4th gen VS. 5th gen - my thoughts

[4x4Runnr]

Nope.. they are all garbage.. Stick with your awesome 4th gen..

Most of what you feel is Toyota's super smart Eco mode throttle mapping. it's a genius idea and took the smartest engineers on the planet to come up with a throttle mapping system that would actually save fuel. If only other car companies realized this amazing fuel saving technique. Next year they plan to come up with a speedometer that reads double.. That way users will see double the MPG... All that time wasted on cylinder deactivation and direct injection... when this was the real answer all along.

Super smart eco mode isn't smart enough to make this 2wd thing get better mileage than my 11 year old V6 4x4.?!? I dug in the settings and disabled that silly green "Eco" light. WTF is that distraction supposed to do? I drive how I need/want to regardless of the nagging of the green nanny, so might as well turn her off. Currently averaging about 17.9 MPG in the '17 vs the 18.6 I get in my '06. Both are pretty poor by comparison to a lot of other cars these days.

The backup camera is pretty clutch, but so is the one on the head unit I'm putting in my '06 in a couple weeks. Might as well invest in some new technology because I think I'm gonna die before my 4Runner does - it only just did hit 85k miles.

I'm not hating on the 5th gen - it does ride nice, is tight with no rattles (just like my' 06), I'm just amazed that it compares so poorly to an 11, almost 12 year old previous gen.

 

[mrblah]

Super smart eco mode isn't smart enough to make this 2wd thing get better mileage than my 11 year old V6 4x4.?!? I dug in the settings and disabled that silly green "Eco" light. WTF is that distraction supposed to do? I drive how I need/want to regardless of the nagging of the green nanny, so might as well turn her off. Currently averaging about 17.9 MPG in the '17 vs the 18.6 I get in my '06. Both are pretty poor by comparison to a lot of other cars these days.

The backup camera is pretty clutch, but so is the one on the head unit I'm putting in my '06 in a couple weeks. Might as well invest in some new technology because I think I'm gonna die before my 4Runner does - it only just did hit 85k miles.

I'm not hating on the 5th gen - it does ride nice, is tight with no rattles (just like my' 06), I'm just amazed that it compares so poorly to an 11, almost 12 year old previous gen.

good for you.

 

[GearJunkie88]

I gave my 2008 4R sport with 75K to my dad and bought the 5th gen I have now. At first I wasn't a huge fan of the 5th gen and felt like I made a mistake getting rid of it. I drove my old 2008 a couple weekends ago. I forgot how noisy that thing was and how the suspension is so much smooshier than the stock 5th gen... lots of lean in corners and nose dive when braking (and I had replaced the entire XREAS system at 68K). As for gas mileage, I found that the dashboard MPG computer on the 4th gen wildly overestimated real MPG. So if you are basing your 4th gen MPG on that computer, you're a victim of Toyota's creative math division. Long story short: memories of my "good ol' truck" aren't nearly as accurate as I thought after driving a new truck for a few months. I don't miss that 4th gen at all... glad to be rid of it.

I'm not hating on the 5th gen - it does ride nice, is tight with no rattles (just like my' 06), I'm just amazed that it compares so poorly to an 11, almost 12 year old previous gen.

 

[JayceeP]

Where are you on vacation, [MENTION=85718]4x4Runnr[/MENTION]?

I find it hard to believe the gas mileage is crap. I rented an SR5 on the west coast and did 75-80 mph all over California and the Mojave desert in 100F+ temperatures and got 21mpg.

 

[4x4Runnr]

Where are you on vacation, [MENTION=85718]4x4Runnr[/MENTION]?

I find it hard to believe the gas mileage is crap. I rented an SR5 on the west coast and did 75-80 mph all over California and the Mojave desert in 100F+ temperatures and got 21mpg.

I'm in Destin Florida. The terrible gas mileage may be due to fairly short trips, but it's about a 45 minute trip from the airport, and I reset the fuel mileage when I got in it. Before I reset it, it showed 18.3 MPG. When I got to the resort it showed 18.0, and that was a straight shot with no side trips.

Just got back from a 20 minute trip and it improved from 17.9 to 18.1. It's just so tippy, nose-divey, and slow/lazy feeling. I guess after a week of driving it and then going home, my butt will have been recalibrated and I will get a fresh perspective on my '06.

I do have a set of Rancho RS5000 dampers on mine, which I suppose affects the ride a bit, but I've seen complaints on here about those riding too soft. At least when I hit the brakes the' 06 doesn't look down to inspect the road!

Positives on the '17 so far are it is indeed quiet, the seats are comfortable, the backup camera is nice (the screen could be bigger), it looks a lot nicer than the '10 does, and the third row seats are easy to stow to haul stuff and re-deploy if you need to haul more than 5 people.

