120k without any significant wear on the shims for the valves.) If the chain is stretched out, the repair may include all new gears, guides, tensioners, ect. which can become very costly in parts and labor.
Not to mention that unlike a timing belt motor, the front of a timing chain motor is not designed to be easily serviced (i.e. relatively easy to remove covers like the 2UZ-FE engine.) Most modern timing chain motors require the removal of the oil pan, the entire front of the engine and the valve covers; all of which then need to be cleaned and resealed with something like FIPG (Form In Place Gasket, what Toyota uses) which takes time to cure properly.
That's one of the main differences between timing chains and timing belts, while timing belts have more frequent service intervals, the timing chain work adds up quickly when they do need to be serviced (usually its around 2-3 timing belt service intervals, so about 200-300k range roughly.) They both for the most part even out in cost when the vehicle gets to that higher end mileage, the timing belts require more service more often, but the timing chains have more inherent labor and parts cost in them when they do wear out.
Timing Chains stretch over time, not only do the chains stretch but the timing chain gears, tensioners, and guides wear out due to metal on metal contact. Typically its good practice to have the timing chain inspected for stretching whenever you have the valve cover off (Toyota says 5yr/60k for valve clearance inspection and adjustment, but you can get away with 120k without any significant wear on the shims for the valves.) If the chain is stretched out, the repair may include all new gears, guides, tensioners, ect. which can become very costly in parts and labor.
Not to mention that unlike a timing belt motor, the front of a timing chain motor is not designed to be easily serviced (i.e. relatively easy to remove covers like the 2UZ-FE engine.) Most modern timing chain motors require the removal of the oil pan, the entire front of the engine and the valve covers; all of which then need to be cleaned and resealed with something like FIPG (Form In Place Gasket, what Toyota uses) which takes time to cure properly.
That's one of the main differences between timing chains and timing belts, while timing belts have more frequent service intervals, the timing chain work adds up quickly when they do need to be serviced (usually its around 2-3 timing belt service intervals, so about 200-300k range roughly.) They both for the most part even out in cost when the vehicle gets to that higher end mileage, the timing belts require more service more often, but the timing chains have more inherent labor and parts cost in them when they do wear out.
SpeedoJosh
New member
Seeing this thread is making me rethink my decision to get an early model 4th gen.
All the used ones tend to have 150k on them. Seems like I'd be adding $2-3k to the price within a couple years.
All the used ones tend to have 150k on them. Seems like I'd be adding $2-3k to the price within a couple years.
Cold start this morning went without a rough idle or cel after swapping out plug and coil with another cylinder. I didn't drive it though. I've read of other people having plugs and/or coils replaced, with the cel going away for a short period, but ultimately coming back. Since I used the same plug and coil from the #4 cylinder in cylinder #5, I would have expected to have misfire issues on cylinder #5 now. Since I am not getting that (and if I don't get that in a short while, anyway) I guess it will further support the hg failure. I am gonna hand it over to a mechanic at this point and have him look in cylinder #4 as well as do a leak down test.
zonianbrat
New member
I made a mistake getting rid of our Tahoe. I dont regret getting this t4r yet though. The Tahoe needed trannsmission work and would have needed to have an engine rebuild within the next couple years. Thing is for 5k I could have had a rebuilt dependable drivetrain that I know would have lasted years and years. I dont want to make the same mistake with this 4 runner. I'm thinking a new Tundra or a Ram might be in the not so far future. I always used to shy away from buying new as it seems like a waste of money but I am tired of the worry about what the previous owner of a used vehicle has or has not done.
wnelax04sr5
New member
this happened to me the other day, by later in the day it had stopped
if you think about all the people who have an 03-05 4runner in just the united states alone, and then how many have reported HG issues, the percentage weighs in the favor of not having an issue. it is a problem for sure that plagues these years, but nobody ever joins a forum and posts to report that they didn't have any problems
i don't know if going from a Toyota to a Chrysler product is going to help your maintenance worries....
Browsing this and other forums, there are cases of this being reported by owners of 2006 models too. I love the 4th gen, but now I am not sure I could ever be truly confident in trading up to a newer model year, as I planned to do when the time came. Something tells me that as the miles start piling up on the newer trucks, we will start setting reports of this in the newer model year 4th gens as well.
