Redsoxx1918
New member
Most likely, the next gen 4Runner production will move to the states and prob be built alongside the tundra or taco.
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2019 6th Gen 4runner
- Thread starter RunningLife
- Start date
Most likely, the next gen 4Runner production will move to the states and prob be built alongside the tundra or taco.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
The problem is electric powertrains.
No big automakers are really thrilled to dump R&D money into new gas engines, so that's why the 3.5L is showing up in damn near everything Toyota/Lexus offers these days.
I suspect some additional tuning will get the 3.5L to about 280hp/275tq. And if they spread the torque curve just a bit wider, so that it's a hair closer to idle, that'll do the trick.
Using more super high tensile strength steel, and removing 200 lbs from the 4Runner should make the 6th gen lighter on its feet, too.
With an 8+ speed auto, it should do pretty well. The only question is how they'll manage to both lighten the truck, and keep it robust enough to handle bigger wheels/tires.
The only alternative besides a small-displacement turbo would be a last refresh on the 1GR-FE before hybrids and electrics become mandatory. I guess Toyota could maybe redo a 4.0L with dual injection....... but that's a tall order for an engine that'll likely start phasing out in 2-3 years.
No big automakers are really thrilled to dump R&D money into new gas engines, so that's why the 3.5L is showing up in damn near everything Toyota/Lexus offers these days.
I suspect some additional tuning will get the 3.5L to about 280hp/275tq. And if they spread the torque curve just a bit wider, so that it's a hair closer to idle, that'll do the trick.
Using more super high tensile strength steel, and removing 200 lbs from the 4Runner should make the 6th gen lighter on its feet, too.
With an 8+ speed auto, it should do pretty well. The only question is how they'll manage to both lighten the truck, and keep it robust enough to handle bigger wheels/tires.
The only alternative besides a small-displacement turbo would be a last refresh on the 1GR-FE before hybrids and electrics become mandatory. I guess Toyota could maybe redo a 4.0L with dual injection....... but that's a tall order for an engine that'll likely start phasing out in 2-3 years.
Battle Born Offroad
New member
The 2019 is a 5th Gen. They had them on display at SEMA
Thrasher_S
New member
I think it is very unlikely the 6th gen will have much the offroad community will consider an upgrade. Improved entertainment, probably.
Gecko
New member
For these exact reasons, I honestly think they might just put the 301hp/267lb-ft 2GR-FKS V6 in the 4Runner and Tacoma for 2020.
267lb-ft @ 4,700 RPM (Camry/Avalon)
265lb-ft @ 4,600 RPM (Tacoma)
278lb-ft @ 4,400 RPM (4Runner)
Peak torque arriving at 300rpm higher is not a significant difference in drivability, it would give us an extra 31 hp, but most importantly, an 8AT.
I'll be the first to say I'm fine with it. Now here comes everyone else saying that iteration of the 2GR-FKS is basically a high revving gutless Honda engine in...
3...
2...
1...
Bob Laublaw
New member
Following.
Looked for 6 months in 2013 (look at my join date LOL) for a TE...Couldn't make it happen. There were zero in the Gulf State Region for the better part of the year. Bought a Tundra.
I never tow enough to come close to it's capacity and I use the bed for things that would be fine in the T4R...So I'm starting my search again. Will likely buy a 4Runner in the next year or so, and am waiting to see if the 2020 will be a 6th Gen or not.
Looked for 6 months in 2013 (look at my join date LOL) for a TE...Couldn't make it happen. There were zero in the Gulf State Region for the better part of the year. Bought a Tundra.
I never tow enough to come close to it's capacity and I use the bed for things that would be fine in the T4R...So I'm starting my search again. Will likely buy a 4Runner in the next year or so, and am waiting to see if the 2020 will be a 6th Gen or not.
Daohaus
New member
other than the wheels and tires the truck was stock
CO-Cygnus
New member
I would never say that. It's a high revving gutless Camry engine. Honestly though, if they sort out the transmission to actually allow downshifts it should be fine.
Toffees
Member
I drove a 94 Firebird with GM's 160 hp v6. I think if you've never driven a car like this, you shouldn't be allowed to throw around "gutless" when describing power plants.