I'm getting used to it so the stark difference I felt between it and my '06 are fading a little 3 days in. It had a full tank of gas when I picked it up, and the needle didn't move until yesterday, and now it's already showing 3/4.

Don't get me wrong - it's not that I am looking for things to nitpick - I was actually afraid that I would fall in love with it and have to get one when I found out that I would be driving a new 4Runner, but at least now I can just continue to be happy, drive my '06 and enjoy no car payment!

Sometimes I can be a little slow picking up on metaphors I am not familiar with - so what does it mean for a 4th gen to "poop gold"? The recommendation to run premium gas (which I don't), or was it being implied that the 4th gen tends to break down a lot? I have run unleaded since day one with no ill effects, and besides an 84 month "True Start" battery that died about 48 months in, and a steering rack that began to leak ps fluid at about 65k, there have been zero maintenance issues. Just personal preference stuff and a sunroof rattle fix that was easy as applying some DuraPore tape to the edge of the hole in the roof.

 

[1engineer]

Sometimes I can be a little slow picking up on metaphors I am not familiar with - so what does it mean for a 4th gen to "poop gold"?

Simple. Everyone tends to like "what they have" and criticize what they don't. It's simple human nature. Even when what they don't have is better than what they do have, they still defend what they own.

You wouldn't believe how many 4th gen owners bad mouthed the 5th gen models when they first came out. Turns out those doing the worst trash talking promptly bought the 5th gen model.

It was/still is funny. The 4th gen guys seem to think the 4th gen was a perfect vehicle. It of course is not. The phrase "poops gold" just means their vehicle is perfect in every way and nothing can be any better. Your first post in this thread fits that description.

Here's what I think is happening and will happen:
1. You had too high expectations to begin with... nothing is perfect, not even your almighty 4th gen
2. You test drove and were disappointed
3. You continue to test drive and slowly see the benefits
4. You go home, drive your old one and discover the 5th gen has a lot to offer
5. You test drive again the model you want
6. You convince yourself that it's not so bad
7. You post pictures of your new 2018 4Runner in the 5th gen section, hoping nobody remembers the criticism you gave it.

Let's see what happens.

 

[Jetboy]

I was really happy with the mpg when it was stock and unloaded. I'm pretty disappointed in the mileage as a utility vehicle. I use it more like a truck and it's not good enough mpg considering the relatively low power. With 285s it's basically a wash with a tundra with 285s - except I'm down 100+ hp/tq. and have a lot smaller vehicle. Towing basically anything and the Tundra (which is not known for good mpg) is better in most cases. The 1GR isn't fuel efficient when it's worked very hard, and it's not enough engine for the vehicle other than running empty to run at lower output. I suspect a Toyota 5.7 would also improve mileage for use as a work truck.

I never think "I wish I had more power". I always think "I wish I had more power at lower rpms so driving on the highway would be more comfortable."

Overall the 5th gen has been a nice step up from a 3rd gen. As a daily driver it's pretty good. And it'll go almost anywhere I point it off road - and do so reliably. Quite frankly I can't believe how good it is out of the box. The interior is well done overall. If I were to spec out my ideal vehicle and cost was part of the equation it would look very much like exactly what I have. The only things I would probably change would be a larger engine or re-design of the current one with a longer stroke for lower rpm hp, and I'd put ambulance doors on the back. Not a fan of the hatch - never have been. For me it's certainly better than anything else out there. A GX or LC200 stripped down to get the weight to a reasonable number could work too, but not off the showroom floor.

And - it's like a savings account on resale value, which makes it very low cost to own.

 

[Hitman]

But I can still say, with authority, that I drove my 3rd gen part time 4x4 on dry pavement (snow/dry/snow, etc) for 6 years without a problem. So for me it is a matter of using it carefully and thinking about what you are doing and using it when you need to. The opinion that "never use it on dry pavement", I just simply disagree with.

I'm guessing that you really don't understand how the 4wd system works. If you only drive straight ahead and never make a turn or drive around a bend, you'd never have an issue driving in 4wd on dry roads, simply because your wheels are turning at the same speed. Once you start making turns, the wheels turn at different speeds, which requires a differential to stop the tires from scrubbing as they take different arcs. The 4th gen has a center differential that allows it to be used as a fulltime 4wd system on any road surface. The V6 engines are paired with a 2wd mode. The V8 engines are strictly full-time 4wd, but they both have center diffs that can be locked. Now if you try to drive in 4wd with the center diff locked on dry roads, you're asking for trouble because you don't get the differential action (remember--locked center diff) and the tires can't slip easily on the road because it's dry. So yeah, you're going to cause excess wear on your tires and excess wear on your transfer case and eventually you'll probably end up breaking something because you're using the 4wd system in a way that is definitely not intended. Your owner's manual explains this on ANY 4wd suv and explains when and when not to engage 4wd and/or any diff locks.