The used market is kind of nuts though. An 05 with as many miles as mine is selling for close to what I paid 4 years ago with half the milage then. Another 4th gen is most likely not in my future, when ever that may be.
The used market is kind of nuts though. An 05 with as many miles as mine is selling for close to what I paid 4 years ago with half the milage then. Another 4th gen is most likely not in my future, when ever that may be.
chmura
New member
Its funny that people are soooo paranoid about this issue that one person said he was so tired thinking about the issue and traded his 4th gen for a 2014 5th gen. Really?? Maybe its just an excuse to trade in a perfectly good car for a new one? Lots of people do this, make excuses to justify their purchase of a new car.
Many people on here need to relax and live a stress free life. Its only a car for god sake!
Many people on here need to relax and live a stress free life. Its only a car for god sake!
good to know and i understand your situation. i would have done the same thing if i don't have a garage to work on. keep on testing it until you are finally sure of the result. it could be that it's not a headgasket issue. keep us posted. i'm interested to know what is wrong.
SpeedoJosh
New member
Sure it's only a car, doesn't change the fact that I'd like to avoid spending an extra $3k on a vehicle 6-12 months after I purchase it.
I understand that it hasn't affected everyone, but everyone also isn't on this forum. Small % here compared to how many are out there. The frequency is enough for concern, enough to rule out coincidence, and point to a defective part/design.
zonianbrat
New member
wnelax04sr5. I cant seem to quote posts on my work cpu. Dodge Ram trucks are very very popular here where I live. I have a lot of friends that own them in years ranging from 04 to 2013. I've talked to them and honestly I am not too worried. I am an X-plan member so I would get a good deal and a great warranty. Toyota as of 6 months ago would not honor the X-plan. Boo on that. Before I get bashed I am still a serious Toyota fan and the looks of the new Tundra are growing on me. When it comes down to it i'll probably end up fixing my 04 if/when the head gasket fails and driving it too the ground anyway. 2-3 thousand dollars is a lot cheaper than a 40-50 thousand dollar new pickup!
wnelax04sr5
New member
if i had to choose between a ram or a tundra id go with the tundra. my college roommate has had nothing but dodge trucks his entire lift, ranging from a 1983 to a 2004. he's had good times, and bad times, lots of rust, and a LOT of electrical issues. never had a motor or trans issue, but the rest of the truck falls apart before it gets enough miles on it to worry about it
Dude.. this is not just a car. its a truck..:lalala:
Its just as bad when people trip about timing belt and waterpump replacement on the v8.. If your too concerned then look into buying a new vehicle. I just got mines used. but I am spending nitbits on alot of things. But once its done and im satisfied. I am confident that I dont need to do anything for a long time. Just like my 3rd gen that Im trying to sell.. :/
Just wanted to keep this thread updated:
I was on vacation for a week, so left the car with my mechanic... he wasn't completely convinced it was the hg, as he has never seen it express itself in such a fashion. While I was away, he left it pressured up for an entire weekend, and he said it only lost 6#... I am not sure what that means, but he said it was a VERY small leak and that it probably only weeps fluid when certain conditions are perfect during the cooling down of the engine.
I asked him to price out the repair and he came back at ~$3500, over 20 hours to do the work. I don't think he has done work/is extremely familiar with the 1GR-FE engine and was going off of a standard billing. Needless to say, I am going to have to find someone more affordable as that's more than I can justify spending. For that much, I'd rather get a warrantied job a the stealership.
If anyone has any suggestions for a shop within reasonable distance from Philly, please let me know. Thanks.
I was on vacation for a week, so left the car with my mechanic... he wasn't completely convinced it was the hg, as he has never seen it express itself in such a fashion. While I was away, he left it pressured up for an entire weekend, and he said it only lost 6#... I am not sure what that means, but he said it was a VERY small leak and that it probably only weeps fluid when certain conditions are perfect during the cooling down of the engine.
I asked him to price out the repair and he came back at ~$3500, over 20 hours to do the work. I don't think he has done work/is extremely familiar with the 1GR-FE engine and was going off of a standard billing. Needless to say, I am going to have to find someone more affordable as that's more than I can justify spending. For that much, I'd rather get a warrantied job a the stealership.
If anyone has any suggestions for a shop within reasonable distance from Philly, please let me know. Thanks.