CO-Cygnus
New member
Pffft. My first car was an '88 Mercury Tracer that was 12+ years old at the time. 84 HP.
Toffees
Member
That's basically a low-rent Escort? It was probably half as heavy and faster than my Firebird!
CO-Cygnus
New member
Pardon me? I think you mean a high rent Escort. It was a Mercury after all. But no, it was an Escort.
4th gens ugly and weak - yeah, okay. 4ths can look clean with a lift and wheels and they have the v8 option with great power. 5th gens are dogs. thats why i searched for a clean 4th...read too many accounts of slow acceleration from the 5ths; the aerodynamics seem pretty bad on them.
Daohaus
New member
My wishlist item is a hybrid type drivetrain. Only reason is a lot of these 4r's sirens their life in stop and go traffic and having this electric boost can help with the gas. I'm probably in the minority here with regards to a hybrid option.
If they used something like Ford's layout where the electric motor is sandwiched in between the motor and transmission your can have a pretty flexible system.
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If they used something like Ford's layout where the electric motor is sandwiched in between the motor and transmission your can have a pretty flexible system.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Orc
New member
They dont really need a 6th gen. I just bought a 2019, I had a 2014 as well.
Driving other more modern brand new designs the 4Runner is so refreshing to operate. Go drive a electric rack, cvt or 9speed that feels like a cvt. Dont forget unibody with no ground clearance or low range!
No way will Toyota make a more off road rig when they have to comply with all the updated standards, cafe alone! At the minimum you will get less visibility and loose the low window sills etc. So many things are taken for granted. New stuff is always more closed in, less connected and all together the wrong direction. Even the tahoe is getting independent rear.
Driving other more modern brand new designs the 4Runner is so refreshing to operate. Go drive a electric rack, cvt or 9speed that feels like a cvt. Dont forget unibody with no ground clearance or low range!
No way will Toyota make a more off road rig when they have to comply with all the updated standards, cafe alone! At the minimum you will get less visibility and loose the low window sills etc. So many things are taken for granted. New stuff is always more closed in, less connected and all together the wrong direction. Even the tahoe is getting independent rear.
sn_85
Senior Member
I've driven the 3rd gen Tacoma's a few times and never liked it. Felt gutless and always gear hunting. I'm home for the holidays and drove my mom's RX350 with the 2GR-FKS and WOW!!! What a difference the 8 spd AT and tuning make. The RX drives smooth, doesn't gear hunt, can deliver power and torque at lower rpms, and when I press the gas it goes. There was no lag that I felt with the Tacoma. Curb weight on the RX350 is also very similar if not a tiny bit more than the Tacoma as well.
I wouldn't necessarily prefer the 2GR-FKS in the 4Runner given than it's a much heavier vehicle but they definitely screwed the pooch with it on the Tacoma. If it does come across to the 6th gen 4Runner it will need the 8 spd AT and a much better tune on it. I'd like a V8 option or maybe a twin-turbo ideally but if they could somehow get the 2GR-FKS to make enough torque, power to move a 5,000lb SUV then it wouldn't be terrible. They just really, really fk'd it up on the Tacoma.
Cymon
New member
I had the actual 87 escort as my first car. That thing never quit on me but the air intake manifold was held together with duct tape for 4 years (long story). The best thing about that car is I got out of several speeding tickets by asking the officer politely if he actually thought my vehicle could go as fast as his radar detector was reading.
You'll never get a performance 3.5L in the 4Runner. Not enough low end torque, and to get over 300hp, it has to be running on very clean decent octane fuel. That's why the Tacoma engine is a dog - it has to be detuned to deal with the types of work/conditions most Tacoma owners expect. Which means some gas that is suspect, going past the 10k mile oil changes, pulling up long grades where knock can happen unless timing is dialed way back, etc.
Toyota has taken the 3.5L about as far as it can go without either hybrid assist, or flat-out replacement.
My guess is something like a 2.0L turbo, a hybrid 3.5L standard, or something in between... like a 2.7L Turbo.
I can't see the 4Runner doing anything else at this point. If a smaller engine is used, it will surely be combined with a heavy weight-loss -- like 200-300+ lbs, by better use of steel, possibly some aluminum, and plastics.