 

[Hitman]

Simple. Everyone tends to like "what they have" and criticize what they don't. It's simple human nature. Even when what they don't have is better than what they do have, they still defend what they own.

You wouldn't believe how many 4th gen owners bad mouthed the 5th gen models when they first came out. Turns out those doing the worst trash talking promptly bought the 5th gen model.

It was/still is funny. The 4th gen guys seem to think the 4th gen was a perfect vehicle. It of course is not. The phrase "poops gold" just means their vehicle is perfect in every way and nothing can be any better. Your first post in this thread fits that description.

Here's what I think is happening and will happen:
1. You had too high expectations to begin with... nothing is perfect, not even your almighty 4th gen
2. You test drove and were disappointed
3. You continue to test drive and slowly see the benefits
4. You go home, drive your old one and discover the 5th gen has a lot to offer
5. You test drive again the model you want
6. You convince yourself that it's not so bad
7. You post pictures of your new 2018 4Runner in the 5th gen section, hoping nobody remembers the criticism you gave it.

Let's see what happens.

That describes me, except for the ending. I never liked the 5th gen from day one, mostly because of the styling. But I tried to look past that and considered one. I even test drove one. Then I didn't like it because of the way it drove. It felt heavier and clumsy compared to the 4th gen. It had crazy nose dive under hard braking. It leaned like a boat on highway offramps (I have a Sport Edition, so XREAS is what I'm used to). The throttle response was horrible. So yeah, after all these years I'm still holding out for the 6th gen. But honestly, I'm ready for something new. I want to get another 4Runner. But Toyota is dragging it's ass, so I'm probably going to skip the 4Runner and buy something else entirely because I'm tired of waiting and my 4th gen is starting to really rot away underneath. I see a Jeep in my future.

 

[007Tacoma]

Sometimes I can be a little slow picking up on metaphors I am not familiar with - so what does it mean for a 4th gen to "poop gold"?

That was me trying to whip up some sarcasm while having some whiskey last night. I shouldn't be allowed to drink and Internet... Sorry about that.

I will say: I don't like the 5th Gen stock suspension because of the nose dives, but I also haven't fronted the money to upgrade it in the past 72,000 miles. So, it isn't exactly that bad... I guess...

 

[oljedi11950]

We have both & share common traits that I like in both , that said to each as they say ! Lucky live in the desert & we don't see the failures as some in midwest & east where road conditions wreak havoc on frames & brake calipers ! My only ***** about 4th & this is after seating in 5th are the seats ! There are good & bad in all the gens imo ! 5th gen is a motorized box but with better suspension I'm happy so get over yourselves ! Both great vehicles nuff said

 

[4x4Runnr]

1Engineer - thanks for the assessment - you're right on most of your points, but I don't think my 4th gen is "almighty", and I'm not one of the fanboys who think that the 4th gen is the ultimate 4x4 ever made. I HATED the looks of the 2010 model when it came out. I expected that it would grow on me, but it never did. The incremental styling changes have finally made the front appeal to me, and the rear is still very boxy, but somehow not as unappealing as it was to me before. You're right - I was expecting a lot more. The nose dive and lack of acceleration are the two things I dislike most. A nice set of HD Bilstein dampers would probably help, and if I owned this thing, would be installed yesterday. Don't know what the solution to the lack of power would be except a blower.

As far as thinking the 4th gen is perfect, it is not. After all the years driving it, here is an incomplete list of my perceived faults in/with it:

-Almost too small inside
-Third row seating is a joke/Rube Goldberg device
-"Hit from behind" slip yoke issue
-Overly aggressive back to front rake (I guess as an overreaction to the 3rd gen ass sag). Fixed that with a set of Moog replacement springs and a torch
-Bad gas mileage overall
-Seat warmers kind of weak
-Leather is not as supple as I would like
-That horrid metal grinding sound when you steer to full lock and drive over a bump or something in the road /parking lot /driveway (I've just been too tired /lazy to put grease on the offending steering limits)
-There is only one 12V outlet up front
-Oh yeah - forgot that useless compartment that opens that is just below the climate controls. What's that for? Business cards?

Jetboy - I had a 2007 Tundra 5.7 that got better mileage than my 4th gen. My in-laws have an '09 2wd V6 that gets around 23 MPG, so all that weight in 4x4 equipment really has an impact.

Guess I'll be waiting to see/drive a 6th gen and go from there.