Btw, interesting note -- Toyota has milked every ounce out of the 4.0L. When I got my 2018, I was looking at the block and heads, and noticed these weird lines in the cast aluminum. Concerned they were cracks, I googled the subject at length, and came to learn that these are just cast marks - that grow more visually obvious over the years as a carmaker re-uses the same casting molds for a very, very long time.
Ie, Toyota has been pushing the naturally aspirated 4.0L molds as fast as they can without retooling, while they reinvest elsewhere.
I thus think there's zero chance they'll update the 4.0L to dual injection or anything cool like that. They'll just dump that tooling when they make the switch.
I'm open to some other surprising powertrain... but can't see it. I guess there could be some huge surprise, like an electric supercharger, or using the 2.5T from the Mazda CX9 (Mazda and Toyota are working together lately)..... but can't really see that happening.
TLDR version: I predict a 3.5L with e-torque assist to fill in the torque gaps. So like 300 hp, and 300 torque with a smallish li-ion battery under the passenger side and 23/24 city/highway mpg, with a 4200 lb curb weight with 4wd.
Toyota has taken the 3.5L about as far as it can go without either hybrid assist, or flat-out replacement.
My guess is something like a 2.0L turbo, a hybrid 3.5L standard, or something in between... like a 2.7L Turbo.
I can't see the 4Runner doing anything else at this point. If a smaller engine is used, it will surely be combined with a heavy weight-loss -- like 200-300+ lbs, by better use of steel, possibly some aluminum, and plastics.
Btw, interesting note -- Toyota has milked every ounce out of the 4.0L. When I got my 2018, I was looking at the block and heads, and noticed these weird lines in the cast aluminum. Concerned they were cracks, I googled the subject at length, and came to learn that these are just cast marks - that grow more visually obvious over the years as a carmaker re-uses the same casting molds for a very, very long time.
Ie, Toyota has been pushing the naturally aspirated 4.0L molds as fast as they can without retooling, while they reinvest elsewhere.
I thus think there's zero chance they'll update the 4.0L to dual injection or anything cool like that. They'll just dump that tooling when they make the switch.
I'm open to some other surprising powertrain... but can't see it. I guess there could be some huge surprise, like an electric supercharger, or using the 2.5T from the Mazda CX9 (Mazda and Toyota are working together lately)..... but can't really see that happening.
TLDR version: I predict a 3.5L with e-torque assist to fill in the torque gaps. So like 300 hp, and 300 torque with a smallish li-ion battery under the passenger side and 23/24 city/highway mpg, with a 4200 lb curb weight with 4wd.
Tacoma vs T4R
Just sold my '17 Taco with a 3.5, Auto and bought '19 T4R. Big difference!! The T4R is smooth with better pickup and go. Although gas mileage is 1 MPG less, the T4R is the better truck and easier to drive. The trans on the new Taco's is just not as smooth shifting as it always shifts hard when you are coming to a stop. If the next gen T4R has a similar mechanical set-up as the 16 thru 19 Taco, then I would not buy it. Hopefully it won't!
Just sold my '17 Taco with a 3.5, Auto and bought '19 T4R. Big difference!! The T4R is smooth with better pickup and go. Although gas mileage is 1 MPG less, the T4R is the better truck and easier to drive. The trans on the new Taco's is just not as smooth shifting as it always shifts hard when you are coming to a stop. If the next gen T4R has a similar mechanical set-up as the 16 thru 19 Taco, then I would not buy it. Hopefully it won't!
Jetboy
New member
FWIW - the 4.0L 1GR block from 2010+ is not shared with the pre 2010 1GR block. So the castings are all new around 2009. The only shared parts I can find between the two are the crank shaft bearings. There may be a few more, but nearly every part is different. Reaching the 8th year of production is still a fairly long time though.
The 3.5 with proper gearing would do okay. Sometime test drive an RX350. It may change your mind about the 3.5. I also have an RX350. So I drive them back to back quite often. It's remarkable how much better the RX350 feels vs the 4Runner with very similar numbers on paper. The key is the gearing being much lower and the transmission shift logic being a bit more focused on performance than mpg. I also think the 4.0 could continue on happily with better balancing, D4S, and an 8 speed transmission. I'd buy one.