 

[4FL]

Nice review. This is my first 4r, and that is due to the fact this is the first one I could actually fit in (I am tall, but not abnormal).

Years ago I looked at a 3rd gen to buy, and could not fit in it due to the seat not going back far enough.

Later, I looked at a 4th gen and the seat still did not go back far enough, ok for around town, but anything over an hour would be torture.

5th gen come out, I go an sit in one (though could not afford it at the time), and boom, seat room is great (I think that is when I joined the forum).

It was another few years before I could afford one, but got mine site unseen, bought it before it was even delivered to the dealer.

 

[1engineer]

1Engineer - thanks for the assessment - you're right on most of your points, but I don't think my 4th gen is "almighty", and I'm not one of the fanboys who think that the 4th gen is the ultimate 4x4 ever made. I HATED the looks of the 2010 model when it came out. I expected that it would grow on me, but it never did. The incremental styling changes have finally made the front appeal to me, and the rear is still very boxy, but somehow not as unappealing as it was to me before. You're right - I was expecting a lot more. The nose dive and lack of acceleration are the two things I dislike most. A nice set of HD Bilstein dampers would probably help, and if I owned this thing, would be installed yesterday. Don't know what the solution to the lack of power would be except a blower.

As far as thinking the 4th gen is perfect, it is not. After all the years driving it, here is an incomplete list of my perceived faults in/with it:

-Almost too small inside
-Third row seating is a joke/Rube Goldberg device
-"Hit from behind" slip yoke issue
-Overly aggressive back to front rake (I guess as an overreaction to the 3rd gen ass sag). Fixed that with a set of Moog replacement springs and a torch
-Bad gas mileage overall
-Seat warmers kind of weak
-Leather is not as supple as I would like
-That horrid metal grinding sound when you steer to full lock and drive over a bump or something in the road /parking lot /driveway (I've just been too tired /lazy to put grease on the offending steering limits)
-There is only one 12V outlet up front

Jetboy - I had a 2007 Tundra 5.7 that got better mileage than my 4th gen. My in-laws have an '09 2wd V6 that gets around 23 MPG, so all that weight in 4x4 equipment really has an impact.

Guess I'll be waiting to see/drive a 6th gen and go from there.

Do you still have the rental? If so, take it out and just floor it from a stop. It has the same 0-60 times as most other v6 vehicles and only a few tenths slower than the 4.6. The difference is where in the curve you get your power. Once you get over 3K rpm and through 4.5K it pulls strong. Also drive it in S mode a bit. If you have turned it in already go to a dealer and do the same. It will surprise you. Good luck.

 

[MattAK]

I've driven my dad's '06 V8 Sport quite a bit. I'd say I like everything about my 5th gen more except going from the V8 in his to the V6 in mine makes me sad inside. That extra torque in the 2UZ + less weight makes all the difference.

 

[wfo9]

Super smart eco mode isn't smart enough to make this 2wd thing get better mileage than my 11 year old V6 4x4.

I was joking..being a smart ass..... You can't turn the ECO throttle mapping off on the 5th gen. You can turn it off on the Parados, which are sold overseas with the same motor....

You can only turn the light off on the US models, which does nothing to the actual throttle response. The throttle is unresponsive on purpose (Toyota felt it would improve mpg in this mode).... You have to learn how to drive around it. Smash it to the floor and it moves good. But it is a horrible driving experience at first, since the first 50% of travel is not what you would expect from driving other cars. It is the number 1 mistake on the 5th gen, but people still buy them.

I have an 08 FJ and it feels amazing to drive compared to the 5th gen, but the 5th gen actually has just as good acceleration... Perceptions are everything....

There is a device you can buy to fix the issue called a sprint booster, but you should not have to.

 

[depth]

nice review

 

[Throwback]

It's funny to me when people complain about the perceived lack of power in a big heavy non-aerodynamic four wheel drive SUV with a V6. Maybe a set of dual Flowmasters with big chrome tips out back would at least make it sound like it's fast.

That aside, to me the 5th Gen 4Runner is about the perfect contemporary SUV - meaning that it's about as close to an old Bronco, Blazer, or original Jeep Cherokee as you can buy these days.

 

[007Tacoma]

It's funny to me when people complain about the perceived lack of power in a big heavy non-aerodynamic four wheel drive SUV with a V6. Maybe a set of dual Flowmasters with big chrome tips out back would at least make it sound like it's fast.

That aside, to me the 5th Gen 4Runner is about the perfect contemporary SUV - meaning that it's about as close to an old Bronco, Blazer, or original Jeep Cherokee as you can buy these days.

It is still faster than my Scout II was/is/dunno... :hiding:

 

[4x4Runnr]

Will do. I have it until Saturday. Thanks for your input.